"Like an extension of the arm."

For me that phrase applies when you are holding a sword that is balanced JUST right for YOU.

That's tricky, and a lot of factors go into it... length of your arm, arm shoulder and wrist strength, size of your body, personal preferences... then with the sword itself you have mass distribution and harmonics, profile and distal taper, weight, length... and so on.

No mater how many stats I read I find its imposable to truly know how a sword will feel 'in hand' until, well, you HAVE it IN HAND.

Some feel awful to hold and swing.... and some just 'fit' like they belong there.

Those later ones are the ones I say 'feels like an extension of my arm' and it varies from sword-type to sword-type which ones fit that bill.

[quote="Sean (Shadowhowler)
Some feel awful to hold and swing.... and some just 'fit' like they belong there.

Those later ones are the ones I say 'feels like an extension of my arm' and it varies from sword-type to sword-type which ones fit that bill.[/quote]



Note, I wasn't actually trying to be funny. But if you say so...



Interesting. So, would you two say that to you the phrase just means: "A sword that feels good in handling"? I think I go with a more literal enterpretation, so for something like that I'd probably rather use a phrase like "feels like it was made for me" or something.

We can agree that "good handling" is subjective not only depending on your taste and preference but also the type of sword, right? I guess what stumps me is that I don't think "feels like and extension of the arm" is a very subjective statement. Rather, it seems to descibe something very specific.

If I were to define a sword that feels like the extension of my arm, I'd say this would imply a level of blade control comparable to the control I have over my actual arm - reaching out and hitting something with the sword should be as easy as reaching out and touching it with my hand. Likewise, recovering the sword after an attack should feel as natural pulling my arm back after reaching for something.

So far I've only handled one sword I that matches this description - another antique, which was so light and well-balanced that I could move it around with as good as no effort at all. Though, I'm pretty sure that's not something that's universially equivalent of good handling in all swords. (Or all swordsmen, for that matter.)



Yeah, but that's just it: I never said my saber doesn't feel great, I just said it doesn't feel like an extension of my arm. That's why I was curious about wether or not there's any kind of consensus of what that phrase means.

Almost effortless is what it describes for me. It points well in other words.

The blade doesn't need you to work to maneuver it, it follows you and the only work you have to put in is on your form.
It follows you and tracks without one having to really concentrate on controlling the blade.

Clear as mud eh?

I've handled some swords that feel like you're waving around a floor lamp that happens to have an edge on it. I'd say "extension of the arm" is the opposite of that, though obviously it's going to vary by person what exactly it means.

I've never heard it applied to swords before though, only golf clubs. But then I don't really hang out around many sword buffs...

This is were I think Sean's practice of handling as many swords as possible is self-defeating. the more I read your posts Anders the more I come to understand what you mean in a different light. to me the sensation you are describing is starting to sound more like a perception of the swordsman's instead of a quality of the sword. some swords are going to be more sensitive than others and therefore they will be easier to feel that body-like sensation. I suspect your brother is just saying that the saber feels great and that is his way of expressing it. I would bet that if you put him to the test that he couldn't control it like a body part. that is something that comes only with intimate familiarity with a particular thing, be it a baseball bat, a golf club (karma for any one who can tell me the movie in which you hear the line "my 7 iron is an extension of my semprini"), a tennis racqeutte, or a sword. it takes hundreds of hours to develope but once you have it, it is hard to lose even after many years you can pick it up again and feel it better than most people would. maybe not to the same level as you used to. to find a sword that is so well tuned to you that you can pick it up and have it feel like it is part of your body is a rare and magical thing but you can achieve that feeling with a dead stick of rattan if you practice enough with it.

so now I have spoken of two different things:
how well suited a sword is physically for a particular person which will aide in the swordsman's perception and the perception itself built from long practice. both ideas can fit the particular phrase.

and before someone states that there's no way a sword made so poorly it feels like a floor lamp (not picking on you I just love that description) could ever feel like a part of your body, I say it CAN. for those of use who used to be younger and stronger and thinner we know just how cumbersome your own body can sometimes feel. but it is still yours and you still have detailed feeling in it even if it isn't fast or agile.

For me, this expression would indicate a sword that behaves just the way you want it to. A sword that feels like it could be manipulated and handled by sheer thought, just like your arm does. You don't think when you use your arms, you just use them and they do what you want them to. A sword that feels like an extension of the arm, for me, must behave in the same way. Do what I want it to do, without me having to really think about it or having to force it to behave the way I want it to.
If this has to do with the balancing point of the sword, the weight, the length or some completely different feature of the sword (or even a combination of factors) I don't know, this would in all probability depend on the user. I believe that you will feel it when you've found a sword that behaves like an extension of the arm.

I don't have a lot to add but what interests me is what sword you guys think to feel "like an extension of your arm". Sean, you mentioned two or three only felt that way... may I asked which these were and what part of that feeling was caused by the quality of the sword and what part by your taste in blades?

Yeah, to me it means a sword I can move as effortlessly and precisely as a part of my own body.

Any good sword should feel natural and intuitive to handle, of course, assuming you know what you're doing with it. But there are some that go that extra step beyond "good" and almost seem to move on their own, like they're actually working with you instead of just you waving around a sharp piece of dead weight - like a living extension of your arm. It's a really uncanny feeling.

It can also be highly personal, some people and swords just snapping seamlessly together while others don't. It's the little things, really, all the little details of the sword's design and your physiology and training coming together in fortunate coincidence - just the right blade length for your build, just the right balance and weight for your preferences, a grip just the right length and thickness and shape for your hands, with a texture you like, a guard the right size and shape to do its job without getting in the way, even aesthetics that please you... You know, fits like a glove, or a piece of a puzzle.

Of course, for the most part, with most swords for most swordsmen, it's simply a matter of experience. In the immortal words of Ivan Dolvich, "Gun, all gun, like finger on hand."

Hard to parcel what percentage of my comfort with a particular sword has to do with the quality of its make and the prefence of my tastes. The only swords out of all the ones I've owned and handled I would think of as an extension of my arm are...

My Tinker XIV 'Ridding Sword'.

This is likely a 50/50 deal for me. Its super light, short, with good profile and distal taper... which is all stuff I prefer in a single handed blade. Its also amazingly well made... Tinker does exceptional work. Its one of the best balanced blades I've ever seen... its very simple looking but you can FEEL the craftsmenship the moment you touch it.

My LPM Atrim 1516

This sword, being a Low Polar Moment design of Gus's is basically weightless in hand... and once you get it moving its a light-saber. Its just the most responsive sword I've ever handled... it does whatever I want it to do effortlessly. However... aside from its amazing construction its shaped just like I like... a large 8 inch grip... a slightly shorter 33 inch blade. Just love the thing.

Those two... out of 500+ swords I have handled (and many of them owned) are the only ones I would use the 'extension of my arm' description for with 100% certainty...

Other that come close and might get the description as well as I have more time with them of if I had the chance to get more time with them would be...

Tinker XII Sword
Odinblade Type Xa


Also... I just acquired a couple new Albion's and the Atrim Austrian WarSword Tom raves about... and my first impressions are good, but I'll have to play with them a bit to see if I bond with them.