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Post by Derzis on Dec 28, 2016 0:46:48 GMT
What if you wanna half sword with the katana ? You go to a club/dojo and learn. No matter how sharp it is a "one edge" sword, you will be able to do the half-swording without problems. In time. |
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
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Post by Ifrit on Dec 28, 2016 3:08:42 GMT
What if you wanna half sword with the katana ? You go to a club/dojo and learn. No matter how sharp it is a "one edge" sword, you will be able to do the half-swording without problems. In time. I already know of that gripping method but I prefer using cut proof gloves Plus cutting only happens when you slide across the blade. But once again I prefer cut proof gloves. It's the best thing I've ever found |
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Post by Derzis on Dec 28, 2016 3:10:27 GMT
Funny, is not a grip per se and the cutting edge is not a threat if you do it correctly. But as you wish, use gloves if is how you were taught. I am sure is not something as shown below - the JSA way of half-swording a katana.   |
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
Posts: 3,284
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Post by Ifrit on Dec 28, 2016 5:36:20 GMT
Thank you very much for the picture guides. Those will be of help to me.
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Post by Derzis on Dec 28, 2016 5:56:23 GMT
Welcome but you were saying you know already. Anyway, the idea is to use the pressure between thumb and index as locking mechanism on the flats of the blade. Rest of the fingers align with index for safety reason - no finger tip below the cutting edge, all parallel with the floor as much as possible. Normally you should be able to keep the blade in place just with the hand from the photo if the tsuka is on your hip - this is the test for good pressure in "half-swording" hand. The rest you will discover - sword can slide as needed between the thumb and index, using the tech as an aiming system, etc.
I don't see why it can't work for messer even thought reading some Hema materials about half-swording one edge blades they talk about curling the fingers on the cutting edge and gripping tight the flats. I wouldn't do that even if you pay me, just because I consider the above much safer. I would try that just on a 2 edges sword and my hand would wrap around just one cutting edge applying pressure on flats with the heel of hand and finger tips - I tried this on my GSOW , the single Euro I have and it seams to work, but ... And this tech is used just for trusting in tight places in JSA, not desarming btw.
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Post by Lukas MG (chenessfan) on Dec 28, 2016 9:05:49 GMT
Depending on what you mean, I agree or not. Yes, putting your finger on the sharp edge itself is a stupid idea, but holding the flat is not. So yeah, no to the first part, a firm yes on the second part. I used the word "flat" somewhere? I don't think someone with a formal training needs to be explained the difference between "cutting edge" and "flat". Any technique with any sharp sword that goes for half-swording involves the flat. Someone above was talking about holding it by the edge, protected or keeping it still. Well, in an online discussion it is quite possible that not everything is spelled out exactly as meant, so I wanted to clarify. Also, there are people reading that may not have as much experience. Btw, I don't hold too much on "formal training". It is no guarantee for quality. I've seen some "formally trained" people that utterly sucked as well as some "informally trained" ones that were quite impressive. The only thing that is achieved by again and again stressing the "formal training rules and everything else sucks" mind set is furthering the arrogant, snob-like impression many martial arts are already associated with. |
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Post by Derzis on Dec 28, 2016 12:37:37 GMT
Can be taken as a snob thing, and can be taken as anything you want, but I usually use a lot of sarcasm behind the expression, especially when I repeat it. If I really want to point out something obvious I am doing it. Someone said here he knew what I am talking about, but obviously he knew nothing - and is not the first time happening on SBG. How you call that? Yes, I am an arrogant sob for you. Enjoy your opinion, I will never try to change it.
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Post by Derzis on Dec 28, 2016 14:21:40 GMT
You have more common sense than others in this case. More power to you.
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Ifrit
Member
More edgy than a double edge sword
Posts: 3,284
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Post by Ifrit on Dec 28, 2016 18:17:08 GMT
Can be taken as a snob thing, and can be taken as anything you want, but I usually use a lot of sarcasm behind the expression, especially when I repeat it. If I really want to point out something obvious I am doing it. Someone said here he knew what I am talking about, but obviously he knew nothing - and is not the first time happening on SBG. How you call that? Yes, I am an arrogant sob for you. Enjoy your opinion, I will never try to change it. In my own defense I was mostly just being polite and thanking you for the picture. We did that grip just ever so slightly different so I appreciate seeing other methods. What does being a snob to everyone do for you exactly? What do you gain? I bet there are tons of swordsman here who could mop the floor with you. So what's with the snobby attitude? I always heard about those studying Asian martial arts being humble and such Not claiming to be one of those swordsman. But your "better and superior to everyone else who are nothing but scum" attitude is tiring. It's making SBG a tiring place to be. |
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Dec 28, 2016 18:20:20 GMT
Seeing those photos I got a new perspective of what you are asking. With half swording I envisioned grasping a sword blade somewhere forward of the quillon in order to reinforce the blade for a thrust and/or to increase the accuracy of the thrust, not to mention a close quarter operation. If you are inquiring about half swording (and I think in your case there is a better term) with a katana to decrease the measure I can think of various methods rather than grasping the blade. An alternative to the photo.  However rather than that I find this hold faster to obtain. It is also a variation of a similar hold with other blades.  or this  I hope this link works (first time for me). Later this morning I found this method in use. This technique is found at about mark 11.38. That's a bummer for me. It just sends me back to this page. I give up so here is the Video. Sorry I was trying to save space. Remember, at mark about 11:38. |
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
Posts: 3,284
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Post by Ifrit on Dec 28, 2016 18:22:07 GMT
Can be taken as a snob thing, and can be taken as anything you want, but I usually use a lot of sarcasm behind the expression, especially when I repeat it. If I really want to point out something obvious I am doing it. Someone said here he knew what I am talking about, but obviously he knew nothing - and is not the first time happening on SBG. How you call that? Yes, I am an arrogant sob for you. Enjoy your opinion, I will never try to change it. "Knew nothing". It's like your mind can't even comprehend other styles. Yet you act superior. It's usually the smallest minds who talk the loudest. All you ever do is go around shooting people down for not confirming to your style. You would think you have actually done something worth while with a sword to have this attitude. |
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AndiTheBarvarian
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"Lord of the Memes"
Bavarianbarbarian - Semper Semprini
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Post by AndiTheBarvarian on Dec 28, 2016 19:19:31 GMT
I now tried this gripping with my katanas and broader/flater european single edge blades too, but not thrusting.
It worked better than I thought.
But Im not sure what happens if a opponent draws or pushes your blade with such techniques, I mean if you are not the only one who puts and controls forces on the blade you grip.
Halfswording afaik is full gripping the blade, not only giving a leverage base.
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Post by Lukas MG (chenessfan) on Dec 28, 2016 19:55:11 GMT
Can be taken as a snob thing, and can be taken as anything you want, but I usually use a lot of sarcasm behind the expression, especially when I repeat it. If I really want to point out something obvious I am doing it. Someone said here he knew what I am talking about, but obviously he knew nothing - and is not the first time happening on SBG. How you call that? Yes, I am an arrogant sob for you. Enjoy your opinion, I will never try to change it. Keep in mind sarcasm isn't conveyed well in written form so best articulate yourself carefully and don't assume other people will understand that you meant something tongue-in-cheek. It doesn't further your points nor any discussion if people feel offended by your posts. Your superior attitude is ill-placed, especially since nobody can verify skill levels here. At least not without substantial video evidence ;) So I suggest keeping it down. I'm sure you have interesting and very worth-while things to say, just do so without sounding condescending. Anyway: For me (european context only), half swording does mean grasping the blade, not just putting the hand on the back of a single-edged blade for leverage. But single-edged or two-edged, grasping is imo done by tightly gripping the flats, carefully avoiding direct contact with the edges. I'll try to find a pic... |
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Post by Lukas MG (chenessfan) on Dec 28, 2016 20:15:43 GMT
Like so:  |
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Post by Derzis on Dec 28, 2016 20:17:43 GMT
Can be taken as a snob thing, and can be taken as anything you want, but I usually use a lot of sarcasm behind the expression, especially when I repeat it. If I really want to point out something obvious I am doing it. Someone said here he knew what I am talking about, but obviously he knew nothing - and is not the first time happening on SBG. How you call that? Yes, I am an arrogant sob for you. Enjoy your opinion, I will never try to change it. In my own defense I was mostly just being polite and thanking you for the picture. We did that grip just ever so slightly different so I appreciate seeing other methods. What does being a snob to everyone do for you exactly? What do you gain? I bet there are tons of swordsman here who could mop the floor with you. So what's with the snobby attitude? I always heard about those studying Asian martial arts being humble and such Not claiming to be one of those swordsman. But your "better and superior to everyone else who are nothing but scum" attitude is tiring. It's making SBG a tiring place to be. Thank you for being polite, could you share that other method? That method that made you more comfortable with gloves than empty hands? You call me snob, I call you liar. We are both right or both wrong. It just depends how we look at this interaction on www. Until now is just a monologue, so I follow the rules of monologue: Someone says something, other one says no targeting something specific and things escalate. Focus on the subject at hand, not me. I am nothing to you. Or everything. |
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Post by Derzis on Dec 28, 2016 20:24:40 GMT
Can be taken as a snob thing, and can be taken as anything you want, but I usually use a lot of sarcasm behind the expression, especially when I repeat it. If I really want to point out something obvious I am doing it. Someone said here he knew what I am talking about, but obviously he knew nothing - and is not the first time happening on SBG. How you call that? Yes, I am an arrogant sob for you. Enjoy your opinion, I will never try to change it. Keep in mind sarcasm isn't conveyed well in written form so best articulate yourself carefully and don't assume other people will understand that you meant something tongue-in-cheek. It doesn't further your points nor any discussion if people feel offended by your posts. Your superior attitude is ill-placed, especially since nobody can verify skill levels here. At least not without substantial video evidence ;) So I suggest keeping it down. I'm sure you have interesting and very worth-while things to say, just do so without sounding condescending. To keep down what? Please, you have no rights to tell someone how to act. Let the moderators to act. You read the way I described how I would think a two edged blade would have to be half sworded? Or you were too busy to told me things about how you think I should be to have the right to call bs where I see it? If you really want dialogue. If not, so be it. We continue. |
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Post by Deepbluedave on Dec 28, 2016 21:41:57 GMT
I might be doing it wrong butt here is an image from a video, halfway thru a cut I reverse the sword to use the pommel. hope it helps was just something I had heard about and was wanting to try for myself, this sword is sharp and used for cutting. Edit this was one motion with a full swing with full contact of pommel on the pell. Attachments:
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Post by Lukas MG (chenessfan) on Dec 28, 2016 21:54:21 GMT
Keep in mind sarcasm isn't conveyed well in written form so best articulate yourself carefully and don't assume other people will understand that you meant something tongue-in-cheek. It doesn't further your points nor any discussion if people feel offended by your posts. Your superior attitude is ill-placed, especially since nobody can verify skill levels here. At least not without substantial video evidence ;) So I suggest keeping it down. I'm sure you have interesting and very worth-while things to say, just do so without sounding condescending. To keep down what? Please, you have no rights to tell someone how to act. Let the moderators to act. You read the way I described how I would think a two edged blade would have to be half sworded? Or you were too busy to told me things about how you think I should be to have the right to call bs where I see it? If you really want dialogue. If not, so be it. We continue. I read how you think blades should be half sworded and for the most part, I think we agree. What I meant by "keeping down" should be fairly obvious, several people have expressed that they felt insulted by your posts (one member in particular). I don't need to be a moderator to ask you if you could maybe speak (write) nicely, even if you think you are "calling bs". Sure, the mods are there to step up if needed but that doesn't mean one cannot politely ask another member to maybe try to chose his words more carefully. We're all adults here, no? Anyway, I don't think we need to discuss that further. Both parties have made their points. Deepbluedave : thanks for the pic. That is a so-called Mordschlag. How sharp exactly was/is that sword? Also, would you feel comfortable doing the same thing without gloves? |
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Post by Deepbluedave on Dec 29, 2016 5:06:28 GMT
Hey Lukas, the sword is as sharp as all my cutting swords, it is not a razor or hair shaving sharp but will cut water bottles fine as for doing this with no gloves on, I just took this sword out and held it same as the picture above with no gloves on and I think you would be ok if you maintained a very strong grip with no movement up or down the blade, but I would not guarantee that you won't cut yourself as too many varying factors.
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Post by Deepbluedave on Dec 29, 2016 5:09:22 GMT
The reason I added this was I had both my Albion Knecht and A&A Kreigsmesser swords on the table to cut with I normally just use the pell for warming up. but these are my two favourite cutting swords.
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Nov 1, 2024 0:13:58 GMT
Nov 1, 2024 0:13:58 GMT
