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Katana
Nov 25, 2009 17:03:52 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2009 17:03:52 GMT
The person planning on attacking the machine gun nest has to be sneaky, and also have others distracting the people in the machine gun nest by shooting at it and keeping them occupied while he sneaks in behind. Hey, maybe it only worked in those old movies , if the guy sneaking up on the enemies in the machine gun nest has his own machine gun or a grenade, then he can kill everybody in the machine gun nest and he wouldn't have to die himself . If the machine gun in the machine gun nest still worked, he could turn it around and shoot at the enemy .
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Katana
Nov 25, 2009 17:24:20 GMT
Post by randomnobody on Nov 25, 2009 17:24:20 GMT
Ask Audie Murphy.
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Katana
Nov 25, 2009 17:56:41 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2009 17:56:41 GMT
I have heard a story which I have tried to verify by searching on the internet, and have so far failed Maybe someone else has heard of this. The Dutch were fighting with the Japanese inside of Japan, and there was a battle that was going very poorly for the Japanese. The Dutch had a cannon emplacement on a hill that was raining down hell on the Japanese, when a lone Samurai warrior snuck up the hill, raced up to the bronze barreled cannon, and sliced 1/3 of the way into it, rendering it useless. Of course, as soon as the Dutch troops on the hill got over their momentary shock, they killed the courageous Samurai warrior, but the cannon was out of action. The cannon, with the sword still in it, is supposedly in a Dutch museum for all the world to see Anybody else know if this is true
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Katana
Nov 25, 2009 17:58:44 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2009 17:58:44 GMT
Audie Murphy indeed...he was the prototypical soldier...
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Katana
Nov 25, 2009 18:09:43 GMT
Post by randomnobody on Nov 25, 2009 18:09:43 GMT
I have heard a story which I have tried to verify by searching on the internet, and have so far failed Maybe someone else has heard of this. The Dutch were fighting with the Japanese inside of Japan, and there was a battle that was going very poorly for the Japanese. The Dutch had a cannon emplacement on a hill that was raining down hell on the Japanese, when a lone Samurai warrior snuck up the hill, raced up to the bronze barreled cannon, and sliced 1/3 of the way into it, rendering it useless. Of course, as soon as the Dutch troops on the hill got over their momentary shock, they killed the courageous Samurai warrior, but the cannon was out of action. The cannon, with the sword still in it, is supposedly in a Dutch museum for all the world to see Anybody else know if this is true I can't seem to find any history of Japanese VS [the Dutch] warfare...plenty of trade and combat alliances between the two, though... Maybe it was somebody else? The idea of a sword "cutting" into a significant portion of the right bronze cannon doesn't strike me as particularly outrageous...but it all depends...
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Katana
Nov 28, 2009 1:02:37 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2009 1:02:37 GMT
I believe that this man's purpose in creating that video was to end the rediculous hype of the katana, not to prove that one weapon is better than another, etc.
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Katana
Nov 28, 2009 3:30:33 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2009 3:30:33 GMT
I don't know if it is real, but I can tell you that in any age cannons specifically and artillery in general was 1) terribly well protected (cannons were really expensive, even for kings, so they didn't wanna loose them) 2) never left as a single unit, so slicing through one of a few hundred cannons would do very little good, this is supposing one could pass through the people guarding the cannons and the people manning them, who surely had guns/swords/knives to prevent any such event, which seems a tall order for James Bond, nevermind a person clad in clanking armor which would reduce their speed and their ability to blend in, especially since the Japanese believed radiant-colored armors inspired one to do great deeds in battle (as well as become an easy target for guns/bows, but that just my take on the issue).
All in all, I frown at the possibilities of this story to be true, but, it might...
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Katana
Nov 28, 2009 3:42:52 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2009 3:42:52 GMT
I disagree about the clanking armour thing and the reduction in speed. If you have worn that armour every day of your life, like the samurai did when training and practicing you wouldn't be inhibited by it. The way japanese armour is made cuts down on the amount of noise it makes. Cutting into a cannon with a katana, well I don't think so, not the thickness that a cannon needs to be to be viable, bronze or not. I'm not sure where you get the idea that the Japanese believed in radiant coloured armour? What colour is radiant anyway
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Katana
Nov 28, 2009 7:45:54 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2009 7:45:54 GMT
I disagree about the clanking armour thing and the reduction in speed. If you have worn that armour every day of your life, like the samurai did when training and practicing you wouldn't be inhibited by it. The way japanese armour is made cuts down on the amount of noise it makes. Cutting into a cannon with a katana, well I don't think so, not the thickness that a cannon needs to be to be viable, bronze or not. I'm not sure where you get the idea that the Japanese believed in radiant coloured armour? What colour is radiant anyway Among other places, it was mentioned in the History Channel documentary Warriors by one of the Senseis talking about the Bushido (I know I have said before people shouldn't base their theories on the History Channel, but this was actually said by a Japanese master of Bushido and I think I saw it in some other place as well), by radiant I mean bright red/yellow/green/etc. I am not sure how "clunking" Japanese armor is, so I will give you that, but I am pretty sure that if you are wearing 40/60/80 lbs. on you and plus some kind of flag on your back (I don't know the Japanese name, but I know everyone had to have them in battle) being nimble is out of the discussion.
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Katana
Nov 28, 2009 21:15:57 GMT
Post by randomnobody on Nov 28, 2009 21:15:57 GMT
Good armor is not restrictive at all. Modern soldiers carry even more weight. Colors weren't always bright and flashy and not everyone was a standard bearer, nor was every man a samurai.
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Katana
Nov 28, 2009 23:01:24 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2009 23:01:24 GMT
So you are saying that carrying around thirty extra pounds is not even slightly hindering to the fighting man? Modern soldiers do carry around a heavy load, but they also don't have to sword-fight.
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Katana
Nov 28, 2009 23:04:24 GMT
Post by shadowhowler on Nov 28, 2009 23:04:24 GMT
So you are saying that carrying around thirty extra pounds is not even slightly hindering to the fighting man? Modern soldiers do carry around a heavy load, but they also don't have to sword-fight. I would not say it is NO hinderance... but if a warrior was wareing well made armour, sized to fit him... and was well trained in its use... the hinderence to movement would be minimal and the protection offered by the armour would FAR outweigh the very slight restriction in movement.
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Katana
Nov 28, 2009 23:12:52 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2009 23:12:52 GMT
So you are saying that carrying around thirty extra pounds is not even slightly hindering to the fighting man? Modern soldiers do carry around a heavy load, but they also don't have to sword-fight. modern soldiers carry about 80 lbs on them, but they are not used to sneak behind enemy lines. Scouts and specal ops, the people who do go behind enemy lines carry a much lighter load and don't have heavy weaponry or lots of ammo, because frankly they would use weapons only in the outmost end of need, most of the time they need to kill enemies stealthily and quietly, so they mostly use knives and in some times, crossbows. I agree with randomnobody that not everyone was a samurai, but this myth talks about a samurai and the katana would probably be a samurai's weapon, the others being probably equipped with naginatas and yamis and so on and so forth. Unlike many people, I know armor was designed for perfect mobility, but you put a glove on and your movements are confined, nevermind if your whole body was encased in it.
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Katana
Nov 28, 2009 23:26:20 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2009 23:26:20 GMT
I agree with you both, Shadowhowler and george. It would be somewhat restrictive, no matter how well-made, but the protection would make it worth wearing.
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Katana
Nov 29, 2009 1:42:50 GMT
Post by randomnobody on Nov 29, 2009 1:42:50 GMT
I don't know about you guys, but I wear gloves every day. My hands lose nothing but immediate perception of contact. Even the clothes I wear pose little to no restrictioj to my movements, and what are clothes but gloves for the body?
Armor has enough joints, hinges, and moving parts to allow a near-full range of motion. Modern soldiers still do a fair bit of running, ducking, even diving and rolling and I'm sure they're just as accustomed to doing so in their full gear, with armor, might I add. Granted, their armor is a little different now.
I think some of us are overestimating armor, or underestimating the trained soldier.
Either way, a katana would totally cut a house in half.
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Katana
Nov 29, 2009 1:57:01 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2009 1:57:01 GMT
Either way, a katana would totally cut a house in half. Yeah, but that's nothing compared to cutting a hill in half.
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Katana
Nov 29, 2009 2:08:46 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2009 2:08:46 GMT
I don't know about you guys, but I wear gloves every day. My hands lose nothing but immediate perception of contact. Even the clothes I wear pose little to no restrictioj to my movements, and what are clothes but gloves for the body? Armor has enough joints, hinges, and moving parts to allow a near-full range of motion. Modern soldiers still do a fair bit of running, ducking, even diving and rolling and I'm sure they're just as accustomed to doing so in their full gear, with armor, might I add. Granted, their armor is a little different now. I think some of us are overestimating armor, or underestimating the trained soldier. Either way, a katana would totally cut a house in half. indeed they do, but none of them have been reported to have gone through half a battalion without being seen I don't know what kind of gloves you wear, but every glove I have worn so far in my life restricts a bit what I can do. For example, I can do the classic "gun" with my hand, but I can feel pressure between my index and ring fingers. If I try to extend my fingers as far as possible from each other, I can feel resistance between each. This is with my baseball loves made out of leather and cloth for extreme flexibility, I would wonder how much harder this would be with metal gloves... Now, I am not saying that any of this restricts my movements that much, but if I were covered from head to toe in steel I could do far less... just to illustrate better, if you were a Dutch soldier charged with protecting the cannons and this guy was strolling by, do you really think you would miss seeing him???
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Katana
Nov 29, 2009 3:00:54 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2009 3:00:54 GMT
So you are saying that carrying around thirty extra pounds is not even slightly hindering to the fighting man? Modern soldiers do carry around a heavy load, but they also don't have to sword-fight. modern soldiers carry about 80 lbs on them, but they are not used to sneak behind enemy lines. Scouts and special ops, the people who do go behind enemy lines carry a much lighter load and don't have heavy weaponry or lots of ammo, because frankly they would use weapons only in the outmost end of need, most of the time they need to kill enemies stealthily and quietly, so they mostly use knives and in some times, crossbows. I think you'll find in most, if not all 'behind enemy lines' special forces scenarios that the soldiers involved would end up carrying heavier loads including more ammo, water and specialist equipment. These guys need to be self sufficient remember. An example of this would be the 'Bravo Two-Zero Patrol who were carrying well over one hundred pounds of equipment each. These guys were used to such loads but it definitely hindered them all the same.
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Katana
Nov 29, 2009 3:07:57 GMT
Post by randomnobody on Nov 29, 2009 3:07:57 GMT
Hell, I wear gloves that fit. Leather gloves. I have little to no restriction. Probably because I wear them so much that I've softened 'em up. That guy doesn't look like he'd have a hard time moving. Hiding, maybe...depends on terrain. He doesn't seem to be wearing gloves, either... Metal gloves? Most of their gloves would have been leather or fabric...IF they wore hand and finger protection it would have been jointed plates, probably only on the backs of the hand and fingers...but what do I know, I've never worn armor. You compared it to a body glove, and I would point to a gymnast. Get the right glove. Could also well be that perhaps our samurai fellow simply managed to charge in and not get shot somehow. The story doesn't really say how close the two sides were, cannons aren't all super-long range. I imagine a lucky man could run all the way into a cannon crew without meeting prepared resistance, though for all we know he snuck through the woods somehow and jumped from a bush.
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Katana
Nov 29, 2009 3:08:50 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2009 3:08:50 GMT
Considering the guy strolling by in that photo is about 80 and the fact that you know, he is a ninja, probably not. I mean Grandmaster Hatsumi is the be all and end all of Ninjitsu and with all that distilled wisdom can probably become invisible.[/sarcasm]
As to armour inhibiting movement and the loads that modern military carry. Spec ops don't carry a huge range of heavy gear and when my brother goes bush with the reserves he is carrying about 75 kilos on his back and I have never seen it inhibit him that greatly. Most samurai armour didn't not weigh 75 kilos last I checked.
Katanas are some awesome they can cut chuck norris in half.
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