tonystark
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“I told you, I don’t want to join your super secret boy band!”
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Post by tonystark on Jul 6, 2018 1:56:02 GMT
Ugghh you need to come take some classes in the US so you can hang out here and buy some firearms on the lower end. Yeah if only it worked like that! So are you buying the Shield 2.0 in .45? It’s still a good choice, but if you can get a chance check out a Springfield XDE in .45acp. It’s double/single action, so it’s safer for carrying, and I believe the capacity is around the same as the Shield. You should do a review when you do pick it up!
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Post by Croccifixio on Jul 7, 2018 2:35:09 GMT
I’m sure the XDE is far more expensive. They have an exclusive distributor here. For HS-branded guns, the price is reasonable (lower than the Glocks). But for XD-branded guns, they’re above both Glocks and S&W M&Ps. Last gunshow, the XDM in 45 was around 67,000 (almost $1300).
Actually I’m still not 100% sold on the Shield. Unless I get one with a safety (which I don’t like since non-1911 safeties are almost always too small), I’m more comfortable with a DAO or DA/SA gun. It’s a pity the PX4 Storm is far too big for CCWing with my body type.
Rethinking the revolver tbh. I think it actually fits all of my requirements, since I want something that (1) is safer than a Glock around children, (2) uses a cartridge with more power than a 9mm, (3) is more concealable than a full-sized gun, (4) is more comfortable to carry/lighter than a 1911, (5) will likely be used with only one hand/not so ideal grip, and (6) will likely be used in close quarters or even contact distance (I thought about it and the most likely DGU for me would be while I was in a bus and robbers came in, while I was driving and slowing down at a corner/fully stopped which is how lawyers often get killed here, and at home where I could actually use a full-sized handgun and/or a shotgun).
Just how concealable are revolvers? While the cylinder is thick, the rest of the gun seems ultra concealable and the cylinder is curved anyway. Would, say a 6 shot 357 snubbie be just as concealable as a Glock 26?
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tonystark
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“I told you, I don’t want to join your super secret boy band!”
Posts: 816
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Post by tonystark on Jul 7, 2018 12:20:29 GMT
That sucks! Here the XDE is about $150-$200 less than a new Glock, and it’s double/single action, which would have met your criteria for a safer carry gun. I completely understand your aversion for safeties on handguns that are not a 1911, by the way. I’ve been wanting to get my hands on a PX4 Storm (at least to shoot) for a while. By all accounts they’re great guns, but why don’t you get a PX4 Compact for carry? www.beretta.com/en-us/px4-storm-compact/ I got my hands on the compact version in a gunstore and while it felt good to hold, I have big hands so smaller guns have always felt a little odd to me. As far as revolvers go, there’s the S&W 66 Combat Magnum chambered in .357, which quite a few people carry. Another great carry revolver is the Ruger LCR, but in .327 Magnum. The .327 has power very similar to .357, but less recoil, and the LCR is super concealable! While I haven’t physically seen a Glock 26 next to an LCR, I do know a few guys who say it’s barely noticeable while they’re carrying it.
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Post by Croccifixio on Jul 8, 2018 22:46:22 GMT
Isn’t the storm fat? But yeah I’m considering it as well. Too bad the compact carry isn’t here, the one with Ernest Langdon’s mods I’d have loved those.
Revolvers just look so cool :)
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tonystark
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“I told you, I don’t want to join your super secret boy band!”
Posts: 816
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Post by tonystark on Jul 9, 2018 1:37:28 GMT
I think it “looks” thicker than it really is, but the rotating barrel really absorbs felt recoil to the point where I’ve seen reviews where people said it felt like you were shooting a full size handgun. Yeah the Langdon model is all supped up, but it’s much, much, more expensive. Even here in the US! Revolvers do look so awesome! I love my S&W 629, it’s soooo awesome. What do you think about the LCR in .327mag??
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Post by Croccifixio on Jul 9, 2018 2:45:57 GMT
I think it “looks” thicker than it really is, but the rotating barrel really absorbs felt recoil to the point where I’ve seen reviews where people said it felt like you were shooting a full size handgun. Yeah the Langdon model is all supped up, but it’s much, much, more expensive. Even here in the US! Revolvers do look so awesome! I love my S&W 629, it’s soooo awesome. What do you think about the LCR in .327mag?? It's up for consideration, honestly. At the end of the day, I'm just after something I can carry all the time even when I'm in a suit or formal wear, which is 90% of the time. I might not have the luxury of a shirt or vest over the gun in appendix (which is the only way to carry here and not get the gun confiscated by building security - they often pat you down around the belt line but never near your junk). So I need it to be a bit versatile and be used sometimes for pocket carry with big pockets, sometimes for bag carry, and sometimes even ankle. And I just posted all my guns for sale in the local FB pages. Might do a revamp of the collection and get a Mossberg 590A1, a Glock 17 gen 5, and a Ruger LCR/LCRx with the proceeds. We'll see what happens!
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tonystark
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“I told you, I don’t want to join your super secret boy band!”
Posts: 816
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Post by tonystark on Jul 9, 2018 3:23:55 GMT
No actually I understand perfectly! I used to live in one of the worst states for gun laws in the entire US, and there is such a small number that legally carried there that I had no choice but to carry appendix, so if anyone happened to see my carry gun they wouldn’t call the police. So here I am years later, still carrying appendix, and it makes me laugh when all these online know-it-all’s insist that carrying appendix guarantees that you’ll shoot your bratwurst off! Well that’s why I suggest the LCR. It’s SUPER concealable (for a revolver) and the .327 has excellent ballistics. Better than 9mm in fact. I hope your sales go through so you can buy something better suited for your current needs! You should get a Mossberg Shockwave if you can. After having mine for a couple of months now, and training regularly with it, I can honestly say it’s an incredible CQ’s home defense weapon!! I put a side saddle on it, so that it carries 5+1 and 6 more shells on the saddle. All it needs is a mount for my Streamlight TLR 1 HL 800 lumen light, and it’ll be perfect.
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Post by bluetrain on Jul 9, 2018 10:48:09 GMT
Although a lot of know-it-alls do in fact, know it all, almost, a few real experts, all policemen with actual gunfighting experience allow that others can come up with novel solutions to common problems related to firearms. When we bow to the experts, progress begins to slow down. Some experts tended to be almost reactionary, others surprisingly liberal. One writer praised the Glock, which does have some good features, while another thought no handgun was better than something designed over a hundred years ago, previously having been told by yet another writer that an even older model was better. The same writer was probably the only one who advocated magazine cut-offs in rifles in the last hundred years, too.
Me, I have my own opinions and experiences but I've never been in a gunfight, never killed anyone and I'm no expert. My writing isn't so hot, either, as you have probably already guessed.
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tonystark
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“I told you, I don’t want to join your super secret boy band!”
Posts: 816
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Post by tonystark on Jul 9, 2018 20:27:58 GMT
“When we bow to the experts, progress begins to slow down.“ While I very much agree with your sentiment, we all have to learn from someone. I think being careful when we choose our instructors influences how and what we learn. I guess I should have clarified that I was referring to “self proclaimed” experts, (like on YouTube) and not actual certified instructors. Nowadays there are people who get lazy and think they can learn how to defend themselves and their families by watching videos. Nothing is a substitute for hands on, face to face training! By the way I think your writing is great. I’ve never had a problem understanding what you were trying to say 😉
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Post by Croccifixio on Jul 9, 2018 21:41:35 GMT
I’m picky about who I listen to. There are a lot of local myths here, to the point that I prefer online foreign sources. For instance, most if not all my military acquaintances prefer 45 ACP in a handgun. For them, the adoption of the Glock 17 for national police was wrong. They even say that it was because police didn’t want to have a handgun to kill people with. When I bought my Glock 1, they all thought it was just going to be a range gun. That’s all fine and well, but they also ever only use FMJ (so I can see why they prefer the 45 in the field). Gunstores across the country don’t even recommend hollowpoint ammo because “it’s all about shot placement”. It’s all a mishmash of truth and misconceptions, so I’ve resorted to going online to find more accurate info.
That said, I still am a proponent of 45 ACP. It’s a great cartridge and the low pressure means less wear and tear. I also shoot it almost as well as the 9mm (on the 1911 platform though). Doesn’t mean the 9mm isn’t a respectable and viable self-defense round.
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Post by bluetrain on Jul 9, 2018 22:24:00 GMT
As far as my writing goes, if I'm not sure what I'm trying to say, it's going to sound like it.
Chances are, those who served in the armed forces like the .45 auto (as it was always referred to) because of familiarity and that includes me. But in the company I spent most of my time in, we also had Colt pocket autos (.32 or .380, don't know which) and Colt Detective Specials. It has been a while. I personally don't think there's a lot of practical difference between different cartridges. Some knowledgeable people are apparently satisfied with a .22 rimfire handgun. Others prefer something along the lines of a .44 magnum but recommend the .357 for people with weak hands.
All handguns can kill and that what the ones used by the police and military are for. Typically, though, more powerful handguns with a much larger capacity are now in use, particularly in Europe. Police there used to be armed with .32 autos. Now, if you go to London, you will see policemen carrying submachine guns.
Ah, the certified instructors! You can't even go hand gliding without a certified instructor beside you. Between all the licenses, permits and certifications, it is sometimes becomes a little stifling.
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Post by Croccifixio on Jul 9, 2018 22:25:12 GMT
There’s a lot of truth to that :)
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tonystark
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“I told you, I don’t want to join your super secret boy band!”
Posts: 816
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Post by tonystark on Jul 10, 2018 2:41:19 GMT
I’m picky about who I listen to. There are a lot of local myths here, to the point that I prefer online foreign sources. For instance, most if not all my military acquaintances prefer 45 ACP in a handgun. For them, the adoption of the Glock 17 for national police was wrong. They even say that it was because police didn’t want to have a handgun to kill people with. When I bought my Glock 1, they all thought it was just going to be a range gun. That’s all fine and well, but they also ever only use FMJ (so I can see why they prefer the 45 in the field). Gunstores across the country don’t even recommend hollowpoint ammo because “it’s all about shot placement”. It’s all a mishmash of truth and misconceptions, so I’ve resorted to going online to find more accurate info. That said, I still am a proponent of 45 ACP. It’s a great cartridge and the low pressure means less wear and tear. I also shoot it almost as well as the 9mm (on the 1911 platform though). Doesn’t mean the 9mm isn’t a respectable and viable self-defense round. I’m pretty picky too when it comes to tips and drills for training. Having done armed security work back in my early to mid 20’s I had to keep up with my training, it wasn’t just a hobby! I’ve taken a couple of courses at the Sig Sauer Academy, here in the Granite State, and while one of them was a straight up pistol course, the other two were pretty intense Law Enforcement courses. It’s funny you bring up .45 acp, cause I think it’s one of the most underrated calibers in the last 10 or so years. Everybody’s obsessed 9mm nowadays. Like you said, it’s not a “useless” caliber by any means, but .40 and .45 are still great choices too. There’s also the .450 SMC which is a .45 bullet with .357sig speed behind it. You can even shoot it out of any solid gun that’s chambered in .45. www.ammoland.com/2014/11/450-smc-ammo/#axzz5Kocn2af8
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tonystark
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“I told you, I don’t want to join your super secret boy band!”
Posts: 816
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Post by tonystark on Jul 10, 2018 2:50:39 GMT
As far as my writing goes, if I'm not sure what I'm trying to say, it's going to sound like it. Chances are, those who served in the armed forces like the .45 auto (as it was always referred to) because of familiarity and that includes me. But in the company I spent most of my time in, we also had Colt pocket autos (.32 or .380, don't know which) and Colt Detective Specials. It has been a while. I personally don't think there's a lot of practical difference between different cartridges. Some knowledgeable people are apparently satisfied with a .22 rimfire handgun. Others prefer something along the lines of a .44 magnum but recommend the .357 for people with weak hands. All handguns can kill and that what the ones used by the police and military are for. Typically, though, more powerful handguns with a much larger capacity are now in use, particularly in Europe. Police there used to be armed with .32 autos. Now, if you go to London, you will see policemen carrying submachine guns. Ah, the certified instructors! You can't even go hand gliding without a certified instructor beside you. Between all the licenses, permits and certifications, it is sometimes becomes a little stifling. I agree! It’s not so much caliber, but the skill set of the person holding said handgun. I’ve always wanted to pick up one of the old CZ-70’s that certain police departments in Europe used. .32 was certainly effective enough while they were using it!
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Post by Croccifixio on Jul 10, 2018 8:21:06 GMT
I like the 45 for self-defense because in the event that the bullet fails to expand due to factors outside your control (weather, clothing, barriers, limbs or bones getting in the way, etc), it's still big and powerful. And if you're a proponent on the first few bullets on target being the most crucial to stop a threat, then I'd take the three 45 ACP bullets in 2 seconds over the four 9mm bullets in the same time period simply on account of area damage. In a prolonged gunfight I would definitely prefer the 9mm in all cases. But that's just me. To be honest I would prefer the 357 over both of them. I wish RIA would make a 1911 in 357 like Coonan did.
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Post by bluetrain on Jul 10, 2018 11:37:13 GMT
Although hollow-point handgun cartridges have been around since before WWI, they really didn't become common until probably the 1970s probably, maybe earlier. The .45 ACP achieved it's "awesome" reputation with full metal jacket bullets, which today, are considered marginally effective. I suppose we have exceptionally high expectations these days. Likewise, the 9mm did not really achieve broad use also until well after WWII. Today, it's virtually a world standard, for what it's worth. A rimmed cartridge like the .357 magnum presents some design problems in automatic pistols but they're out there. It's really a fierce cartridge in most handguns, though, which may account for it's apparent lack of popularity (in pistols). I guess most any design problem can be overcome because some pistols have been produced chambered in .38 special full wadcutter.
The real difficulty lies not in what cartridge or handgun you happen to be using but in hitting the target in the first place. That part is often assumed away. Of course, it's not that easy to commit yourself to shooting another person. But it is apparently easy enough to overcome that reluctance, judging from what I read in the paper.
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tonystark
Member
“I told you, I don’t want to join your super secret boy band!”
Posts: 816
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Post by tonystark on Jul 11, 2018 0:47:36 GMT
One of my next in line: Sig Sauer Nightmare Fastback (.357Sig) Until I can afford a Coonan chambered in .357Mag that is!
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Post by Croccifixio on Jul 11, 2018 1:06:37 GMT
Oh man that looks good. Watched Caleb Giddings' review of that and I want it so badly. I wonder why the 1911 is just so damn attractive to me?
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tonystark
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“I told you, I don’t want to join your super secret boy band!”
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Post by tonystark on Jul 11, 2018 1:18:26 GMT
Funnily enough he was the one who suggested it to me! lol He was like “oh yeah I reviewed that 1911, go check out the videos I did.” Sure enough I was hooked after that. 😁
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Post by Croccifixio on Jul 11, 2018 2:02:35 GMT
Really like Caleb's videos on youtube and his interviews on Ballistic Radio. He, Chris Baker from Luckygunner, Ernest Langdon, John Johnston from Ballistic Radio, and Paul Harrell himself have been the ones who've more or less driven most of my CCW thoughts, drilling, and training the past few months.
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