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Post by severroad on May 4, 2020 3:10:40 GMT
Long story short, first time I cut with it, it chips. Reached out to Cas Iberia and they were very polite, but basically tell me plastic water bottles will damage any sword. I only cut some water bottles for fun, didn't see any damage. Moved on to a single used tatami, and I notice the chip. Their inexpensive Raptor will cut through anything without any damage, but this high quality bainite L6 can't cut plastic or single tatami? What is the actual difference between Howard Clark and Hanwei bainite L6 (probably shouldn't mention those two in the same sentence), and MAS/Motohara L6, or Motohara Sgt? I polished the chip out, lost a lot of edge, but I hated that rough black stripe anyway! Edit, there is no hamon to be found on this oni! Attachments:
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Post by AndiTheBarvarian on May 4, 2020 3:19:23 GMT
In theory the Clark and Hanwei L6 Bainite blades have a tougher spine than Motohara L6 without bainite heat treatment. The edges at the hamon are always hard and brittle, there isn't the bainite, it's in the spine area beyond the hamon afaik.
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Post by zabazagobo on May 4, 2020 5:23:10 GMT
"plastic water bottles will damage any sword". Yeah, no. That's b.s. This seems to be another account of Hanwei's L6 not hitting the mark. They don't seem to get the heat treat right and these swords' edges damage readily.
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Post by randomnobody on May 4, 2020 7:01:03 GMT
Repeat after me:
"There is no such thing as a super steel. It is more important to know how to treat the steel you're using."
"There is a vast gap in quality between production, even "high-end" production, and a skilled, individual, custom smith."
Other than that, "[stuff] happens."
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Post by zabazagobo on May 4, 2020 7:16:46 GMT
Repeat after me: "There is no such thing as a super steel. It is more important to know how to treat the steel you're using." "There is a vast gap in quality between production, even "high-end" production, and a skilled, individual, custom smith." Other than that, "[stuff] happens." LOL. Now, repeat after me...
"L6 is a **** of a steel to work with correctly.
Edge geometry is important. Healthy "niku" is your friend.
Break blade until they bend.
Hmmmmm.......??!!!!
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Post by randomnobody on May 4, 2020 7:23:58 GMT
Repeat after me: "There is no such thing as a super steel. It is more important to know how to treat the steel you're using." "There is a vast gap in quality between production, even "high-end" production, and a skilled, individual, custom smith." Other than that, "[stuff] happens." LOL. Now, repeat after me...
"L6 is a **** of a steel to work with correctly.
Edge geometry is important. Healthy "niku" is your friend.
Break blade until they bend.
Hmmmmm.......??!!!!
Well, yes. I went the short-and-simple route.
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Post by zabazagobo on May 4, 2020 7:26:06 GMT
LOL. Now, repeat after me...
"L6 is a **** of a steel to work with correctly.
Edge geometry is important. Healthy "niku" is your friend.
Break blade until they bend.
Hmmmmm.......??!!!!
Well, yes. I went the short-and-simple route. I know. Just have to provide fodder. I mean, this forum is for fun, so have fun, eh?
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Post by randomnobody on May 4, 2020 7:31:21 GMT
I know. Just have to provide fodder. I mean, this forum is for fun, so have fun, eh? But of course.
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Post by severroad on May 4, 2020 8:22:17 GMT
These are very thin Matt cutters, but plastic will damage any sword? That ugly wavy lines at the tip 5160 200 dollar monotempered Raptor with similar geometry, didn't chip when I cut through the caps on the water bottles. I didn't expect this oni to be a light Saber, but it chipped like glass - leaving one side of the edge fine, with a large flake of steel missing down the other side. It looks like different types of steel instead of an actual hamon? I guess if you want L6, you have to buy Howard Clark, Motohara, or MAS!
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Post by RufusScorpius on May 4, 2020 10:56:59 GMT
Well, yes. I went the short-and-simple route. I know. Just have to provide fodder. I mean, this forum is for fun, so have fun, eh?Of course! Which is why everybody knows that a proper katana can cut through bricks and steel with no problems. The fact that one chipped means that he was trying to cut another katana with it, not plastic water bottles. Facts.
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Post by zabazagobo on May 5, 2020 1:19:35 GMT
I know. Just have to provide fodder. I mean, this forum is for fun, so have fun, eh? Of course! Which is why everybody knows that a proper katana can cut through bricks and steel with no problems. The fact that one chipped means that he was trying to cut another katana with it, not plastic water bottles. Facts. Of course, a problem is that the hardness of the water wasn't considered.
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Post by bradc on May 5, 2020 4:29:44 GMT
Of course! Which is why everybody knows that a proper katana can cut through bricks and steel with no problems. The fact that one chipped means that he was trying to cut another katana with it, not plastic water bottles. Facts. Of course, a problem is that the hardness of the water wasn't considered. 👏👏👏
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Post by severroad on May 5, 2020 5:08:54 GMT
I ended up losing probably close to 2 millimeters off the sakihaba polishing the chip out. Seems much happier now. Intentionally aimed for the caps of water bottles, as Cas said these "will damage any sword". Intentionally trying bad angles. Can't even tell it's been used now. Lotta work to polish, but now it seems sturdier!?! Hell of a lot prettier without that black stripe too!
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Post by bradc on May 5, 2020 5:24:16 GMT
I ended up losing probably close to 2 millimeters off the sakihaba polishing the chip out. Seems much happier now. Intentionally aimed for the caps of water bottles, as Cas said these "will damage any sword". Intentionally trying bad angles. Can't even tell it's been used now. Lotta work to polish, but now it seems sturdier!?! Hell of a lot prettier without that black stripe too! I have been curious about the what the black hamon/habuchi is on Hanwei L6 swords. Is there any trace of the dark line at all after polishing?
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Post by zabazagobo on May 5, 2020 5:27:03 GMT
I really do like the way you polished it up. I agree- the stock polish on these is a bit odd. Not a big fan personally. But the Oni koshirae is probably the coolest Hanwei has done, it's such an awesome design.
And yes, the type of plastic in a bottle cap is known for messing up very fine edges. Surprising, but true.
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Post by randomnobody on May 5, 2020 7:09:38 GMT
I ended up losing probably close to 2 millimeters off the sakihaba polishing the chip out. Seems much happier now. Intentionally aimed for the caps of water bottles, as Cas said these "will damage any sword". Intentionally trying bad angles. Can't even tell it's been used now. Lotta work to polish, but now it seems sturdier!?! Hell of a lot prettier without that black stripe too! You've probably steepened the edge angle. This'll give more body behind the edge, "niku" if you know the word, which generally presents a "sturdier"/"stronger" edge.
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Post by severroad on May 5, 2020 8:50:52 GMT
I really do like the way you polished it up. I agree- the stock polish on these is a bit odd. Not a big fan personally. But the Oni koshirae is probably the coolest Hanwei has done, it's such an awesome design.
And yes, the type of plastic in a bottle cap is known for messing up very fine edges. Surprising, but true.
Still some faint cloudy spots. Didn't want to go too deep. But it took quite a bit of shaping. And the two sides, so different once I started. I'm liking it more and more, and I agree about the concept! All Black Oni!
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bpogue
Manufacturer/Vendor
Posts: 354
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Post by bpogue on May 5, 2020 14:39:09 GMT
... as Cas said these "will damage any sword". ...
Please, if you are going to quote someone then share what was actually said. Excerpt from my email to you on 4/29:
"Water bottles, specifically the cap area, are actually quite hard and we have seen this issue in the past with the very thin cross section swords regardless of steel type. Not saying that is what happened or excusing the performance, just FYI."
If you spoke to someone else here that told you "will damage any sword" then please let me know.
Blake
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Post by shepherd214 on May 5, 2020 19:40:35 GMT
Imagine spending OVER a thousand bucks for your sword to chip or roll on thin plastic. Even with a thin edge, it should still have no issues if its heat treated well. If this was a 200 dollar sword, fine.
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Post by Robert in California on May 5, 2020 23:32:44 GMT
Sympathies...ask for compensation? My beaters for backyard bottle cutting are a Wang-katana2011 DH 1095 katana and a Jkoo/Sinosword DH 1095 katana. With both, in a say, 50 water-filled plastic milk jugs cutting session we occasionally hit too high, hitting the harder plastic bottle cap. Normally cutting the cap in two. Never had a chip/roll/dull but have had tiny scratches, with both swords. Bummer to have that happen! Sympathies. I'd at least ask for a discount on another sword.
On the other hand, my backyard cutters are not special performance swords with wide and thin blades. (straight razors chip, etc more easily than do axes...)
RinC
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