Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
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Post by Ifrit on Dec 28, 2016 5:38:29 GMT
No sh*t it's illegal. But so is attacking someone when armored. And so is using a gun to defend yourself. I'm talking about staying alive. I don't even know if an AR is legal in Canada. Pretty sure defending ones self with a shot gun is illegal too. An AR15 counts as a restricted firearm. So you can own them, but they require a restricted license, can only be transported to the range, and are registered. This also applies to handguns While it's possible to defend yourself with firearms here legally, you're going to get screwed in court anyways. Storage laws say your gun must be stored in a safe, ammo can be stored in the safe but not in the gun. You would have to prove/convince them that your life was in danger but that's hard to do when you apparently had enough time to get your gun out, load it, and shoot the attacker. The RCMP will also want to see how your storage is setup, and you can't say no to that since saying no gives them the right to kick your door down and do whatever they want. You'd be better off using some detachable magazine fed rifle like say the non restricted type 97 by Norinco (It's NR even though it fires the same bullet as the AR15 and are both semi auto, yay illogical gun laws!) as you can store ammo in magazines, so in a home defense, you could unlock the safe slam a magazine in and chamber a round. Ideally we could keep a loaded gun for this purpose but that's illegal here. Though that comes back to the question others have had in this thread, is a rifle really the ideal gun for defense in your home environment? Thank you for the tip! I agree that our gun laws and self defense laws are just plain illogical. But I suppose the chanced of armed and armoured men attacking us is a bit lower over here I would imagine
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Post by bluetrain on Dec 28, 2016 11:28:26 GMT
I hadn't realized that Canada was such a dangerous country and on the verge of social collapse. I feel fortunate to live just outside Washington, D.C. (as close as I can afford). Virtually nothing ever happens here, except for a bad snowstorm every three or four years. I understand they come from Canada, too.
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
Posts: 3,284
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Post by Ifrit on Dec 28, 2016 18:30:54 GMT
I hadn't realized that Canada was such a dangerous country and on the verge of social collapse. I feel fortunate to live just outside Washington, D.C. (as close as I can afford). Virtually nothing ever happens here, except for a bad snowstorm every three or four years. I understand they come from Canada, too. I have stated, in other words, that anything more than a .22 is kind of over kill. Just saying that a shot gun isn't that useless if you don't rely solely on gun. Speaking tactics here. It was in response to the guy who said a shot gun is useless and brought up invaders who are wearing armour. I was just saying that if that's the case, stuff like traps aren't the worst idea in the world. Well. Unless you have small ones in the house. But an AR kind of seems over kill. That's just my opinion. Here in Canada, most people just use bats or something.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2016 18:34:08 GMT
No sh*t it's illegal. But so is attacking someone when armored. And so is using a gun to defend yourself. I'm talking about staying alive. I don't even know if an AR is legal in Canada. Pretty sure defending ones self with a shot gun is illegal too. No offense intended, some are unaware of the fact, just as others may be unaware of forum policy "- intentionally instructing someone to perform dangerous or illegal activity" That falls under the no fly zone. Home invasion, self defense, et al seem ok topics here but it is always good to do a reality check.
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Post by howler on Dec 28, 2016 20:19:26 GMT
I hadn't realized that Canada was such a dangerous country and on the verge of social collapse. I feel fortunate to live just outside Washington, D.C. (as close as I can afford). Virtually nothing ever happens here, except for a bad snowstorm every three or four years. I understand they come from Canada, too. I have stated, in other words, that anything more than a .22 is kind of over kill. Just saying that a shot gun isn't that useless if you don't rely solely on gun. Speaking tactics here. It was in response to the guy who said a shot gun is useless and brought up invaders who are wearing armour. I was just saying that if that's the case, stuff like traps aren't the worst idea in the world. Well. Unless you have small ones in the house. But an AR kind of seems over kill. That's just my opinion. Here in Canada, most people just use bats or something. A .22 is absolute under kill...well, unless you count the AR round (.223) as a .22. Shot guns are great for home defense. Your name is "Trap Door", so of course your gonna think of traps ...and they are a great post apocalypse SHTF idea (after society breaks down when law and order is over). Steel core .223 or .308 (out of my M1A) would be good against body armor invaders. Artillery, tanks, jets, nukes, etc...are overkill. Say, do you know where I might find a good used tank?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2016 20:51:05 GMT
Even with trap loads or bird shot, a pattern thrown from an open choke is still going to be less than three inches at room distances. There is some debate between OO to as small as #4 buck, as well as 2 3/4" vs 3" shells. I was actually pretty good (long ago) with a cylinder bore 24" Mossberg slugster set up and using slugs at 50 yards and more. Trap loads at similar ranges from that 24" cylinder choke still shredding paper targets and would give anyone a bad day across the room. I have considered #4 buck to be the best balance for a home defense 12 gauge but have looked more towards a pistol in my current circumstance. I do live in a "stand your ground" US state with reasonable firearm restrictions and allowances. My '06 actually lives a thousand miles from home in bigger sky territory.
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Post by howler on Dec 28, 2016 21:36:34 GMT
Even with trap loads or bird shot, a pattern thrown from an open choke is still going to be less than three inches at room distances. There is some debate between OO to as small as #4 buck, as well as 2 3/4" vs 3" shells. I was actually pretty good (long ago) with a cylinder bore 24" Mossberg slugster set up and using slugs at 50 yards and more. Trap loads at similar ranges from that 24" cylinder choke still shredding paper targets and would give anyone a bad day across the room. I have considered #4 buck to be the best balance for a home defense 12 gauge but have looked more towards a pistol in my current circumstance. I do live in a "stand your ground" US state with reasonable firearm restrictions and allowances. My '06 actually lives a thousand miles from home in bigger sky territory. #4 to 00 Buck. Lots of good stuff for the Shotty.
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Post by bluetrain on Dec 28, 2016 21:49:47 GMT
Around here, animal control uses a .22 rimfire rifle to kill deer. All I can say is, it's a good think that the deer don't know how weak a .22 long rifle cartridge is.
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Post by howler on Dec 29, 2016 20:13:52 GMT
Around here, animal control uses a .22 rimfire rifle to kill deer. All I can say is, it's a good think that the deer don't know how weak a .22 long rifle cartridge is. Close up head shots, I think. A shot in the lung area from distance would be far from ideal with that round, but you can kill anything with proper placement (even Brown Bear).
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Sean (Shadowhowler)
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Post by Sean (Shadowhowler) on Dec 29, 2016 21:19:43 GMT
Hunting deer with 22 would be, imo, cruel and inhuman. You want a rd that can give you a good clean kill. If Animal control is doing as howler suggests, using 22 for up close mercy killing of injured animals... ok. Anyone who would hunt a deer with 22 or take shots at distance on a deer with a 22... I'd like to kick them n the balls.
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Post by bluetrain on Dec 29, 2016 21:19:44 GMT
Yes, head shots and they sometimes need more than one. But this is a suburban neighborhood with lots of development, so anything else is out of the question. I've never heard of them using silencers but the sound of a gunshot doesn't seem to cause any alarm.
There are lots of wooded areas around here, and in spite of being a county with a population of over a million inhabitants, there are a lot of wild animals, even including a few wandering bears, or so the animal control officer told me the last time I saw one. I've never seen a bear in the county but I've seen everything else: deer, rabbits, squirrels galore, raccoons, beaver (hard to spot), foxes, groundhogs and more deer. We have a deer problem and the deer have a people problem. Currently there is a deer control program in the county which involves bow hunting. So some of the woods are posted and you can't loaf around anymore. It goes through the end of February.
I recall seeing a very old ad for a Colt .25 auto being used to kill some game animal. Possible but not really recommended.
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Post by wvfishguy on Apr 15, 2017 21:44:04 GMT
I never feel undergunned with this Winchester 1300. Modified it myself for a survival shotgun. Eight shot magazine, slug barrel, rifle-type sights, tactical light (not shown). I use 12 pellet 00. Smoothest pump I've ever shot. For heavy firepower, I prefer AK's to the AR. I think of ARs as toys. This Hungarian AMD tanker has a 40-round magazine. .
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Post by bebut on Nov 14, 2017 1:03:44 GMT
My house gun is a vent ribbed 20 pump shotgun with buckshot, always loaded, always in the same location, always buckshot. It is backed up by a revolver. My perceived risk is 1 to 3 lightly armed burglars in a warm climate, with some warning time from the dogs or the noise of prying on burglar bars.
Do I feel under gunned? Just a little bit because of the slowness of the pump shotgun for multiple targets. A semi-auto would be better. A .223 carbine would be better still, if I put a red dot or something so I could snap shoot it closeup. Maybe someday I'll splurge, but I am not that worried about it.
PS: If you are worrying about body armor in a home defense situation, relax, and go for head shots. With buckshot throwing about a 1 1/2 inch pattern at 10 feet you have room to err slightly. Yes, if you are worrying about riots or insurrection, you have reason to worry. Harden your house and buy a rifle. It depends on your community, but I figure my burglar:riot odds ratio is about 1000:1.
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