Sean (Shadowhowler)
VIP Reviewer
Retired Moderator
No matter where you go, there you are.
Posts: 8,828
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Post by Sean (Shadowhowler) on Jan 28, 2016 19:20:21 GMT
I am one of the older members... I opted out of the karma system before we lost the ability to use it... So I am not one who thinks that the karma and like buttons are what made the forums great. What made the old forums great were the people... I just think that chill vibe is over, never to be recaptured.
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Post by RicWilly on Jan 30, 2016 1:35:51 GMT
You can't turn back time. I think the forum was the way it was because it was new and a lot of the members were new. We were all growing together and it carried that excitement and and a certain creativity with it. I still think this is the best sword forum going but speaking strictly for myself, after a certain point it's all been said and done so the excitement dies down a bit and so activity dies down as well. I guess I'm trying to say I still like swords and this forum, I just got old. Lo
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Post by L Driggers (fallen) on Jan 30, 2016 8:29:50 GMT
Think I may have run off a few of the old hands, they didn't like it when I wouldn't bent to their will. Of course I have been on here longer than some of them too.
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Post by RicWilly on Jan 31, 2016 8:30:09 GMT
Hell, Fallen, there were a lot more cantankerous people than you in the old days. Lol
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Post by aussie-rabbit on Jan 31, 2016 11:59:21 GMT
I'm not so sure about Ric Willy, but agree we need karma or like buttons
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Post by randomnobody on Jan 31, 2016 13:10:51 GMT
What we need are people who will post and contribute without feeling the need to be rewarded for it, and people who can express appreciation through commentary and/or questions rather than lazy social media tool buttons.
But I'm old-fashioned...
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Post by RicWilly on Jan 31, 2016 19:42:29 GMT
What we need are people who will post and contribute without feeling the need to be rewarded for it, and people who can express appreciation through commentary and/or questions rather than lazy social media tool buttons. But I'm old-fashioned... I like this. I don't miss karma, It had become a popularity contest in my opinion. As such it was a distraction to me.
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Post by bloodwraith on Feb 7, 2016 5:34:47 GMT
The old karma system became something of a circle jerk that was never a good indicator of things because often people would give karma where it wasn't really due. I think we just have to accept the fact that the forum has changed and that people come and go. This is the fourth rendition of this forum (if my memory serves me correctly) and I don't see a lot of members from back in the day posting. Now if you'll excuse me, I'll go back to being a lurker.
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Post by randomnobody on Feb 7, 2016 13:27:24 GMT
The old karma system became something of a circle jerk that was never a good indicator of things because often people would give karma where it wasn't really due. I think we just have to accept the fact that the forum has changed and that people come and go. This is the fourth rendition of this forum (if my memory serves me correctly) and I don't see a lot of members from back in the day posting. Now if you'll excuse me, I'll go back to being a lurker. - The guy who once had the forum's highest post count
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SanMarc
Senior Forumite
Posts: 3,193
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Post by SanMarc on Feb 9, 2016 8:41:55 GMT
Yeah I have been on here when I think there was only 800 members... I remember when Fallon joined.. And random . and others.... It was eaysyer to have a tighter community... I have been through three server changes.. Seen lots of people come and go.. Had some people go away in a bad way.. But made some good friends despite.... I may not post as much now... Cause I'm couch surfing man... But its hard to keep a good man down!!! I will always be here for SBG one way or another!!
SanMarc.
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Post by L Driggers (fallen) on Feb 9, 2016 8:59:14 GMT
Back in the old days we had fun with our cheaper swords. Didn't put them down because of a few minor flaws. How everyone expects them to be perfect, no matter the price range. We have a new person get on here proud of his new weapon all some can do is point out the flaws, saying you should have saved up more got this instead. Reminds me of SFI.
The same with makers one will post a blade for sale, then another makes will get on talking about all the flaws.
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Post by RicWilly on Feb 9, 2016 13:59:49 GMT
Back in the old days we had fun with our cheaper swords. Didn't put them down because of a few minor flaws. How everyone expects them to be perfect, no matter the price range. We have a new person get on here proud of his new weapon all some can do is point out the flaws, saying you should have saved up more got this instead. Reminds me of SFI. The same with makers one will post a blade for sale, then another makes will get on talking about all the flaws. Word.
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Post by randomnobody on Feb 9, 2016 14:05:00 GMT
Pretty much, what fallen said. The grand cycle of online communities...
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Mikeeman
Member
Small Business Operator
Posts: 2,904
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Post by Mikeeman on Feb 9, 2016 20:43:42 GMT
Back in the old days we had fun with our cheaper swords. Didn't put them down because of a few minor flaws. How everyone expects them to be perfect, no matter the price range. We have a new person get on here proud of his new weapon all some can do is point out the flaws, saying you should have saved up more got this instead. Reminds me of SFI. The same with makers one will post a blade for sale, then another makes will get on talking about all the flaws. Lol. I agree with this, and I'm one of the biggest flaw-pointer-outters. I don't mind flaws in cheap blades, as long as they are justified at the price point. I am 100% for budget swords under $150. Just don't like seeing a sword worth $100 being sold for $500. As is usually the case and the flaw-pointer-outter in me comes to visit. I think there are ways to make this forum fun, again. And I think it starts with getting long-term members involved, again. While there are many super-knowledgeable members that have been here for years, we never see them post. If we could get everybody chatting, again, I think it would bring back that "hang out place" feeling that SBG had before. The problem is... How do we get everybody out of lazy mode and actually posting and kidding around, again?
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Post by Voltan on Feb 10, 2016 5:32:49 GMT
If SBG is reduced to that Facebook page I will be done with SBG. I still come here often, but post less. The like button and karma have nothing to do with that, though I do like both. There are less interesting topics being thrown about. Less people are looking for ideas and more for justifications or soapboxes. What this place really needs is more Ric Willy. I have to agree, I'm not a big fan of Facebook. Posts get buried and can be near impossible to find. No subforums, no review index, the list goes on. I find the atmosphere here to be more pleasant as well. And we can always use some more Ric Willy...
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Post by Curtis_Louis on Feb 10, 2016 8:40:53 GMT
If only we had a RicWilly button, the world would be set right again.
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Post by Bushido on Mar 20, 2016 16:55:53 GMT
I agree that the forum has changed. A lot. Which is probably why I'm not as active as before... The fact that I've been on the move and haven't been generally sword active for a while has also played a part of course, but I have to admit I kind of miss a lot of the stuff from the "Good old days" and I probably would've been visiting the forums more frequently despite those other factors if those days were still around...
I can understand the thinking behind removing karma and like buttons, but I can also understand why people liked them. Without the buttons, people have to actually post and discuss if they want to express their view on something. There is no "lazy option" to give someone a quick like or anything. But on the other hand, I used to think of the karma system as a sort of reward for contributions to the forum. If you made an informative post, or wrote a great review, people could show their appreciation by bestowing karma and a lot of the time people left comments as well. Oftentimes you'd see comments like "Great post man, have some karma! Also, I agree with this and that etc...", and thus the conversation moved forward. So I dunno if those buttons were causing harm only... I think it's possible that people, if left with no "lazy option", opt for the laziest way of all and neither comment nor like. And that doesn't move the forum in any direction at all...
I dunno. I miss the old days, and I miss the karma system. But I don't think the karma system equals bringing the good old days back, that has got more to do with the active forumites and the general spirit. If we're all a bit more tolerant and appreciative of one another, then perhaps we can bring the good old days back without even bothering with a karma system? :)
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pgandy
Moderator
Senior Forumite
Posts: 10,296
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Post by pgandy on Mar 20, 2016 17:11:14 GMT
Interesting that I saw on the news only this week that FaceBook did a survey and found that a written comment had 6X the impact than their “Like” button.
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Post by randomnobody on Mar 20, 2016 18:50:52 GMT
Interesting that I saw on the news only this week that FaceBook did a survey and found that a written comment had 6X the impact than their “Like” button. I'm not at all surprised. I think the biggest problem we're having as a forum is there's less "I bought this and here's what I think of it/here I am using it" and more "What should I buy/can I abuse this?" Even with all the options in the current market, so many more than when this forum was young, we have fewer people actually buying things, and more people...not buying anything, but asking a million questions about what to buy...then still not buying anything. One could go on any economics and necessity versus novelty, but at the end of the day it's always been an expensive hobby and low-end options are limited, but that's why we're here: to treat those low-end options and report our findings, and spread word on what's good and what's maybe not so much. Unfortunately, we seem to have settled into a sort of lull, where everything's been covered and there's just nothing exciting happening anymore, and those of us who used to be so easy to impress just aren't anymore. Many of us now are in the custom or antique market, or only buy very high-end production stuff like Albion, Arms & Armor, etc; anybody else just keeps feeding eBay and hundreds of swords later, it's still unclear what to expect when buying from eBay. Unless you're pessimistic, then it's quite clear to expect disappointment and overspending... There's just not as much to talk about as there used to be, despite the expansion of the market.
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Post by Jussi Ekholm on Mar 22, 2016 0:03:46 GMT
I've been thinking about writing some long ranting post to this thread many times but I've always deleted every reply sketch I've made to this. I think the problem is segregation. In the older days of Internet sword forums there weren't that many places for discussion. You had to jump in to one of the major forums to get more "involved" into swords. Now you have forums, facebook, reddit, youtube, twitter, quick message apps etc. etc. You have a bunch of guys who don't agree with folks on for example on Facebook group, heck they'll make a new one. It's not what my ideal discussion format is. Of course you can't be best buddies with everyone and you will disagree with some people but you need to just get along them like sometimes in real life. I'm not a fan of new groups and new platforms of social media. I'm already a member in so many things it gets troublesome. I know I haven't been as active with giving help as far as production swords are concerned, and I have to admit it is partially due to not being accepted in several closed Facebook sword groups for production swords. I think it's true what Fallen said above that the infamous "SFI phenomenon" has been happening among production swords. I know it's pretty "soft skinned" reason but it hit me bit hard as I saw that not everyone is welcome to some groups (and I've thought I've been as helpful as I can be with my postings over the years). That's not what sword collecting is to me, I think it should be open and accessable by all. Of course on personal level my own collecting is about 100% focused on nihonto. Still I would like to enjoy the fun athmosphere of someone getting a 20$ machete or 99$ katana and enjoy whacking various things with it. As my own collecting preferences are what they are it's kinda difficult to jump into discussions about yet another best 300$ katana in constructive manner. In general I think we as a forum need to be more accepting towards the fact that not every sword needs to be exactly the best that money can buy. I am with Fallen on this one, it's a lot more fun if people get various swords and we can discuss pros and cons of them instead of having everyone recommending the same model and everyone nods in approval. I know I know everyone wants the best bang for buck but at least for me trying out something totally different is part of the excitement that came with production sword collecting. Could an unknown sword be a real hidden gem? That is fun to find out. Sure I've made a lot of bad purchases over the years and I made few excellent ones. Unfortunately I don't think I will be buying production swords for at least couple years, so I'll have to put all treasure hunting on hold. Random had this same idea in his last post. Swords should be fun. Everyone always wants to hear only good things about the items they own and that is only human nature. It is bit discouraging to hear that your sword might not be as good as you think it is, or even not good in general. In this situation it is important to sugar coat the output a bit so you don't directly put the sword down and make the owner feel bad. Or likewise group, organisation, club etc. I know I joked about the "SFI phenomenon" earlier on and it's little bit offensive. However I think I get a pass on that as I was a part of that phenomenon at SFI as I knew I was a sword snob and left production swords for many years for focusing on researching nihonto. I thought my opinions back then were indeed snobbish and not fun for new collectors. It might be the same even as years have passed to this day but at least I try to mask it better. Sword collecting is very small hobby and it's quite hard to get new people interested in the hobby (even more so specifically on nihonto). Like was said earlier we must do something to get discussion rolling a bit more but the question is really what it is? I think Youtube & Facebook have risen greatly in popularity as far as swords go. I am always amazed how short is the attention span of average modern person in this Internet age. Hopefully we can get some good discussion going on in 2016. I think one personal wish would be that M&V's would be more active about things. I know it's a lot to ask for getting people being active as I can't even say how active I will be myself but we need content for discussion. Someone needs to start threads and create that base for discussion. We have this same problem at a Finnish martial arts forum where only few old key members are the ones trying to create threads and keep the discussion going. I hope we get a lot of newcomers to SBG as new people are generally quite active thread starters. I think the S.W.O.R.D and Forged at SBG were great content to the forums and fun to follow. I should have commented more on those as I kept eyeing the Forged at SBG rounds. Yep the same lame excuse, should should should...
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