Razor
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Today is tomorrow but not yet yesterday
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Post by Razor on Jan 15, 2008 8:55:49 GMT
Bloodwraith, genetics has a lot to do with strength and size, next is diet, what you eat and when you eat is very important, then it's training.
People have different body types and to get the best results you need to train what is best for you.
It sounds like you fall in the lean and lanky body type, which is the hardest to gain any mass fat or muscle.
What is your diet? How many meals do you eat a day? What do you do when you work out?
You should be eating every 3 hours,at least 5 meals a day, you could probably do 7 meals a day. If you do a lot of cardio, you need cut it down and do more strength training.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2008 9:43:49 GMT
Yep tall and lanky is definitely me. My diet is eating what I can when I can, unfortunately to eat the way I know I need to would be beyond my already tight budget but for the most part I eat alot of pasta, meat, fruit, rice and those sorts of things. I like to eat healthy and because of my allergies I am forced to eat healthy. I try to eat three meals a day but often it is down to one, again due to circumstance. I do alot of push ups, stomach crunches, running, martial arts and combat training and re-enactment. I was sick for years which also is probably why my body is the way it is, now I am trying to rebuild it so that I can do all the things I want to do. I was doing weights and strengthening exercises and need to get back into them. My dad taught me jujitsu from a young age and the work out elements that go along with that.
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Post by Brendan Olszowy on Jan 15, 2008 11:12:56 GMT
Its good to see a bunch of motivated people here. Warriors, thats what we are. We need to make a forum army, and infect the rest of the populus with zombie blood, then we'll be in business.
Tsafa, keep the posts coming, as you know I'm a HUGE (*flexes bicep casually*) fan of weight training and think you're a real and inspirational athlete / warrior. Kick that Butt man.
BTW my max on a barbell overhead is 85kg twice, but like you around 32kg per dumbell for 6. No you can't lift as much with dumbells but yes they build up more stablilizers, and allow your hands to travel via a central plane, wheras a barbell needs to com in front of your face or behind (NOTE: NEVER lift or pull to behind the neck kids)
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2008 11:29:43 GMT
Bren: how much do you bench mate?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2008 11:48:16 GMT
Hi Bloodwraith, When it comes down to it, once you've gotten enough vitamins and minerals, protein (approx 2 grams per kilo of bodyweight per day is going to be plenty - the research actually suggests less is fine and the more trained someone is the less they need) and essential fatty acids if you take them, a calorie is a calorie. Meal frequency doesn't seem to matter that much for body mass... there's some research indicating that intermittent fasting is good for health... but sticking all your food in one meal is bad... etc.
Some people when increasing their energy intake seem to increase their 'non-exercise activity' accordingly, so eat more - move less could be the solution. Liquid nutrients may be helpful for you and that doesn't have to be limited to protein powder, which is hideously expensive in Oz... dairy products are cheap and a dense source of energy.
Running, pushups and crunches are good for endurance, but unless you're using high muscle tension such as doing sprints and plyometric pushups they're not going to be much of a stimulus for muscle growth.
Training for muscle growth has never been my goal but since 2004 I've added about 20kg to my frame after being around 55-60kg due to glandular fever and military training exercise requirements (endurance based). My training has not been consistent due to niggling injuries that pop up whenever I'm less than careful (have been using machines recently in the gym to decrease the demand on my unstable joints... yay for a free 3 month trial/gift) ... but I think that my bodyweight increases the most when making strength gains. Recently in my work sets (generally about 4 of 'em) I don't use much less than 80% of my 1 repetition maximum.
I hope some of that is helpful and best of luck!
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Post by Brendan Olszowy on Jan 15, 2008 11:52:58 GMT
Classic weight lifting question. I bench dumbells, coz I don't have a spotter. But my best when I did have a spotter was 112.5kg (248lb). I know it doesn't sound real hollywood but it's pretty heavy. Not as impressive considering I weight 93kg (105lb). These days I'm old at 31 and bench up to 40kg DB for 7r.
What is impressive is that when I was 15 I weighed 62kg and used to bench 93kg for reps! Damn I wish I competed. Instead I sucummed to chasing some semprini and somkin' the good stuff. Didn't get back onto the steel til I was 21. What a loss.
However when I was 21 I went hard at it with supplements, and training 3 times a week, and ate 6 times a day including a ton of MILO and Weetbix, and went from that druggo 65kg to 98kg in 18 months.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2008 12:09:35 GMT
I can't drink milo which is a shame, I can bench about 80 kilos and on a lifting machine i can do 120 but that isn't impressive. I wish I could eat 6 times a day but that would cost more money than my budget will allow. Weetbix are good, I never smoked anything in my life, except enemies in call of duty united offensive.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2008 12:31:58 GMT
That's a very impressive weight gain for such a short amount of time Brenno!
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Post by Brendan Olszowy on Jan 15, 2008 12:59:06 GMT
Never touched Roids, I promise. But you must put on some fat. You cant build muscle without a coloric excess, so some fat is likely.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2008 13:35:53 GMT
Heh, I am skin and bones and so is my dad which must mean that I won't gain weight, Oh well i will just have to work with what I have, maybe swinging around my chopper when I get it will help.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2008 14:50:04 GMT
On 5000 kcal per day I'm sure you could gain at least some mass.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2008 15:00:42 GMT
yeah but what does that equal out to in regards to food? I've never been a calorie counter.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2008 15:35:34 GMT
I used www.calorieking.com.au to make this table. I certainly don't suggest that this is healthy, but I know that I could certainly eat all of those things in a day! 5000kcal was an extreme example, what I'm trying to get across is that (excluding a severe medical condition) with an energy intake beyond your daily expenditure you will gain body mass - no matter how lean you are now. Something to keep in mind also, is that a significant portion of any mass gained even without resistance training will be lean mass (includes connective tissue), for some numbers... www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10865771
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2008 16:30:25 GMT
Vy: Wow, I eat in excess of that every day, judging by that I would eat about 10k of calories a day in rice and pastas and things. My metabolism is ridiculously fast which is also a problem and I exercise alot.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2008 18:07:36 GMT
Vy: Wow, I eat in excess of that every day, judging by that I would eat about 10k of calories a day in rice and pastas and things. My metabolism is ridiculously fast which is also a problem and I exercise alot. try eating bunches of meat, eggs, no burgers, and work with weights. or go to gym. Or play video games! I do all of them
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2008 18:37:00 GMT
I'm trying to work out what is going to work best for me for my re-enactment but I haven't found a formula yet that will do everything I need it to. I have strength from martial arts but not the sort of strength it takes to wield a sword and shield for up to an hour and a half at a time. I take protein powder but I can't put on more weight or muscle than I have. Tsafa: What is the best way to work with what I have if all I have is 65 kilos, 143 lbs and I am 6'3"? I know what works in the martial arts that I do but our swords and shields are alot heavier than I am used to, add to that eventually wearing chainmail and I could be in trouble unless I learn to use the strength I have. Any help is appreciated. Check out my Getting Stronger webpage. There is a whole bunch of tips and suggestions on there. There are 4 different workout routines geared for strength athletes. mysite.verizon.net/tsafa1/workout.htmWhen you say wield a sword and shield up to an hour and a half at a time, I have to assume that this is not continuous and you are finding ways to rest in between. Most of my fights don't last more then 10 minutes. It may last 15 if the fighters are being very conservative and very defensive. Historically, both Romans and Greeks rotated their front lines. They fought for about 8 minutes and then a whistle was blown. They had a technique where the second line would step forward with shield open in front of the first line. When they closed their shield, the front line step back. They would rotate all they way back to the last row in that manor for a drink of water and a rest. If the lines were 8 rows deep, the last line might not fight for an hour. They only time they might have to fight continuously is if they were flanked, in which case they would likely loose. They are a lot of guys in the SCA that are distance runners. That does not automatically mean that they can fight much longer then the average fighter. They are other variables involved such as armor, weapons and that fact that you fight in short bursts. That means you throw a 2 to 4 shot combination and then recover and evaluate the situation. Your muscles work more like when you are lifting weights, rather then running or doing an elliptical machine. It takes lot more energy to fight with full power in armor then out of armor with light shots. I have fought outside the SCA in situations were we use less armor and lighter sticks. Totally different fight when you don't have to hit hard. Your endurance jumps right up. However, in reality those shots would not be effective. I think this deference is reflected in you martial arts training vs your armored re-enactment. Bloodwraith, given that you are doing re-enacting rather then fighting, that is a trick that you can use, if you don't already. Don't hit as hard. You will save a lot of energy. Also use your lower body as much to generate power. This is a big energy saver. Twist the hips to give the sword momentum. Another thing you can do is rest you sword on you shoulder and shield on you knee when not actually fighting. That is a big energy save too. So think conservation rather then generating more energy. Brenno, thanks for your nice comments.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2008 5:33:16 GMT
very true tsafa
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2008 10:15:25 GMT
Vy: Wow, I eat in excess of that every day, judging by that I would eat about 10k of calories a day
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2008 20:12:23 GMT
The latest fad based on tried and true sound principles... www.12second.com/Not much different than yoga but involving more load bearing than using bodyweight alone. I prefer to go to this place. All the manuals are free to download and the methods are reliable. www.sandowplus.co.uk/Competition/compindex.htm#liedLots of info out there and a lot of it is very good thanks to the internet.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2008 4:44:52 GMT
Shmoopiebear, the old time manuals are very interesting but sports science has come a long way since then... some of the old exercises are somewhat unsafe and their training methodologies were suboptimal... but it seems that many of the old time strongmen were fairly strong because they were genetic freaks
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