Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
Posts: 3,284
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Post by Ifrit on May 13, 2017 19:47:10 GMT
The ammo situation is the most often used argument against firearms. No one has mentioned care of the firearm itself. Of course much will depend on if one is going to stay near home to protect property or go to the field. In the field there are other issues such as falling or crawling through mud or water, not recommended for a firearm and necessitating more care and cleaning material oil and a cleaning rod at the very least. That all depends on the platform you're using. Do a google on the FN FAL "Old Dirty". The last I remember reading that it had gone 15,000 rounds with out a cleaning, just oil and shoot. I do recall that the owner threw it into a creek as a form of cleaning and then shook out the water, but beyond that no proper cleaning and it's still shooting well inside "Minute of Man" out to 500+ yards. Then there's the venerable AK47 platform. Take a look at the third world hell holes filled with poorly trained and equipped "troops". Their weapon of choice....the AK47. So don't let the illusion firearms disappearing due to poor maintenance. Also, there are the more primitive firearm platforms like black power out there: Cap & Ball and Muzzle Loaders and their propellants can be home manufactured if a person is smart enough. True that they don't shoot as fast as modern day firearms but they are damn near as deadly. Not to rain on anybodies parade just trying to keep things real. Now that said, I've been thinking about life in Post Apocalyptic "Sword World". What you're going to be carrying will also depend on your mission. If you're scavenging you want to be quiet, light and fast. In and out, grab and go. Recon your target....stealth. So I'm thinking....ninja and the appropriate blade, if you're going for the Asian persona or for you European folks a modest one handed broad sword with perhaps a buckler. Both are lightly but respectfully armed. Both can move quickly and quietly and.....remember both can RUN AWAY even faster. Standing and fighting is not always the answer. I think a modest buckler would be rather handy when dealing with rabble armed with machetes and such. Your thoughts? Gonna have to say I agree with the sword point. I know nothing about guns so im inclined to take your point of view as my own. A sword is by far a better weapon than a machete. It's actually designed for fighting. Plus a single hander and a buckler should be hard to carry around I don't think. I've never carried one but I can't imagine a buckler to be heavy. But I have doubts on a medieval suspension system in rough terrain and dense woods, or very cluttered areas, and this is only cause I never wore one before. The way it hangs just looks like it would get caught on stuff. It's another reason I like katana. You can quickly adjust it to where ever you want it to be.
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Post by howler on May 13, 2017 20:09:35 GMT
Something tells me that most of the fighting in a "post"-modern/high technology setting would occur indoors (narrow spaces tend to lessen chopping weapons' efficiency), so I´m inclined to take a dagger over a buckler. Although a buckler would protect better against thrown stuff - then again, a cloak would be even better in this case. ...Dagger over buckler, for me. Oh, and bucklers tend to make - a lot - of noise, in my experience. Yes, as you say, thrown objects favor the buckler, but (like you) I would rather have that beautiful dagger of yours, as those quillions and hand guard make for a very effective shield...and you still have over a foot of double edged steel for rib tickling goodness. The offhand dagger is the "secret sauce" that would make many solo weapon types (rapier, small sword, short sword, kukri, bowie, lighter saber, etc...) far more effective as a combination.
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Post by Graybeard on May 13, 2017 20:18:12 GMT
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Post by howler on May 13, 2017 20:29:48 GMT
I could put something sharp and pointy in the center of my buckler...would that be ok?!?!?!?! They have examples of that, but I believe they weren't very long, more of an impact force multiplier (like a skull crusher), which makes sense, as it would be very awkward to carry, even harder to use effectively (as you would hook it on stuff you didn't want to...like yourself ) , and impossible to make new allies (NOBODY would want to be on either side of you so as not to be slashed and poked).
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on May 13, 2017 20:54:06 GMT
I could put something sharp and pointy in the center of my buckler...would that be ok?!?!?!?! O_o :P (rofl) It's been done. At first I was intrigued by the idea. Then thought about all the times that I would be hitting it myself during a carry or inadvertently brushing up against someone during a carry. And decided that at least for me it would create more problems than it’s worth. Possibly carrying a dagger or the like in the buckler hand behind the buckler and extending passed the buckler is another approach. But with my small again not practical for me.
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Post by seriouslee on May 13, 2017 20:58:11 GMT
Something tells me that most of the fighting in a "post"-modern/high technology setting would occur indoors (narrow spaces tend to lessen chopping weapons' efficiency), so I´m inclined to take a dagger over a buckler. Although a buckler would protect better against thrown stuff - then again, a cloak would be even better in this case. ...Dagger over buckler, for me. Oh, and bucklers tend to make - a lot - of noise, in my experience. I would guess it depends on your locale. Here there are few highrises and even fewer basements. I live in the suburbs of Los Angeles. If I am digging my way out of the rubble and looking for something to take with my it would still be the walking stick/blade.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2017 21:34:35 GMT
It isn't a game of rock paper scissors, one guy survives 20 gunshots, another dies from a stupid punch outside of a bar. Saying this beats that is really simplistic. Besides, pointing your shotgun at the guy with the sword in front of you is great and all, but you can only point that thing in one direction at a time...
I don't think it's very realistic to think lack of maintenance will take guns out of the picture. I could probably spend the rest of my life abusing my glock and I wouldn't be surprised if it kept doing its thing.
If your hanging suspension gets in the way, grab it and move it to where it isn't, no different than if I grab the katana in my belt and lift it up while walking around people or whatever to not bang into things.
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Post by Rabel Dusk on May 13, 2017 21:57:07 GMT
Under those conditions, this guy would be a handy thing to carry around.
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Post by AndiTheBarvarian on May 13, 2017 22:28:52 GMT
I could put something sharp and pointy in the center of my buckler...would that be ok?!?!?!?! It's been done. At first I was intrigued by the idea. Then thought about all the times that I would be hitting it myself during a carry or inadvertently brushing up against someone during a carry. And decided that at least for me it would create more problems than it’s worth. Possibly carrying a dagger or the like in the buckler hand behind the buckler and extending passed the buckler is another approach. But with my small again not practical for me. Here you can see the picture of a german spiked buckler that can be carried on your head like a hat:
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Post by howler on May 13, 2017 23:00:13 GMT
It isn't a game of rock paper scissors, one guy survives 20 gunshots, another dies from a stupid punch outside of a bar. Saying this beats that is really simplistic. Besides, pointing your shotgun at the guy with the sword in front of you is great and all, but you can only point that thing in one direction at a time... I don't think it's very realistic to think lack of maintenance will take guns out of the picture. I could probably spend the rest of my life abusing my glock and I wouldn't be surprised if it kept doing its thing. If your hanging suspension gets in the way, grab it and move it to where it isn't, no different than if I grab the katana in my belt and lift it up while walking around people or whatever to not bang into things. Your right in that there is no absolute in the "this beats that" thought experiment, but one CAN reach a general consensus. Generally, if your standing 30 feet from a dude (on a level, open field) and you have an AR while he is armed with a blade (any blade), you have a GROSS advantage.
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Post by howler on May 13, 2017 23:01:46 GMT
Under those conditions, this guy would be a handy thing to carry around. And it may be capable of general utility tasks, as well.
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on May 14, 2017 0:47:07 GMT
With all of the pro and cons about firearms this thread is drifting away from its topic “Civilisation Breakdown Sword”.
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Post by howler on May 14, 2017 2:04:57 GMT
I would guess it depends on your locale. Here there are few highrises and even fewer basements. I live in the suburbs of Los Angeles. If I am digging my way out of the rubble and looking for something to take with my it would still be the walking stick/blade. This is one of the reasons why I like the CS bushman so much. Yup. I think I mentioned the CS bushman (and spears in general) earlier, but then focused on the "sword only" aspect of the equation. Really, that CS bushman is so nice because you can simply detach to use as a knife, while the spear magically turns back into a staff. Heck, that is like three things in one, with the spear being better (generally) than the sword. Winner, winner, chicken dinner. And lets not forget that (like the tomahawk) you can just carry the bushman knife with you and then fashion the shaft in the woods.
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Post by howler on May 14, 2017 2:11:24 GMT
With all of the pro and cons about firearms this thread is drifting away from its topic “Civilisation Breakdown Sword”. Yes, it's hard to stay on the "sword specific" aspect, when pole arms, axes, spears, firearms, etc...beckon, as they will invariably be co-existing in this post apocalyptic hell world, and thus, call on one to compare with. I still believe the "blade only" winner is still the long knife, heavy machete realm (portability and utility).
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on May 14, 2017 2:21:30 GMT
Awh, the machete. It’s king in my country and is hard to beat as a jack of all trades, one can fight with it and use it as a utility tool. My only complaint with a machete is the lack of hand protection although CS and Condor have taken steps here with their cutlass models. To the English speaking islands just to the east the word cutlass and machete have the same meaning, machete.
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
Posts: 3,284
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Post by Ifrit on May 14, 2017 3:17:23 GMT
This is one of the reasons why I like the CS bushman so much. Yup. I think I mentioned the CS bushman (and spears in general) earlier, but then focused on the "sword only" aspect of the equation. Really, that CS bushman is so nice because you can simply detach to use as a knife, while the spear magically turns back into a staff. Heck, that is like three things in one, with the spear being better (generally) than the sword. Winner, winner, chicken dinner. And lets not forget that (like the tomahawk) you can just carry the bushman knife with you and then fashion the shaft in the woods. Everyday I regret not buying myself one of those. But in a pinch I could fashion a but of a spear by tying a knife, like my ti-lite or my buck knife, to the end of a shaft. I even intended to do that with my throwing knives. They are 11 inches in total, 7 inches of it being a blade. Would make great throwing spears
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Post by howler on May 14, 2017 4:02:45 GMT
Yup. I think I mentioned the CS bushman (and spears in general) earlier, but then focused on the "sword only" aspect of the equation. Really, that CS bushman is so nice because you can simply detach to use as a knife, while the spear magically turns back into a staff. Heck, that is like three things in one, with the spear being better (generally) than the sword. Winner, winner, chicken dinner. And lets not forget that (like the tomahawk) you can just carry the bushman knife with you and then fashion the shaft in the woods. Everyday I regret not buying myself one of those. But in a pinch I could fashion a but of a spear by tying a knife, like my ti-lite or my buck knife, to the end of a shaft. I even intended to do that with my throwing knives. They are 11 inches in total, 7 inches of it being a blade. Would make great throwing spears Many knives have a hole on each side of the blade, so all you have to do is take off the scales and attach to a proper stick with para cord. I have heard many, however, say this is not recommended if it is your only knife, so maybe you take a more committed "spear" knife along with your other blades.
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
Posts: 3,284
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Post by Ifrit on May 14, 2017 7:58:29 GMT
Everyday I regret not buying myself one of those. But in a pinch I could fashion a but of a spear by tying a knife, like my ti-lite or my buck knife, to the end of a shaft. I even intended to do that with my throwing knives. They are 11 inches in total, 7 inches of it being a blade. Would make great throwing spears Many knives have a hole on each side of the blade, so all you have to do is take off the scales and attach to a proper stick with para cord. I have heard many, however, say this is not recommended if it is your only knife, so maybe you take a more committed "spear" knife along with your other blades. Good thing I got the throwing knives. Can even make myself 3 of them, throw them as a surprise, or during an enemy charge if they got the stuff in them to attempt it.
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Post by Lancelot Chan on May 14, 2017 13:07:02 GMT
Am I the only one here who think in such situation, my aim is to die a quick death instead? :D
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Post by AndiTheBarvarian on May 14, 2017 13:27:39 GMT
... aaand with which sword in hand?
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