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Post by Adventurer'sBlade on Feb 7, 2020 1:29:54 GMT
Haven't you all learned by now you can't tell the kid anything. You are wasting your time. It's not for the kid, it's for anyone else fool enough to cut with a $60 Chinese shirasaya.
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Post by Adventurer'sBlade on Feb 7, 2020 1:31:18 GMT
There are two reasons not to cut with the Shirasaya, right? The first is that the unwrapped grip can be slippery. This can be fixed with nothing but grip tape. The second is tang-to-grip integrity. This epoxied musha will PROBABLY be fine, but I only see one small pin in the grip... I would drill at least two more holes through the grip and tang and epoxy two more brass pins in. The chance of failure as-is may be low while cutting bottles, but the consequences could be severe if the single pin breaks. Two solid bamboo mekugi are considered the standard for practitioners cutting blades. Before each and every cutting session the mekugi are to be inspected and ensured secure. I see one on the Musha, and it looks untrustworthy.
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Post by Lord Newport on Feb 7, 2020 1:45:46 GMT
Haven't you all learned by now you can't tell the kid anything. You are wasting your time. It's not for the kid, it's for anyone else fool enough to cut with a $60 Chinese shirasaya. ^^^^ This!
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reptaronice1
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Post by reptaronice1 on Feb 7, 2020 7:08:34 GMT
You can also use the cog icon to "Select Post" on each post you want to quote, then click on "Reply" at the bottom of the thread to have them all quoted automatically in one post. Thanks mok Haven't you all learned by now you can't tell the kid anything. You are wasting your time. Funny that a lot are actually agreeing with me because of the fact it is epoxied. Go troll someone else’s post before I report you
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reptaronice1
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Post by reptaronice1 on Feb 7, 2020 7:09:45 GMT
Haven't you all learned by now you can't tell the kid anything. You are wasting your time. It's not for the kid, it's for anyone else fool enough to cut with a $60 Chinese shirasaya. It’s perfectly safe to cut with. You guys are really over analyzing this.
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reptaronice1
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Post by reptaronice1 on Feb 7, 2020 7:10:28 GMT
Two solid bamboo mekugi are considered the standard for practitioners cutting blades. Before each and every cutting session the mekugi are to be inspected and ensured secure. I see one on the Musha, and it looks untrustworthy. I’ve beaten on that pin with a hammer and it doesn’t budge. I’ll agree to disagree that this is perfectly safe to use
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reptaronice1
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Post by reptaronice1 on Feb 7, 2020 7:12:36 GMT
You guys are all blowing this waaay out of proportion. This is meant for cutting water bottles and pool noodles. This is epoxied into the tsuka and has an epoxied mekugi added. Can’t get much safer than that! This is a perfect light cutter that will work well for its intended use. Anyone who is cutting bamboo with a 1045 katana is insane.
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Post by bradc on Feb 7, 2020 9:12:42 GMT
You guys are all blowing this waaay out of proportion. This is meant for cutting water bottles and pool noodles. This is epoxied into the tsuka and has an epoxied mekugi added. Can’t get much safer than that! This is a perfect light cutter that will work well for its intended use. Anyone who is cutting bamboo with a 1045 katana is insane. I think you may be taking some things personally where many people genuinely don't want to see anyone get hurt. (you or others) As MOK said "the bare wood doesn't give a good grip" Epoxy inside won't fix that, redmichael mentioned grip tape might. So maybe consider some modifications or adjust your practice such that if the sword were to slip from your hand it won't go anywhere problematic. Remember this is a public forum, so maybe you are practicing in the safest way possible with light targets, constant inspections of the sword, and precautions around flying blades. But someone with less experience could read this and think "Hey I can cut with shirasaya, that guy said it is safe". Maybe they might apply that advice to a different model. We need to all think about that reader when something gets immortalized on a forum. I'm glad you like your swords. Just please stay safe. Typing on forums needs all the fingers you can keep
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reptaronice1
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Post by reptaronice1 on Feb 7, 2020 9:16:52 GMT
You guys are all blowing this waaay out of proportion. This is meant for cutting water bottles and pool noodles. This is epoxied into the tsuka and has an epoxied mekugi added. Can’t get much safer than that! This is a perfect light cutter that will work well for its intended use. Anyone who is cutting bamboo with a 1045 katana is insane. I think you may be taking some things personally where many people genuinely don't want to see anyone get hurt. (you or others) As MOK said "the bare wood doesn't give a good grip" Epoxy inside won't fix that, another person mentioned grip tape might. So maybe consider some modifications or adjust your practice such that if the sword were to slip from your hand it won't go anywhere problematic. Remember this is a public forum, so maybe you are practicing in the safest way possible with light targets, constant inspections of the sword, and precautions around flying blades. But someone with less experience could read this and think "Hey I can cut with shirasaya, that guy said it is safe". Maybe they might apply that advice to a different model. We need to all think about that reader when something gets immortalized on a forum. I'm glad you like your swords. Just please stay safe. Typing on forums needs all the fingers you can keep Makes sense personally no I would not recommend doing this with ANY other type of shirasaya as this is the only one I have used and can tell you after beating on the pin with a solid steel hammer it is solid. If you want a better grip just wrap it in tape like you said. I never use it for more than like 10 mins so my hands don’t sweat to bad but it would be a pain with sweat.
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Post by Lord Newport on Feb 7, 2020 9:28:30 GMT
I think you may be taking some things personally where many people genuinely don't want to see anyone get hurt. (you or others) As MOK said "the bare wood doesn't give a good grip" Epoxy inside won't fix that, another person mentioned grip tape might. So maybe consider some modifications or adjust your practice such that if the sword were to slip from your hand it won't go anywhere problematic. Remember this is a public forum, so maybe you are practicing in the safest way possible with light targets, constant inspections of the sword, and precautions around flying blades. But someone with less experience could read this and think "Hey I can cut with shirasaya, that guy said it is safe". Maybe they might apply that advice to a different model. We need to all think about that reader when something gets immortalized on a forum. I'm glad you like your swords. Just please stay safe. Typing on forums needs all the fingers you can keep Makes sense personally no I would not recommend doing this with ANY other type of shirasaya as this is the only one I have used and can tell you after beating on the pin with a solid steel hammer it is solid. If you want a better grip just wrap it in tape like you said. I never use it for more than like 10 mins so my hands don’t sweat to bad but it would be a pain with sweat. Attachments:
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reptaronice1
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Post by reptaronice1 on Feb 7, 2020 9:36:58 GMT
Makes sense personally no I would not recommend doing this with ANY other type of shirasaya as this is the only one I have used and can tell you after beating on the pin with a solid steel hammer it is solid. If you want a better grip just wrap it in tape like you said. I never use it for more than like 10 mins so my hands don’t sweat to bad but it would be a pain with sweat.
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Post by RufusScorpius on Feb 7, 2020 15:11:24 GMT
I've always understood the Shirasaya to be the Japanese equivalent of our modern plastic clam-shell packaging. It's meant for shipping the blade, and when the customer takes possession of it, the sword is then sent to get finish work done by the various specialists and ultimately returned as a proper finished product. The Shirasaya is then kept in storage in case the blade needs to go back to a polisher or whatever in the future, or it can get tossed out since it no longer really has a function. It was never intended to be a permanent part of the sword.
However, it's always wrong to say "never", because there is no doubt that somebody,somewhere, was short on money but needed a sword and did some work to the Shirasaya to make it more permanent. I will say that this is NOT recommended for safety reasons. If nothing else, the sword does NOT have a tsuba- and that will allow the hand to slide forward onto the blade and could result in a very nasty injury. Even if the handle is tight, I wouldn't use it like it is- it's far to dangerous to the user.
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Post by randomnobody on Feb 7, 2020 16:28:52 GMT
Sometimes I wonder if people done for a little too fixated on hand slippage. Katana, especially, are largely slashing weapons and very seldom employ thrusts. There are tanto, I'm thinking yoroi-doshi specifically, designed expressly for stabbing, with little to no tsuba at all; many with no ito, either. My understanding is these are used in a particular grip that reduces (maybe even removes entirely) the possibility of a hand slip.
Lots of swords and knives have no hand guards, or very small hand guards. There are people who think a typical tsuba is far too small to be safe.
In general, I figure the most typical motion you're making with your sword will be pulling, not pushing, so I don't see any problems with a firm grip sliding forward. Besides, people are squishy. They don't really resist a sharp point very well. It's not like you're trying to bore through a cement wall when you stab a person.
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reptaronice1
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Post by reptaronice1 on Feb 7, 2020 16:36:40 GMT
I've always understood the Shirasaya to be the Japanese equivalent of our modern plastic clam-shell packaging. It's meant for shipping the blade, and when the customer takes possession of it, the sword is then sent to get finish work done by the various specialists and ultimately returned as a proper finished product. The Shirasaya is then kept in storage in case the blade needs to go back to a polisher or whatever in the future, or it can get tossed out since it no longer really has a function. It was never intended to be a permanent part of the sword. However, it's always wrong to say "never", because there is no doubt that somebody,somewhere, was short on money but needed a sword and did some work to the Shirasaya to make it more permanent. I will say that this is NOT recommended for safety reasons. If nothing else, the sword does NOT have a tsuba- and that will allow the hand to slide forward onto the blade and could result in a very nasty injury. Even if the handle is tight, I wouldn't use it like it is- it's far to dangerous to the user. I have a T10 blade in a buffalo horn shirasaya that looks amazing but I would get it mounted if I was going to use it. The buffalo horn shirasaya is nice for storing it on display though
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reptaronice1
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Post by reptaronice1 on Feb 7, 2020 16:37:45 GMT
Sometimes I wonder if people done for a little too fixated on hand slippage. Katana, especially, are largely slashing weapons and very seldom employ thrusts. There are tanto, I'm thinking yoroi-doshi specifically, designed expressly for stabbing, with little to no tsuba at all; many with no ito, either. My understanding is these are used in a particular grip that reduces (maybe even removes entirely) the possibility of a hand slip. Lots of swords and knives have no hand guards, or very small hand guards. There are people who think a typical tsuba is far too small to be safe. In general, I figure the most typical motion you're making with your sword will be pulling, not pushing, so I don't see any problems with a firm grip sliding forward. Besides, people are squishy. They don't really resist a sharp point very well. It's not like you're trying to bore through a cement wall when you stab a person. I agree with this.
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Post by RufusScorpius on Feb 7, 2020 17:18:53 GMT
I would have to disagree with the limited thrust capabilities of the katana. It is used to thrust- not as much as it is for cutting, but thrusting is a legitimate and functional use of the blade.
Let's assume you only thrust 2% of the time. That doesn't sound like much- but in that 2% your hand slips down the blade and opens up the palm of you hand. Now that 2% matters more than the other 98. It' rather like having a fire extinguisher in the house- you many only need it once in 30 years- but that one time you are sure glad it was there.
I would never use a Shirasaya for a functional sword any more than I would use a fixed blade knife that had no thumb guard. I still say a katana without a tsuba is too dangerous to use.
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reptaronice1
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Post by reptaronice1 on Feb 7, 2020 17:41:45 GMT
I would have to disagree with the limited thrust capabilities of the katana. It is used to thrust- not as much as it is for cutting, but thrusting is a legitimate and functional use of the blade. Let's assume you only thrust 2% of the time. That doesn't sound like much- but in that 2% your hand slips down the blade and opens up the palm of you hand. Now that 2% matters more than the other 98. It' rather like having a fire extinguisher in the house- you many only need it once in 30 years- but that one time you are sure glad it was there. I would never use a Shirasaya for a functional sword any more than I would use a fixed blade knife that had no thumb guard. I still say a katana without a tsuba is too dangerous to use. Guess it comes down to opinion
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Post by RufusScorpius on Feb 7, 2020 17:48:55 GMT
Maybe. But it's my opinion that I cannot ethically recommend using a katana with only the shirasaya for it's fittings.
Nor can I stop anybody from doing so if they wish. I can only share my advice, whether anybody follows it or not is a personal decision on their part.
The chance that something will go wrong is low, but if it does it will be catastrophic. Therefore my risk assessment of the danger is very high. And with that, I've said all I can possibly say on the subject.
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Post by bradc on Feb 7, 2020 17:51:13 GMT
Guess it comes down to opinion Or exposure/experience... Some styles use swords differently. Thrusting (tsuki) is a valid function of katana. The point is sharp for a reason. How often that was really done in different situations is a fair debate. Now in regards to tanto and yoroi doshi there are different considerations, but I'll leave that to the experts on those weapons.
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Post by Cottontail Customs on Feb 7, 2020 17:52:21 GMT
I have a T10 blade in a buffalo horn shirasaya that looks amazing but I would get it mounted if I was going to use it. The buffalo horn shirasaya is nice for storing it on display though pics? brand/model?
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