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Post by dustinf11 on Aug 13, 2015 21:01:53 GMT
Hey guys, I just bought a Hanwei Rhinelander with the goal of re wrapping the handle. So when I got it I immediately took the leather/cord off only to see that the handle is very cracked. What's my options here? I could fill and sand the cracks and continue.. or remove the grip since half the work is done already. Everything still feels solid. I can make a new grip, but I was hoping to avoid that and just reshape this one. As the peen kind of makes me nervous. Here is the worst side: And the other side:
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Post by chrisperoni on Aug 13, 2015 21:09:11 GMT
You're going to want to take that off, clean the glue of the tang, and make a new 2 piece core you glue back on.
That's major failure stuff you have with rose cracks. You don't want to do a nice wrap over it just to have to tear it off when the cracks come back if all you did was glue them.
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Post by dustinf11 on Aug 13, 2015 21:34:04 GMT
I was afraid of that. Sucks because I hadn't even cut with it or made impact with anything.
But, at least I can replace the core with a hickory two piece. Should be quite strong then.
Would you pull off the pommel in my case?
The way the sword is; the core wedges into the cross guard and pommel. It'd be kind of hard to do without the pommel coming off.
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Post by Bryan Heff on Aug 13, 2015 21:39:00 GMT
I would not take off the pommel. Make a two piece grip, like a sandwich and epoxy in place. I have done it many times. You want it tight against the cords and pommel
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Post by dustinf11 on Aug 13, 2015 21:58:38 GMT
Ok thanks for the info.
The pommel slides over the grip for a little less than .25" and the cross guard slides over the grip for a little less than that. It may be difficult to wedge the grip in place because of those factors. But I'll try first.
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Post by dustinf11 on Aug 13, 2015 22:18:07 GMT
I'm not sure how to wedge the grip in between these. It's almost as if the wood will have to bend. This thing has a seriously robust tang though, so that's good. Give it to me straight; how hard is it to re-peen the pommel? Cold peen I believe. Because it would be nice to clean up the peen while I'm at it. But I don't want to shorten the sword much, or ruin it completely. (As it sits now... I've opened a stressful can of worms.)
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Post by chrisperoni on Aug 13, 2015 23:26:44 GMT
You'll have to make the 2 parts of the grip the full length then sand down the circumference on each end carefully to fit.
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Post by jwest on Aug 13, 2015 23:37:07 GMT
It looks like Hanwei has changed the hilt components since 2011. The pictures in sword construction data base thread are quit different. First are you able to unseat the cross? Second is their any movement in the pommel?
Edit: Or maybe Findlithui removed the integral ferrules.
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Post by dustinf11 on Aug 13, 2015 23:38:36 GMT
So, since I want to fix the ugly peen of the rhinelander's pommel, I've decided to go through the whole process. I'll document it here, incase there's someone doing something similar. Kind of a beginners tutorial. Knocked the pommel down and filed the peen. Then I grabbed a nice piece of hickory, cut it down to size, cut it in half on the bandsaw than jointed the two sides on a jointer so they'll glue nicely. Thanks for the help guys. this will be an adventure for certain. They seemed to have grinder too much when fitting the pommel, and had shims on all four sides. Is this normal, standard practice for lower end production swords?
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Post by jwest on Aug 13, 2015 23:46:22 GMT
Hanwei has gone to a full compression type hilt construction. The keyed inserts in the cross and pommel are not present. That is why the pommel is shimmed. Also what did they shim the pommel with?
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Post by dustinf11 on Aug 14, 2015 0:05:41 GMT
Thin wood shavings. About an inch and a half long.
Once I got the pommel off and started cutting wood it all got better. Wood work, I've got down; at the risk of sounding pompous. Metal work however.. I'm clueless. I have a metal lathe downstairs that's never been used in 6 years.
Aswell, When it comes to swords and pommels, I'm clueless and always worried about the components loosening.
I know most sword grips are made from poplar. Is there something I don't know? It seems hickory or even oak would be stronger. Maybe not period correct?
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Post by jwest on Aug 14, 2015 0:18:43 GMT
Poplar grows fast like pine, some species even faster. Therefore abundant and cheap. Its also very soft and easy to work. As to the hilt components loosening you can shim them or back peen them. This is why I asked what they used to shim the pommel. How thin are the wood shavings? Are we talking one millimeter or less? Or are they thicker, more like a wedge?
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Post by dustinf11 on Aug 14, 2015 0:41:41 GMT
The shims are .46mm fairly consistently across the whole thing.
I'll probably make some hickory veneers to replace them when I reassemble it.
Makes perfect sense about the poplar. Thanks for the info. You guys are all really helpful and kind.
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Post by dustinf11 on Aug 14, 2015 1:58:17 GMT
I don't know if anyone will find this interesting or helpful... but I'm going to continue documenting my progress anyway. When I searched for rhinelander mods I only found two and they were amazing, but didn't show the progress. So, why not. Measure and trace the tang onto the two hickory pieces. I measure so they are as close as possible. The tang on this is pretty uneven overall, so this may be a challange. Using a dremel with router attachment to get the grip hollow. I may be too detailed... this is my first thread like this, so I don't know what's considered normal. Honestly.. I'm just copying what I think I'd see in a build thread.
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Post by jwest on Aug 14, 2015 2:06:12 GMT
The shims are .46mm fairly consistently across the whole thing. I'll probably make some hickory veneers to replace them when I reassemble it. Makes perfect sense about the poplar. Thanks for the info. You guys are all really helpful and kind. You are welcome. You can get steel shims down to .15mm. I would use steel instead of wood. But wood will work and was used in the past. And keep posting your progress. Jim
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Scott
Member
Posts: 1,676
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Post by Scott on Aug 14, 2015 2:28:54 GMT
Detail is good. Looking forward to seeing how this turns out.
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Post by Croccifixio on Aug 14, 2015 3:33:22 GMT
This is very nice. Keep at it! I'm following the build closely. Hopefully you can do something fancy or elegant with the leather or the risers? :D
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Post by dustinf11 on Aug 14, 2015 3:45:17 GMT
Thanks guys!
Yeah, I plan on doing a waisted grip with some (hopefully well placed) risers.
Just thinking out loud.
The two piece core should work really well running the two pieces over the jointer made for a really flush fit- which hopefully translates into a stronger grip.
The tang on this thing is very thick, which made the core, despite being overly fat, kind of thin on the edges. I plan on going thinner, so I need every bit of strength I can get.
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Post by dustinf11 on Aug 14, 2015 3:51:19 GMT
jwestGood call getting metal shims. That's absolutely what I'll do. I may even have some the right size. I have them from shimming guitar bridges and nuts.
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Post by jwest on Aug 14, 2015 4:08:38 GMT
jwestGood call getting metal shims. That's absolutely what I'll do. I may even have some the right size. I have them from shimming guitar bridges and nuts. And thats exactly what I used. Floyd Rose saddle shims.
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