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Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2008 14:52:59 GMT
this is my shin guntomy granfather faught in WWII, he was good friends with his commanding officer. they were both stationed in japan. when the japanese surrendered they surrendered thier swords, my grandfathers lifelong friend and commanding officer brought a japanese officers sword home with him, they it lay, for many years, only gathering dust and rust. some years ago when this man passed, the sword was left to my grandfather, he treasured it as a a symbol of his friend and a bond they shared. saddly my grandfather passed away earlier this year. i never knew this sword existed, until i found out that it had been left to me, someone who allready collects katanas. i will never sell this sword. i will treasure it as my grandfather did, and at the end of my days pass it on accordingly. when i hold this sword i can feel its spirit resonating through me. i know relatively nothing about this sword i was wondering two things firstly what can anyone tell me about this blade and secondly i am not interested in its value, i will never sell it, i am thinking however about trying to restore it to its former glory, i imagine that my first step is rust removal. i have just won some metal glo, i have never encountered it before and i am wondering will it be ok on this sword. thanks in advance everyone.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2008 15:01:24 GMT
Kudos on wanting to restore it. The rust doesnt look to bad especially since it has been sitting around for probably close to 70 years and was never taken care of. I use metal glo on my swords and it does the trick to remove light rust You could give it a try and see what it does. You may have too use some sand paper to remove the heavy stuff. It looks to be chipped in a few places if it is worth it to you it may be worth it to have some one actually polish the blade and remove not only the rust but to remove any of the other damage. As far as the rest of the sword goes I would take it all apart and just try to clean it all up remove the old grime from it and try to keep it authentic with all the original parts.
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Post by randomnobody on Nov 16, 2008 19:27:40 GMT
I would definitely contact a (domestic) polisher. It looks like it could be a fine blade under there and if it is, it deserves a proper polish. Don't touch it with sandpaper or metalglo until you hear what a pro has to say.
Definitely worth restoration, though, especially for the sentimental value.
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Post by 293master293 on Nov 16, 2008 20:20:37 GMT
Wow. You are one lucky bas... er..... hand-and-a-half! BTW, war steel always seems to be pretty resistant to rust, just kind of a quick note.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2008 20:35:32 GMT
Congratulations on owning a true piece of history, sorry about your grandpa.
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slav
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Post by slav on Nov 16, 2008 21:10:23 GMT
Can we see the tang of the blade? That could tell us infinitely more than what can be seen now.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2008 21:57:22 GMT
id take it to a polisher and get ALL the damage removed it looks like a very nice blade and it would be worth the money to restore it properly also i agree it would be worth restoring if not just for sentimental value
also i give you my condolences for your grandfather
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Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2008 23:18:56 GMT
thankyou all for your kind words, with regards to the tang i am not yet in a position where i feel comfortable taking a katana to bits, whilst i have been collecting swords a few years i have only just begun learning how to use them, my sensei in iai has said he is going to be guiding me through this in the near future, so i will be able to show you, just not yet.
as for a profesional polisher, i'll have a look around my area.
so is the general consensus on metal glo a no?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2008 0:31:13 GMT
I dont see any harm in trying it, but if your going to get it professionally polished then I see no reason to do it. As far as taking it apart it is simple just knock the pins out and pull the Tsuka off.
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Post by randomnobody on Nov 17, 2008 0:51:27 GMT
I wouldn't bother with metalglo. It's not really agressive enough to do any irreversible harm, granted, but at this point it's best left alone until proper care can be rendered.
Good idea waiting for your sensei to show you the ropes before diving in yourself. Disassembling a katana is a tricky business for a beginner, and I certainly wouldn't try it on a piece like this first. Any number of things could go wrong and you could ruin the furniture (heaven forbid the tsuka wood has rotted any) so it's best to leave it be.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2008 2:34:55 GMT
Ken, congrats on such meaningful inheritance you've got To me, it's far more meaningful than any other thing$ ... Your grandpa sure dot on you in his life time, ya? It'll be exciting to be able to restore it to its former glory, though most antique dealers will advise you otherwise Pls promise to have it reviewed (you may want to avoid the cutting part) once it has been restored, pleassseee.... Once again, congrats!
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Post by salvatore on Nov 17, 2008 3:18:05 GMT
I would say, NO to the metal glo.
No way, it may not be a strong abrasive, but you certainly cannot possibly expect a beautiful polish on such an incredible peice to come from an 8 dollar tube.
AND you definitely don't want to do it yourself, I'm sorry but it was a bad suggestion. You don't want even the slightest risk of screwing that sword up, especially seeing as it holds such sentimental value.
Send it to a Togishi, (Sword sharpener) he'll sharpen that beauty up and make it shine like new, just as it was meant to look like.
Also have to say, applying pressure unevenly can also screw up the geometry, another good reason to not have a novice touch it.
Just keep it on a stand, and don't let any irresponsible friends near it!!!
At any rate, beautiful work of art, that rust doesn't seem bad at all, it can still be saved.
Sal
P.S, not trying to sound like a jerk, but katanas were meant to be sharpened by hand, not by metal glo.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2008 7:10:28 GMT
First, I give my condolences to your grand father , he served his country in the time of need with honor and now he may rest in peace.
I have a mixed feeling about restoring the shin Gunto because those chips ,nick and scratch came from battle and have value of thier own but it is also nice to restore it to its original glory.
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Post by tajima on Nov 17, 2008 9:12:09 GMT
A) Don't even think about the Metal Glo. Sure, it can't do too much harm, but if it has survived in it's current condition for these seventy years I wouldn't do anything to it. B) You touch sandpaper too it I will be very sad. If it is a fine blade, sandpaper from someone with little to no polishing experience will ruined the geometry forever. C) Definitely get it polished by an ACCREDITED and RECOMMENDED polisher. Don't take it to a Jo-Blow, they will do more damage than good and there are cases of no-name polishers stealing swords of value. D) It's quite chipped, quite pitted and the fittings aren't in the greatest condition, but I cannot see any fatal flaws (from the photos you have given us). C) Quote from John Yumoto's "The Samurai Sword" regarding Shin-Gunto: "In the Showa era many blades of this type were turned out by government shops or by unskilled smiths between 1937 and 1945 and have little or no value..."D) If you were to remove the tsuka CAREFULLY and with the right tools, and post pictures, we could determine the smith, quality of the forging, and if it has a Showa stamp (A cherry blossom design with the character for "Sho" in the centre.) Hope that can be of some use, and please don't try anything yourself without good recommendations. I recommend you read this: www.geocities.com/alchemyst/military.htmThanks, -Tajima
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Post by Tom K. (ianflaer) on Nov 17, 2008 12:37:57 GMT
I agree, do not attempt to polish/sharpen/repair this sword on your own in any way. I have become pretty good at hybrid polishing my modern production katana but I wouldn't touch something like this for love or money. a professional togishi will cost you dearly though, so unless this sword turns out to be a significant work of art I would suggest you oil it with traditional choji oil and keep it just like it is. either way you need to get your sensei or someone to help you remove the tsuka so you can determin who made your sword and when. also realise that some swords are "mumei" or unsigned and this doesn't mean they are of little worth. a good appraiser can identify a sword's school of craft and approximate time period by examining it (I think it would need to be in good polish for that, not sure though) even if there's no signature.
to sum up: oil it don't touch it (the below is optional) get help to remove tsuka get it identified get it polished and appraised by professionals oil it and don't touch it.
and just to tease you: it is known that there are a handfull of unfound katana/tachi blades of significant value that were lost to the USA during WWII. some are so valuable that the US government has agreed to return them to Japan if they are found. I believe there are at least two or three known Masamune blades that were surrendered to us and then lost with no accounting of them. is yours one of these? probably not but you never know, get it identified.
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Post by tajima on Nov 17, 2008 20:39:14 GMT
Spot on. Yes, a professional Togishi will be very expensive and the chances are this sword is manufactured by a machine or inexperienced smith. Very true. It will reveal all. Well, I truly doubt this will be Mumei - it will most likely be stamped or dated. Appreciate your blade, it is awesome to have an antique. A blade done by a well-known smith does not mean it is of 'significant value' - a ruined Masamune isn't worth anything. It's just a Masamune. It is rather difficult to return swords to Japanese owners, especially tracking down the family, getting it through customs and of course they need proper identification for them to keep it. And yes, it is still cool to think that your blade is one of higher value than it really is, but the chances are so slim that it is quite ridiculous to think so. Sorry, just saying the facts. It's still very awesome to have an antique blade like this that has seen battle. Treasure it, admire it, care for it and keep it for the next generation. Thanks, -Tajima
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Post by Tom K. (ianflaer) on Nov 18, 2008 10:29:35 GMT
you're absolutely correct Tajima, I was just throwing out some of the fun possibilities. honestly the chances of having a masamune are like the chances of hitting the lottery. but if you buy a ticket. . . you DO have a chance. it is still wicked cool to have a nice antique no matter what the value.
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Post by tajima on Nov 18, 2008 20:32:42 GMT
Thanks, -Tajima
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