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Post by Rifleman Lizard on Oct 12, 2012 22:10:08 GMT
*sigh*
Time for a break I think. Forums have drained me lately. Catch ya later, fellas.
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Post by stickem on Oct 12, 2012 22:15:03 GMT
Martin Luther Kuya Classic
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Kuya
Registered
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Post by Kuya on Oct 12, 2012 22:36:36 GMT
It was meant to be as offensive as Marc intended his quoted comment to be. If you aren't offended by his comment (I wasn't, hence the hyperbole humor I did in response), you shouldn't be offended by mine. Since Marc wasn't trying to be offensive, nor was I. We're poking fun at each other. Panties, un-bunch them.
Also notice I've already reprimanded and spoke out against Ryan Sword. They falsely advertised something and sent a customer something not as promised/listed. That's a huge failure as a business and as a person to me.
See? Stickem got the joke.
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Post by william m on Oct 12, 2012 22:54:12 GMT
Blimey...Kuya? OK I think im going to bow out of this thread as well.. don't feed the trolls and all that. I do want to say however, that awful cheap swords can get good reviews simply because the reviewer doesn't know what makes a good sword and how to recognise cheap junk. This kind of person is more likely than a well informed collector to buy a rubbish sword, and thus post a good review. I am sure that when I started collecting years back, I probably gave a glowing review on my stainless steel marto wakizashi. Moral of the story: Take positive reviews of ryan swords and other pos with a pinch of salt, as it is very much likely that the reviewer is a novice and thus uninformed. The best reviews are from collectors with a well rounded collection. Right im out.
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Marc Kaden Ridgeway
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Retired Global Moderator
Awful lot of leaving and joining going on here for me .... And gosh I can't recall doing a bit of i
Posts: 8,778
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Post by Marc Kaden Ridgeway on Oct 12, 2012 23:59:54 GMT
I gotta be honest with you Kuya ... Your quest for knowledge and truth maybe noble , and I can respect that, but not enough to do your research for you. Most of these things are out there to find . Dupe accounts on SBG were deleted of course . Some of this info was only accessible to administrators on the old forum. However there is still tons of evidence anecdotal and otherwise on the old boards.
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Post by bloodwraith on Oct 13, 2012 0:49:00 GMT
Being one of the old guard around here and having been on this forum since its inception and seen a lot of bullsemprini surrounding ryansword, my advice is to avoid them like the plague. Don't listen to people who want to defend them, they don't know what they are talking about. If there is a bandwagon for people who dislike ryansword then I am proud to be on it, though it might surprise you that in the early days I defended them until a whole heap of information came to light along with pictures and other evidence. I think the one that really got me was the bolt holding one katana together and hidden under the kashira I believe it was, someone can feel free to correct me, I sometimes get the terms mixed up.
Too long? I'll simplify, avoid ryansword like the plague.
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Sébastien
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Posts: 2,967
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Post by Sébastien on Oct 13, 2012 0:54:19 GMT
Hello Bloodwratih, nice to see you again Yeah, I too remember that ''bolted'' katana. Wiwingti made a clip of it many years ago. Many jaws just dropped that day.
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Post by nddave on Oct 13, 2012 1:03:32 GMT
here's my take on it. I don't necessarily see cheaper swords as junk just because their cheap. I also don't see expensive swords as great just because their expensive. a lot of speculation from the buyer fits this criteria.
what I look at as a buyer isn't necessarily price but rather what materials are used, how well their used in construction, and how credited the seller/maker is in the open market.
in regards to the term "good enough for the price" william pointed out. I own two sub $100 japanese swords right now, both I reviewed here too. they are the musashi dh shirakawa. and the sna master park ninja-to bohi version. in my reviews I, like most reviews here pointed out the good and bad. and my closing comments were, good for the price.
this was an opinion based on a comparative opinion between them and other swords I purchased or handled in the same categories. for example I based my opinions on the sna vs the practical hanwei ninja. and the musashi vs a hanwei practical and a 1045 chinatana type I bought for around $75 dollars.
my opinions vs the ninja swords were hanwei won in the asthetics. the sna won in regards to handling,balance, and construction. the blade durability was n/a because I never actually cut with the hanwei. but the 1065 th blade of the sna I can testify is very durable and a well made blade. though the life of the sna saya was short lived and as mentioned in the review is pretty crappy. really in my opinion the sna beat the hanwei as a sword but failed in certain departments like asasthetic appeal and possibly saya durability. this is a opinion that was also based on price of $95(sna) vs $200 (hanwei). so technically for the price, the sna is a better overall sword.
I drew the same type of conclusions when regarding the musashi vs hanwei practical. the practical has an edge over the musashi regarding blade durability. but the musashi has an edge regarding construction, materials used (basically ito, tsukamaki) and a better made saya. so basically in my initial opinion of the musashi. for the price it beats the hanwei as a overall package, but loses out in durability. and regarding the $80 vs $250, I honestly feel you get more for your dollar with the musashi. honestly I'd love a hanwei practical blade housed in a musashi tsuka and saya. that'd be better worth $250 in my opinion.
finally we get to the heart of the thread which I feel is seller/ manufacturer credibility and integrity. I bought both ninja and musashi from sna. a well regarded business. I bought my hanwei practical from a not so well regarded mall shop. but at least I was able to handle and inspect my purchase. hanwei and musashi are both well regarded manufacturers. this is why I chose to buy these swords and use said website. if they did not have good credentials or integrity as businesses, I wouldn't have bought from them.
ebay sellers like ryan haven't shown much integrity, and as so their credentials have dissolved over the years. this is why most including me won't even give them a chance.
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Post by bloodwraith on Oct 13, 2012 1:15:07 GMT
Another old saying comes to mind which I think is highly applicable here "it doesn't matter how much you polish a turd, it is still a turd." The reason I think this is applicable is because everything I know about ryansword, from their products to the way they do business is extremely turd like.
Nice to see you too Sebastien
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Post by nddave on Oct 13, 2012 1:53:29 GMT
good point. regarding turds another perspective from a buyers point of view I follow is, "if you smell bullsemprini. watch your step and check your shoes."
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 13, 2012 7:49:04 GMT
Oh goodness Kuya, just read all the old reviews, I did my research reading these forums for hours on end when I fisrt started and benefited from the informed opinions and truthful facts from those who have way more experience than me, and as a result I thankfully have never bought a bad sword, been very happy with every purchase. If you don't listen to to the voice of those who have walked the path before you, then you're doomed to make all the same mistakes all over again. There's a saying, a smart man learns from his mistakes, a wise man learns from the mistakes of others. Time to wise up!
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Post by William Swiger on Oct 13, 2012 8:20:44 GMT
Agreed - people need look at the old forum and this forum and research if they want to see past postings on needed information. The moderators cannot be expected to do that for the members.
Some sellers and some models have a less than stellar reputation. This is based not on a general dislike but from people actually purchasing the products and voicing their opinions of the products. This has been posted on various forums and indicates their have been problems with the seller or certain swords. Some companies will fix these problems and move on like Hanwei as done on a couple models (Antiqued Bastard Sword). Some companies/sellers remain hit or miss.
The point is to put it out there for our members to make the best possible choice when searching for a new sword.
I have always said if you buy a sword and like it, then be happy with it. Just don't expect everyone to like everything you do. You can post what you like or dislike about it but don't expect everyone to agree and don't take offense. I have bought some lower end and higher end swords that I did not like but a majority of members thought they were just great. I have a few swords that did not get great reviews but I like them. All that matters is YOU like or dislike the swords. It is a personal thing.
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Post by ineffableone on Oct 13, 2012 8:35:23 GMT
Yep even if it is coprolite (fossilized feces) like this topic sort of is. It was dead and buried long ago, now people are digging it up and trying to polish it, but it is still a turd.
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Post by ineffableone on Oct 13, 2012 9:01:17 GMT
A great example of low experience/knowledge reviews, go visit Trueswords (or other vendors who offer SLOs and have customer reviews) some time and check out the reviews for the cheap SLO's.
Here is a great example for a $25 carbon steel blunt bladed katana.
This is a not full tang sword, not sharpened for a good reason, yet some idiot thinks he can just accusharp a $25 SLO and have a real functional katana because it looks like a real sword and is made of carbon steel.
From the same sword another review
And of course all these people putting out praises for these SLO swords are giving 4-5 stars out of 5 stars. There is lots more I could quote but you get the idea.
Seriously if your ever up for a good laugh and a bit of a cry for the stupidity of humanity wander through some of the reviews of cheap SLOs sometime.
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Post by Alfacentori on Oct 13, 2012 9:34:06 GMT
I think people need to chill out in this thread. Members should not be falling out and getting genuinely bitter or personal over what is largely a subjective matter. I don't know anything about Ryan Sword. Do I think that a seller creating fake accounts to push their products and giving poor service is acceptable? No, and this is the sort of thing that new people to the sub $300 sword market (like me) need to know.
Does this mean you cannot buy a 'good' cheap sword? No, it just means you go with proven recommended sellers, or else be prepared to take a bit of a gamble, neither is a bad thing if you know and accept what you are doing.
Someone like Ryan Swords probably sells, and has sold, 1000's of swords, I'm sure many customers are perfectly happy, but clearly some aren't. That might well be a risk with buying a sword at the low end where they are all invariably built to a price and mass produced with somewhat lax quality control.
The difference is in the customer service you can expect from seller to seller, not necessarily the quality point, although no doubt this varies as well. The point is this is not a topic to get heated over, all opinions and experiences are equally valid, and varied views, as long as they are genuine and informed, are all welcome and worthy of consideration.
This is not worth falling out over.
My 0.02c
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Post by Kumdoalan on Oct 13, 2012 12:04:01 GMT
I read your words and found myself interested in supporting your point of view by sending you some good karma! Good post Alfacentori! I will send you a PM with my own views of this topic and some reflections I have about this forum.
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Post by Jussi Ekholm on Oct 13, 2012 13:31:11 GMT
Heh, I guess I sometimes can't word my thoughts properly. Or they might not be presented in a way I intend them to be, I could draw the foreign language card, but I have the same problem in Finnish forums too, it's hard to speculate if people really understood what you actually meant... Personally I think all this talk about Ryanswords is probably giving the company just some visitors to their website, as I see that we here in this forum (or any other swordforum) are not the main buyers of these products. I have been checking their site out of curiosity couple times because of these threads. I'm just hoping that we will have good chatting here. I thought I'd never say this but I've actually thought of buying a Ryansword once or twice during few last months... I've seen some of their bad history, but these upcoming threads have sparked a small intrest in me, what if? Like I said to me they seem just like a generic vendor of regular Chinese-made katana, pretty much the same quality than others in that price range have. But there is a big but... I have the same reason on not buying a sword by them, that applies to dozen or so other Chinese vendors, to me their quality isn't worth their asking price. When I see even from the couple pictures that I'm not going to be happy with that 250$ sword, I'll pass it. There are products in that range that I know will satisfy me, therefore I usually would go for those. On many threads recently the general point on Ryansword to my understanding has been that they are fairly ok swords for the (usually small amount) money invested. Unfortunately threads on this vendor stir a lot of talk bit unrelevant to the product, and the result is usually not good. This had some talk of their quality: viewtopic.php?f=32&t=10790I'm not saying their products are good or bad, just that for me they aren't worth buying. Granted there are probably only handful of production swords that I'd pay the retail price, and most of them are in the lower range. That's why I usually hunt used/discounted/damaged production swords, because that offers the money vs. quality ratio I'm after. Shady dealings are always shady dealings, that may pass once or twice, but on continuous basis it will ruin you sooner or later. Poor customer service might also work once or twice, but then it's going to be downhill for your business. Personally I like Fred Chen stuff, so I tried to purchase a big batch of factory 2nds from Cold Steel. Never getting any replies to my emails and as you cannot make international orders straight on, I decided that I will spend my money elsewhere, and I do remember each good and bad customer service event for a long time, so it'll be their loss in my book . If Ryansword gives people bad service & products, the majority might think like me. But there are 1000's of new collectors who are intrested in swords, and look eBay for possible purchases. So as long as their advertising & products appeal to this target group, they'll do fine for several years at least. I've read about the bad service by Ryansword but as I have no personal experience with them, I cannot comment on it. However the little that I've been in contact with Chinese vendors for custom stuff, the service has always been excellent, but... we have not been on the same page. Or at least that's what I've understood, that they have not understood me. Therefore I've never made a purchase from any of them. As for false advertising, that's so common I'll just skip right over it. I mean how many 100's of Chinese made production katana are selling for 100-500$'s on eBay at any given moment. Of course you'll have to market your product hard, even harder when 90% of the offerings are very much alike. Heck the more I get involved in these Ryansword threads the more I'm tempted to try and buy one of their mid-range blades, I see some fairly decent offerings there. You may call it curiosity or stupidity, but it's getting more and more tempting. The reason in me just keeps saying why buy a product that'll most likely disappoint me, but the good thing is the very small sword market in Finland, so I'll most likely find a buyer for it in here. I'm already planning ahead trying to minimize the losses for a possible (although still bit unlikely) purchase.
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Post by Kumdoalan on Oct 13, 2012 13:42:00 GMT
I will send you a Private Message ....
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Sébastien
Senior Forumite
Retired Moderator
Posts: 2,967
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Post by Sébastien on Oct 13, 2012 16:15:23 GMT
Jussi, I don't know how you came to that understanding, but most of the people that I saw give feedback of their Ryansword, on this forum, said they were mediocre (not even decent) and overpriced products. When they weren't downright poorly-made pieces of cr*p.
If some people think about buying from RS because of threads like this, so be it. Frankly, I think these people would be well advised to read the posts and spend some time searching the old forum before taking the plunge.
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Post by nddave on Oct 13, 2012 17:46:03 GMT
I have to go with sebastien here. I can be put in the category of never bought one, but wont because of poor reviews. Most could think my opinion invalid, but my opinion is based on views and experiences of my peers. Most of who look for the same types of qualities regarding the swords we purchase. I respect their opinions and take their point of views into consideration when purchasing myself.
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