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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2010 22:03:06 GMT
oh, I know man, my U's are also nonspecific. it's so hard to tell sometimes if someone is typing with anger or direction lol. no offense intended to anyone but, are we so naive to think that we actually have that much control in our Government? I by no means consider myself a conspiracy theorist but I'm also not blind deaf and dumb. and although I'm not marching up to the white house I'm still entitled to express my opinion. how many of these types of rules and regulations are in place strictly because of the effort to save money in litigation and not for any concern about public safety? do you (general you) honestly think that Joe official really cares that little billy will get his eyes burned out or is he more concerned that billy's mom will point the finger at him causing him to loose the next election and be forced to give up his cushy job and padded pockets. this is of course leading back to not being able to buy and own a Katana in the states which would be devastating for me simply because I love them so much and has become a big part of my happiness in life. not all of us can afford to join a Dojo (UK license and such) or have the skills to make our own It used to be I would have agreed with you completely here. However...finally seeing the changes in my own state on illegal immigration, after enough people stepped up...has restored much of my faith in our government system. Not all of it lol...but a decent amount. Oklahoma is a concealed carry state, but we could become an open-carry state soon. I am in favor of that, for the following reasons 1. you can see who's armed 2. It saves me the money by not having to pay for the permit, and not have to buy a new gun, I can carry my 1800 something colt 38-40 sixgun, which there is no way in heck I could conceal except in winter If by concealed/open carry you mean that as of now you have to have a license to carry a firearm in public at all...Arizona is not that way (never was). ANYONE who can legally own a gun can carry it in public. There used to be restrictions on HOW you could carry it, meaning if you were to carry it concealed, you had to be licensed for that. But otherwise you could carry it strapped to your forehead if you chose. Now though, if I recall...anyone who can legally own a gun can carry that gun in basically any manner they choose. In your boot, under your coat...back of your pants... Not so good. Cris
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2010 22:18:13 GMT
Cris, the way the law is now in OK, you have to have a permit to carry concealed. There is no legal way to open carry, unless you are law enforcement. If your concealed carry pistol should become visible, that would be a violation, unless you were actually using it in a defense situation. Of course you can have anything at home w/o a permit. Open carry here would make it easier to carry, in the summer heat here, it becomes much more of a challenge to keep anything but a small pistol concealed. Obviously, the heat in AZ is even worse Sometimes I am surprised anyone can stand to live there in the summer
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Post by wiwingti on Jun 18, 2010 22:40:09 GMT
me, personally, being a huge star war fan, don't mind or think about using it,, it is just the fun/pleasure, to have something like that.
yeah i know, it is dangerous, and i would never use kind of things like that on anyone.
it is just the pleasure to have a star war laser/ a laser/i am like a kid when it comes to have gadgets,
sorry if i shock anyone here.
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Dom T.
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Success, depress, ambition. Progress, regress, recognition.
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Post by Dom T. on Jun 18, 2010 23:34:41 GMT
Um, wow. Sorry about starting a whole political argument or something. Sorry if I pissed you off, steckfretman. I just personally have no clue what a laser like that is for. Or the flashlight. I probably should have phrased my post a bit more nicely or something. Anyways, I guess I wouldn't mind being enlightened upon what that sort of laser and flashlight can be used for... other than setting paper on fire. I understood that part. I'm kinda hoping that you have to be 18+ to order one, kinda like with swords... or... zippos (?). I mean, a kid younger than that could still get one if they wanted it badly enough, but just putting in an annoyance like that can be a decent enough deterrent, I think. Seems to me that younger kids will do dangerous things just because they're bored.... So because of that, I get the image of some kid standing at the corner of an intersection blinding people driving by. What bugs me about concealed carry is... like, carrying a fixed blade knife concealed is illegal here, so if you were to carry one, you'd have to have it in the open, no? But if you had it in the open, wouldn't someone feel the need to call the cops on you? Dunno, just thinking aloud here. I'm feeling a wee bit peckish. Anyone have some apple pie they'd like to share with me? ;D
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Post by Cottontail Customs on Jun 18, 2010 23:45:09 GMT
you're right Cris, about not giving up on trying to get things changed. I guess I just got a little disheartened after my entire neighborhood including myself protested for 2 months by signing petitions and writing letters to stop a government aided drug rehab/halfway house with a terrible reputation from opening up right across the street with no result. there are a huge number of kids that play in the area and since they've been here there have been slashed tires, graffiti and worse. I have also been a part of the massive protest against the horrible commuting conditions involving the MTA subway system which gets worse by the day and costs more every few months. this was NY city not the government but still. we should not give up or give in but sometimes it does seem pretty useless. I just can't shake this horrible feeling that someday we will really have absolutely no say and a few powerful people will be making all of our decisions for us for "our own good". I could just say that I hope I'm gone before that happens but what about those who are still here? scary because it might very well be true and it will start with the smallest of things. hasn't it already begun?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2010 3:29:55 GMT
All I can think of is the laser pointers we sell at work. They have a label on them that says "do not point at eyes" Half the time people pick them up and shine them in their face just to see how bright they are, or they think its funny to point them at other people eyes. And these ones can blind permanently,instantly.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2010 3:45:09 GMT
Yeah....I gotta go with Chris Anderson on this one, especially the point of somebody using these lasers anonamysly. That's pretty much the whole show. When you buy a firearm, they do a background check to verify who you are, and they keep a record of what you bought.This is a good thing, unless your a scumbag criminal who wants to buy a gun(FOR WHATEVER REASON)! Dangerous weapons SHOULD be kept out of the hands of PROVEN dangerous and UNRESPONSIBLE humans. Also, I think you will find it is much easier to "zap" a human in the eye with a laser than it is to shoot, or hack, or slash or physically fight with a human. Trust me. using a laser to blind a person (accidently or otherwise)will always be much simpler and uncomplicated, not too mention much less messy. you would probably be better off getting shot or stabbed or assaulted, because your assailant would be more likely to get caught either doing it, or being witnessed doing it. The FBI can get ballistics readings from shell fragments and match a bullet to a gun. Forensics experts can determine what sort of bladed weapon cleaved into a man. How the hell is anyone going to know how Jane Doe got blinded walking her dog? These lasers dont seem to leave many clues. FINAL ANALYSIS: Background check (just like when you buy a handgun) and certainty of RESPONSIBLE ownership. Also, if the purchaser is going to carry it, CCW should be required. Honestly people- selling and buying these lasers is really no big deal, as long as THE RIGHT PEOPLE HAVE THEM. I don't know a firearms enthusiest or weapon collector who would disagree with me on that point.Perhaps I'll find one today....
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2010 3:58:23 GMT
By the way- I had no problem with the store performing a background check on me when I purchased my pistol, and I would have even less problems doing another one for one of these lasers if I was going to buy one. If someone was sempriniing about not being able to get these PERIOD, I would understand all the fuss. DANGEROUS TOYS REQUIRE RESPONSIBLE HUMAN OWNERSHIP. Also, if these should be available to just anyone for any price, then would that include convicted felons and rapists and murderers and pyromaniacs!!???If you answered yes you are a fool.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2010 4:38:39 GMT
No one here has pissed me off, I just get a little riled up when people think, "I don't need this," and decide NO ONE should need it. I live in NJ, so it's something I see a lot. ("You have a snow blower? Those are too dangerous! You should just pay a plow service, like WE do!")
I wouldn't mind the concept of control if it would actually help. I jumped through the hoops to get my firearms ID, and then more hoops for every pistol I want to buy. The government ends up with a strict record of every handgun I own. I'm a law-abiding citizen, so I purchase my firearms through legal channels.
If I was willing to commit a crime with such a weapon, what makes them think I'd go about purchasing the gun legally? You think there's a member of the Bloods sitting at home, waiting for his pistol permit to arrive so he can go to the local gunshop and pick up the Glock 21 he put a down payment on last week? HELL no. People who want guns for illegal purposes will get their hands on them no matter how strictly we tighten the fist of gun-control.
In the end, it just makes things harder on those of us who choose to follow the law.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2010 5:18:49 GMT
I didn't say no one needed it. I apologise for being safety conscious, how utterly ridiculous of me to be safety conscious in regards to something dangerous...oh wait we are on a sword forum, swords can be dangerous. Should swords be regulated? No, but then I can't reach out from a distance of a mile and inflict damage on a person with one. Guns are one thing, but these types of lasers are dangerous and how do you know they wont permanently damage peoples eyes? Have you heard of laser eye surgery? Corrective laser treatment? Lasers are used to fix peoples eyes so why is it such a stretch to believe that a laser this powerful (the video demonstrations show how powerful) and these lasers are extremely powerful, far more powerful than even the green lasers that can be seen up to a mile away, wont do instant and irreversible damage to the eyes? Have they done tests on human eyes to see if the blindness is only temporary? I mean theory is all well and good and to theoretically say that it only does temporary damage again is all well and good but they haven't tested them on humans (nor should they) and therefore we can't know. I wasn't talking about banning them, I just think no good can come of them being an open market item.
I guess while we are outlawing things we may as well outlaw curiousity, I mean how many cats are injured or killed by it weekly? How many humans for that matter. We could just outlaw emotion all together I guess.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2010 10:45:24 GMT
No, that's pretty much exactly what you said, bloodwraith: For military purposes I can see the benefits, however for civilian use, no effing way in the slightest! And you weren't the first with that reaction, either. Dom T was more explicit with, "I don't see a use for it, it shouldn't be available." Page 2.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2010 11:36:03 GMT
I saw mention of its ability to cause ANONYMOUS damage, and instantly compared to the way people act on the internet.
Does the possibility for damage mean it should be kept away from people? If that's so, where do you draw the line? Does psychological damage count? Economic damage?
There was a case a few months ago of a young girl driven to suicide by "cyber-bullying". Should we lock access to the internet or to networking hardware because they could fall into the hands of sickos and molesters?
Things are dangerous. Their potential for danger shouldn't mean these things should be completely removed from civilian hands. Limited on a permit basis? Maybe. Then again, I think permits should be required for childbirth. But that's just me.
Just remember that in the end it's decided by our government and our government is made of PEOPLE. People just like us, only with fancy titles. People who got where they are NOT by being the BEST, but by having the most connections, the most money, making the most promises to the most people, or any combo therein. THESE are the people deciding if I should be allowed to own a firearm, if trans-fats should be banned, if Happy Meals should be outlawed, if ILLEGAL immigrants should have equal footing as LEGAL ones, etc.
(A note to non-US members: the previous list consists of ACTUAL laws brought about by ACTUAL law-making bodies, be they on a local, state, or national level.)
My point is, who's to decide what an appropriate reason is for ownership? With such a powerful laser being so new to the general public, new purposes could spring up like bamboo. Sciences, like testing reflectivity of materials or further-reaching laser-thermometers! Art, be it laser-engraving, precision wood-burning, or even incorporating the actual beam into a piece! Who knows what else?
Look at the Wii-mote (the motion controller for the Wii). Sure seems like it's uses are limited, but I've seen them linked to a computer via their Bluetooth signal and used as motion sensors for computer animation. This is because there are people out there who can and DO find uses beyond what may have been strictly intended for a given device. It's these kinds of people who are hopefully getting their hands on these lasers, and will be coming up with ways to astound us when they post a video on Youtube and cause people to say, "Holy balls, who would've thought you could do THAT with a laser?"
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2010 12:03:22 GMT
. Also, if these should be available to just anyone for any price, then would that include convicted felons and rapists and murderers and pyromaniacs!!???If you answered yes you are a fool. Wow that made me think.....Drive by arson. Theres a nasty little surprise.
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Post by Cottontail Customs on Jun 19, 2010 13:53:10 GMT
has there ever been a case where someone with a gun permit or license and a full backround check being performed before said permit was given has taken the life of someone else? do we really believe that just because someone would run the risk of getting caught that they wouldn't decide to take the chance anyway? what do these precautions really amount to? if one is going to act irresponsibly, there really isn't anything anyone else would be able to do to prevent it. will the fact the Joe nutjob never did anything illegal before therefore was able to get a permit, magically fix the persons eyes he just burned out?? yes, they might catch him but it won't reverse the damage already done. anyone remember the crazy sniper that was shooting his victims from way up on a hill and was able to elude capture or even being spotted for many days and many victims later? wasn't he a war vet that someone once thought should be shooting a gun. the fact that people have to be registered to own a gun does not prevent the possibility of them using it to harm another. it does however prevent the ones who sold it from being held responsible as well as the state officials who set up the precautionary rules, and yes the suspect did pass all the back round checks, he was a model citizen who helped his elderly neighbor take out her trash and babysat the other neighbor's kids. "hey, we did everything required before selling him the gun but he just went nuts, so don't blame us!"
it's not about what, why or where, it's about not being able to decide for ourselves. you can't give up your say on just a few things, it will eventually be all things. throw out your matches, lighters, cutlery, guns, roller skates, every pebble near an overpass, shoelaces, plastic bags, bow and arrows, folding knives, thin pinky fingers with sharp nails, family guy video collection..........................................................oh wait, you have a permit? oh okay then. the permit will put back together Sally skull fragment's head. the guy's son got into the closet and found the licensed gun and it went boom? oh , well since dad was a responsible guy who had a permit it's now only just a tragic accident. gun owners wanting to ban a laser, no? you just want the purchaser to fill out a form then all is okay? I'll decide for you and you'll decide for the other guy and now we have a lot less to worry about. humans are hell bent on destruction and killing others, of course not you, or your friends and family just those irresponsible crazy people who didn't have a license to kill. what does any of this matter? the topic is the freedom to choose and the freedom to make decisions for ourselves. the guy who grants permits just shot his wife who has been cheating on him. from a mile away. with a hunting rifle. and a silencer. shhhhhhhhhh no one knows it was him. oops, now he's busted through the science of forensics. OMG, his wife just stood up!!! she's fine!!!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2010 15:29:13 GMT
They should make C4 easy to get by mail order. It would be neat to have some just to say I have some.
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Post by Cottontail Customs on Jun 19, 2010 16:19:14 GMT
Yeah....I gotta go with Chris Anderson on this one, especially the point of somebody using these lasers anonamysly. That's pretty much the whole show. When you buy a firearm, they do a background check to verify who you are, and they keep a record of what you bought.This is a good thing, unless your a scumbag criminal who wants to buy a gun(FOR WHATEVER REASON)! Dangerous weapons SHOULD be kept out of the hands of PROVEN dangerous and UNRESPONSIBLE humans. Also, I think you will find it is much easier to "zap" a human in the eye with a laser than it is to shoot, or hack, or slash or physically fight with a human. Trust me. using a laser to blind a person (accidently or otherwise)will always be much simpler and uncomplicated, not too mention much less messy. you would probably be better off getting shot or stabbed or assaulted, because your assailant would be more likely to get caught either doing it, or being witnessed doing it. The FBI can get ballistics readings from shell fragments and match a bullet to a gun. Forensics experts can determine what sort of bladed weapon cleaved into a man. How the hell is anyone going to know how Jane Doe got blinded walking her dog? These lasers dont seem to leave many clues. FINAL ANALYSIS: Background check (just like when you buy a handgun) and certainty of RESPONSIBLE ownership. Also, if the purchaser is going to carry it, CCW should be required. Honestly people- selling and buying these lasers is really no big deal, as long as THE RIGHT PEOPLE HAVE THEM. I don't know a firearms enthusiest or weapon collector who would disagree with me on that point.Perhaps I'll find one today.... would forensics be able to find the rock thrown over the overpass at a drivers window who was doing 70mph by a guy who thought it would be fun to see what happened? the rock bounced off the windshield into the ditch that was filled with 10,000 other rocks just like it. there weren't any witnesses and that one rock caused a 3 car pile up with fatalities. the lovable respected honest hardworking guy licensed to carry a gun went berserk and shot someone in a mall in front of 200 witnesses but because we know who did it and it wasn't an anonymous killer it's okay? or should we now ban ALL handguns. so we manage to determine who all of the "proven dangerous" or "irresponsible" people are up to this point and now that that's taken care of it's impossible for those people to act differently. how dare they lie to us and betray our trust! and for me, if I had to make a choice between being blinded anonymously buy someone who will never be caught or being stabbed to death or shot in the head or "cleaved into" by someone on record who will go to jail.............hmmmmmm............tough decision. are you saying that as long as they can catch the assailant it is then a better death or injury? a reflection by a shiny watch on the wrist of a guy driving on the highway will not permanently blind someone but could cause another driver to look away just long enough to not see the car in front of him to hit their brakes. the driver thank goodness, was not permanently blinded by the guy he never saw but instead is now 150 ft. in front of his car with his head through the back windshield of the car in front of him. ban shiny watches? no, we will just check the records of the one who wants one and issue a permit. again, where does it end? maybe tonight I will walk down to the projects and ask to see the permits of all the guys who have guns. I'll let you know how many of them had one tomorrow after I resurrect myself
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Post by Cottontail Customs on Jun 19, 2010 16:33:52 GMT
They should make C4 easy to get by mail order. It would be neat to have some just to say I have some. why bother? just look under your kitchen sink for the right mix. wasn't it C4 from a mail order catalog that the unabomber used? oh, wait no, it was all home made.
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Post by Cottontail Customs on Jun 19, 2010 16:44:07 GMT
Also, if these should be available to just anyone for any price, then would that include convicted felons and rapists and murderers and pyromaniacs!!???If you answered yes you are a fool. were these roving gangs of laser toting convicted felons and rapists and murderers and pyromaniacs all born as such? a maniac has to start their life of crime sometime and before the first incident went on record they were probably considered the nicest people or at least not who they eventually became. how many times have you seen the shocked neighbor on the news state that the insane guy with a body in his trunk next door was "the nicest guy and never caused a problem"
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2010 17:15:19 GMT
I can so see teens using these things on the third floor of a shopping mall to burn someone on the first for a giggle. We might as well make silencers standard for all guns.
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Post by Cottontail Customs on Jun 19, 2010 17:51:53 GMT
why not educate yourself? It might save you some embarassment. www.wired.com/autopia/2008/04/big-safety-risk/Now take into account that these lasers are like 100 times more powerful. I don't think it is a high powered laser pulse rifle at all but I do think they are extremely dangerous, regardless of burning people or whatever, it is dangerous. You go ahead and purchase one, that is your prerogative. how many airplanes actually went down in this article? how many people were actually killed? I think we have to worry more about the alcohol and drugs the pilots take or wayward unlicensed seagulls more than laser pointers. how many car accidents on record were due to the driver smoking pot (with nothing else detected in their system) find one report and post it. we can't just run around and ban things that "could potentially" cause injuries. and it's almost laughable to think that terrorists have just been waiting for laser pointers to be available on the internet so they can finally do some real damage
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