Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 30, 2011 21:31:55 GMT
No duels, kind sir, crusade. I appreciate the insight, I think the DSA 12th century is just what I'm looking for.
It's Conan-ish :mrgreen:
|
|
|
|
Post by dylanholderman on Aug 31, 2011 3:34:32 GMT
ok this i will agree with.... . . . when you are swinging a 6ft+ war sword! the conan sword is only 38 7/8 in long thats only two inches over three feet  . and like i said i will agree that the extra weight will make it hit harder but can you even imagine the recovery time :shock: you would be dead be fore you could swing it three times |
|
|
|
Post by Lonely Wolf Forge on Aug 31, 2011 3:44:51 GMT
Grow Stronger :lol:
|
|
|
|
Post by Federico on Aug 31, 2011 4:13:38 GMT
Crom laughs at your DSA!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2011 4:23:49 GMT
:lol: I don't think Conan needed that many swings for a kill. Crom works for me at CASTLE GREYSKULL.  |
|
|
|
Post by dylanholderman on Aug 31, 2011 12:39:15 GMT
my point was that for what is basically a one handed sword blade length you dont need that much extra weight if you want it to hit harder all you have to do is take a little weight off of the pommel add a little weight to the blade and bang! your sword hits like its an axe but has better handling and when i was talking about how slow it would be my point on that was with its length all you would have to do is step back when he swings and then step in and kill whoever is using it with a 6ft war sword im not so sure you would be able to do that considering that it is almost twice as long. see where im coming from  |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2011 17:15:08 GMT
It's the tip velocity that produces the most destrucive cut. Yes, speed kills. I think that REH got this instinctively, but some film makers wanted something large and easy to photograph.  |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2011 22:29:00 GMT
I see, agreed....for now. :twisted:
|
|
|
|
Post by dylanholderman on Sept 1, 2011 2:53:26 GMT
lol ok agreed for now :lol:
|
|
|
|
Post by 14thforsaken on Sept 1, 2011 4:24:03 GMT
Its basic physics. Force equals mass times acceleration. Considering that for most people, every unit of mass that is reduced they will be able to generate more than one unit of acceleration (within certain limits) acceleration is generally going to have a greater effect on a blade's power.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2011 7:48:06 GMT
So Conan was hindered by his sword? That feels weird.. I suppose Conan would fall to the Jedi knight and the probable weightlessness of his lightsaber, but what if we " :!: " it and face-off five barbs, with their eight lbs toothpicks, and five Knights with a weightless whipless blade (blade?) and see who comes out. :mrgreen: +
|
|
|
|
Post by 14thforsaken on Sept 1, 2011 12:13:27 GMT
I'd be more than happy to go up against a barbarian with an 8 lb sword armed with my Kreigschwert.
|
|
|
|
Post by Lonely Wolf Forge on Sept 1, 2011 12:28:22 GMT
but what everyone forgets s, Conan is so strong it doesnt feel like 8 lbs to him, it feels like a weightless lightsaber and he wields it as such. just cuz were too weak to use it doesnt mean he is :]
|
|
|
|
Post by dylanholderman on Sept 1, 2011 13:11:26 GMT
ok but not if he is human lol.
and even if he is that strong wouldn't he be able to strike with a lighter sword that much faster?
if he can swing a 8lb sword like it weighs 3lbs how fast can he swing a 3lb sword :shock:
|
|
|
|
Post by humblepie on Sept 1, 2011 13:38:40 GMT
Speed isn't everything. Sometimes you want more force.
Remember F=MA but the equation is a bit unequal in regards to how much more mass contributes to total force than acceleration.
If two opponents are dueling and armor is NOT an issue, then you want as much speed as you can get. Because it doesn't take force for a sharp object to penetrate the human body. But if armor is being used, then you want more punch to get through said armor if your speed can not break through your opponents defenses.
So it all depends upon the circumstances. However, a lightsaber (not that they are real) would make armor useless by any stretch of the imagination. At which point you would want all the speed you can get.
|
|
Lunaman
Senior Forumite
Posts: 3,974
|
Post by Lunaman on Sept 1, 2011 14:42:56 GMT
That's the thing, though--speed gives you more force. Doubling the mass of a sword will double the force of a strike, but doubling the speed of the strike instead will nearly QUADRUPLE the impact force. Agility is the most valuable asset of a sword--otherwise you could just use an axe. There's a reason the vast majority of historical swords fell between 2 and 4 pounds in total weight, regardless of shape and style.
(acceleration is not the same thing as speed/velocity; it's the derivative of it)
And no sword can "punch" through armor.
|
|
|
|
Post by 14thforsaken on Sept 1, 2011 15:25:12 GMT
Even if the opponent is wearing armor, there are always gaps in it. There is also hydrostatic shock where the force of the blow is transferred into and through the armor and can do severe blunt force trauma and damage the armor as well. But all things considered, a mace or such like is a much better weapon for penetrating plate.
And Luna is right about acceleration. Speed is a finite value at a given point in time. Acceleration is the rate at which the speed is changing. That is why it plays a larger role in the calculation of force than mass.
Besides, whether I run a 3 lb blade or an 8 lb blade across your throat at 60 mph (a speed that many people can reach), you're just as dead from the 3 lb blade. Given that the recovery and control are much likely better on the lighter sword, there really isn't a overwhelming reason to use an 8 lb sword, unless your using it as more of a mace/club than a sword.
|
|
|
|
Post by Anders on Sept 1, 2011 16:15:07 GMT
Hmm, you sure those aren't newer issues? The art-style on several of those covers strike me as very 90:s era, when oversized weapons were sort of in vouge.
On all the ones I've read, the covers have a very distinctive look - more like actual paintings, really. I may try to get some scans up later.
|
|
|
|
Post by Lonely Wolf Forge on Sept 1, 2011 16:25:43 GMT
its kind of the same principle as me, being 6 ft 290 lbs doesnt wield the same sword as a 4 ft 11 95lb asian guy. While he is fast and agile with his 26 inch bladed katana, a person of my build is equally fast/agile with a 36 inch blade that's much heavier. So a barbarian such as conan being 6ft + and strong as hell, wielding his 8 lb sword like you or i would wield a 3 pound sword is on par with us, if not better off for him because he has the extra power behind the blade. i wouldnt want hit by an 8 pound sword swung by conan even if i had full plate armor, a head on chest blow would most likely still break all my ribs, give me severe whiplash, and knock me ass over applecart to boot.
|
|
|
|
Post by humblepie on Sept 1, 2011 16:26:41 GMT
Exactly. Armor prevents lighter swords from reaching their mark. Yes, no armor is all encompassing, but most people are going to "protect" weak spots in armor by deflecting, dodging, or preventing in any way they can a weapon from hitting weak spots. If you only aim for the "weak" spots in someone's armor they are going to figure it out pretty fast to prevent that. I know I would.
Actually, this is why when self defense classes are taught for women to prevent rape attacks, for example, they teach women NOT to go for certain weak spots on a male assailant. Why? They are too well guarded. The crotch and eyes are taught to be tertiary targets and not primary weak spot targets. The thing is, the human body as a whole is designed to protect "weak" spots on ourselves. Our eyes for example. Our ability to lean backwards and dodge blows, along with a protruding brow and nose, help protect our eyes from attacks very easily. Same with the recess of our neck from the front. The ears on our head isn't so protected because they are harder to see a blow coming and lateral movement of the head isn't as nearly an easy dodge without losing our center point of balance. That's just an example.
So the point I'm making is that if your opponent knows his weak spots, you are only left to deal with getting through his armor in some way. A heavier sword is going to have an easier time than a lighter one depending upon the armor type.
Anyhow, swords are like baseball/softball I alluded to earlier. Swing the heaviest you can possibly swing without sacrificing speed to do so. For example I swing a 27 ounce softball bat because it maximizes the force I can exert when hitting a ball. Anything heavier than 27 oz I can actually feel and it slows down my swing some. Anything lighter than 27 oz doesn't increase the speed of my swing much at all. I know some much bigger guys though that swing 32 -36 oz bats though like I swing my 27 oz ones. The correlation between maximizing the force of a softball swing to swinging a sword against an armored opponent is very close in terms of wanting to maximize the force output.
Sure some weapons are MUCH better at punching through different types of armor than swords, but those weapons are more specific in nature with the versatility of a sword to accomplish other types of attacks. For example a spiked mace can punch through plate armor where a sword would have much more trouble. But a spiked mace has a harder time getting past someone that can defend themselves well with a shield or has greater reach with a long weapon. Nor does a mace make for an effective weapon to parry other weapons. They are too top heavy for that purpose.
So while an 8 pound sword is pretty much useless to anyone in the "real" world, I don't think it would be so for a "Conan" type of person. A man with the strength of 10 other men would not be swinging around a 2 pound sword. He wouldn't be maximizing the amount of force he could exert.
|
|
. and like i said i will agree that the extra weight will make it hit harder but can you even imagine the recovery time :shock: you would be dead be fore you could swing it three times
Herron's Flight by Brendan of Fable Blades
