pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Jun 26, 2018 1:13:13 GMT
I finally finished my shield after two years of procrastinating. The final plan called for it to be a flat centre grip shield, ½” x 22”, weighing <5 lbs., and capable of trapping a blade. It came in at ½” x 23”, 4.98 lbs., and appears capable of trapping a blade. Out of pocket expenses were <$60, compared to my commercial $75 heater shield that cost me about $140 by the time of arrival. I had written about the construction but that turned out to be three pages so here is an abbreviated version instead. The most expensive, and heaviest, part of the shield is the boss which cost me an estimated $37. It’s a GDFB 14 ga. jobby and is better than need be. It weighs 1.1 lb. The one thing that I find the most mysterious is that when buying the wood I specified ½” what the salesman presented looked thin and measured 9 mm ( 3/ 8”). I complained and pointed to some ½” stock that he had to no avail as he replied in long sentences spoken rapidly in Spanish and continued to point the wood he had set out. A few weeks later while making final measurements before making nails to attach the handle something wasn’t checking out. I got my micrometer and found the shield to be .450” thick as was a scrap piece. I got the tape out that I used when buying and it said 11 mm. Perhaps this is what the man was trying to explain? I can’t explain the expansion. Not in the plans is the sheep skin that I had laying around that I applied to the grip. It’s in its natural colour. I had debated whether to dye it and decided against it. Looking at it now I think that I might. It is now as originally planned, that is without a border. Looking at it now I fear in time stress and wear may cause the canvas to wear at the corners so that is the next project and I will add the photos when done. I am undecided whether rope or raw hide. I came across some raw hide but found it in sufficient. I suspect within the month there will be a border of some type and I’ll update with additional photos. The whole project was a learning experience both from construction and about shields themselves. For example I found a centre grip shield better balanced as the weight is equally distributed making it faster and easy to manage. My heater shield has much weight below the holding point making it slower and harder to control. I suspect this can be changed by a different strap arrangement than I have and might explain the other arrangements I’ve seen. Also my heater shield is curved and if I am not careful will hit me in the back on a thrust, hence flat in the requirements for the new shield. With my heater I can expect to extend my reach about 5” beyond my fist in a punch. With my new round shield it’s slightly over 10”.
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Post by demonskull on Jun 26, 2018 1:40:32 GMT
It came out very nice.
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Jun 26, 2018 2:08:00 GMT
Thanks
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Ifrit
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More edgy than a double edge sword
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Post by Ifrit on Jun 26, 2018 4:58:06 GMT
I wish I had the tools to make something like this. Fantastic job Pgandy
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Jun 26, 2018 8:55:08 GMT
Another thanks. I have no fancy tools. I used a 3/8” electric drill, 3 tools from a set of wood carving tools of 6 that cost $15?, sand paper, a micro file, hammer, $13 anvil from Tandy Leather, a straight edge (aluminium meter stick), ball point pen and sketch pen, string, heavy duty scissors, pliers, compass, a putty knife to spread the glue, a BiC lighter, and a tape measure, some not absolute necessary but as I had them on hand and are generally found around a house. Setting here listing them there were more than I thought but most are just common things that I had laying around that I use nearly every day and like I said, I had them laying around but were not absolutely necessary, just made life easier. I used the father and son furniture shop down the mountain to rough cut the shield for about $3.50, plus another $1.33 taxi fare to get back up the mountain on that one, and then later another $3.50 for the handle. The handle I put in my backpack and rode the bus back for free. At one point I used an orbital sander for smoothing the handle after carving with the tools, not necessary but faster than via hand. In fact, I finished via hand using 1500 grit and mineral oil. Come to think of it there was a motor tool for resizing the nails and cutting rivets to size, again not necessary but speeded things up. The only other electric tool, if you want to consider it, was a Work Sharp to sharpen my tools including the scissors as the canvas was tough. That Work Sharp is proving to be worth every penny it cost. I can do it by hand but the Work Sharp is so much faster and easier. My only regret there is that it took so long to convince myself to buy one.
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Post by MOK on Jun 26, 2018 9:10:32 GMT
How's the handle attached? I don't see any rivets on it...?
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Jun 26, 2018 9:29:05 GMT
How's the handle attached? I don't see any rivets on it...? I had no rivets that long. It is attached with Titbond II glue and reinforced with six blackened doomed headed nails. I don’t think nails would be out of line historically. However, I’ll have to question doomed headed ones though, but it was the best that I could do. What would have been perfect is what we called horseshoe nails that were plentiful when I was a kid. They were all over the place then but I can’t remember when seeing the last one.
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Jun 26, 2018 9:44:36 GMT
The photo below is from another thread but is appropriate here. The shield was designed to trap a blade. Rather than testing the shield directly I used a piece of left over scrap wood with a scrap piece of like canvas. The wood for the test was hand held and not propped up in some rigid device as I thought this would simulate field conditions better. The machete went ½” in and was trapped. I had control of it by simply twisting the wood. A few days later I repeated the test using a Windlass XIV. The wood stopped the blade cold and it was imbedded. However on giving the wood a twist the blade popped out. It was not trapped and entered 3/ 8”. I believe that I could have easily pushed the blade off line though.
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christain
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It's the steel on the inside that counts.
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Post by christain on Jun 26, 2018 12:13:36 GMT
That's pretty sweet, P.G. Just gives me more incentive to get a move on with my shield project. But that's on my time, and other projects on the commission list come first.
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Post by Sir Thorfinn on Jun 26, 2018 15:15:06 GMT
SOOOO... Here's what ya use to hold your handle on. Modern Nails. What I do is sand the nail head so it looks less modern, and I have even sanded the head square in some instances. Use a home made washer on each side, to help keep it from pulling thru. Mine are just a snipped piece of mild steel with a size appropriate hole. I use 2 on each side of the handle, so two at the top, two at the bottom. (4 total) Once I have the pieces ready, I just drill thru, slide a washer on the nail, slide it thru the hole, add another washer on the other side, cut off the excess length, and peen. Here's a fairly obvious flaw in this style of set up, the wood can split at the nails/rivets. My solution is to use a 1" wide strip of really thin brass or aluminum wrapped around the handle where you are placing the rivet. So the strip goes all the way around the handle shaft, and you drill thru it. The rivet holds it in place. Just my .02, but I do SCA combat, and folks marvel at how long my shields last due to over engineering. Also...I use aluminum for the base shields, but this works on wood also. There's also a number of fun things you can do to the rivet heads to make them look less modern, the imagination boggles Attachments:
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Post by pgandy on Jun 26, 2018 16:02:19 GMT
Thanks Sir Thorfinn. I hadn’t thought to square up a modern nail head. A bit thin but I believe it would work fine. There won’t be a next time soon but when it comes I’ll certainly keep that in mind. As I said it was a learning experience. Unlike your shields this was not meant to last but to get through a fight, a fight being a doubtful case of reality in itself, and absorb the opponents cuts and blows hopefully trapping the blade. The poorest test result caught the blade and while not trapping it I think well enough to push it off line momentarily. I realize neither is necessary and if the shield will just stop an incoming is all that I ask of it.
How much does the shield in photo weigh and diameter?
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Post by Sir Thorfinn on Jun 26, 2018 19:19:02 GMT
That one is 28" diameter, 7 ish lbs. Add another 2 lbs in edging, so complete about 9lbs. Which oddly is about the same as a wood one the same size with similar pieces. I use split rattan for the handle, as I've had them shatter in my hand with normal hardwood. I have also had the nails holding the handle on pull thru, leaving me with a handle and a shield on the ground...oh the hilarity that caused.
So...in the ancient world (and this is strictly my opinion) shields were throw aways, used once, and replaced. I assume the boss and any reusable bits would go to the next one, but they were for one fight, and may not last thru even that. (Viking Holmgang limiting a fight to 3 shields...)
So if you can over build to reduce one cause for catastrophic failure, I'd do that, and let the body of the shield get chopped to bits.
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Post by MOK on Jun 26, 2018 19:26:44 GMT
Clinched nails seem to be common on archaeological finds. Typically one per plank. But, indeed, not doomed ones. I think one thing that would help with trapping a blade would be thinning the planks out towards the edge, as seen on surviving historical shields of this type. The thin edge has more give so lets a thick (relative to a machete) blade in deeper and easier but also applies more friction against attempts to pull it out, and as the wood grows thicker away from the edge the resulting stress is more likely to break a piece off the edge rather than split the whole plank.
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Post by MOK on Jun 26, 2018 19:33:05 GMT
That one is 28" diameter, 7 ish lbs. Add another 2 lbs in edging, so complete about 9lbs. Which oddly is about the same as a wood one the same size with similar pieces. I use split rattan for the handle, as I've had them shatter in my hand with normal hardwood. I have also had the nails holding the handle on pull thru, leaving me with a handle and a shield on the ground...oh the hilarity that caused. I've noticed that the direction of grain is really frigging important. You want it to run along the plane of the shield face, perpendicular to the nails, so the handle won't just split around 'em. Also, with good wood, not drilling holes actually keeps it a little stronger because with nails hammered straight in you're just pushing the fibers aside instead of severing them - this is more of a thing on polearm hafts, I think, but it does seem to make a little difference on these long shield handles, as well.
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Post by Sir Thorfinn on Jun 26, 2018 20:02:28 GMT
You know, I forgot to talk about clinching the nails... that is a significant upgrade from a peened end. Using rattan, the tend to wiggle free and turn into something that will snag on you, unless you do the point of the clenched nail pretty long. Good catch!
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Jun 26, 2018 20:34:10 GMT
That one is 28" diameter, 7 ish lbs. Add another 2 lbs in edging, so complete about 9lbs. Which oddly is about the same as a wood one the same size with similar pieces. I use split rattan for the handle, as I've had them shatter in my hand with normal hardwood. I have also had the nails holding the handle on pull thru, leaving me with a handle and a shield on the ground...oh the hilarity that caused. So...in the ancient world (and this is strictly my opinion) shields were throw aways, used once, and replaced. I assume the boss and any reusable bits would go to the next one, but they were for one fight, and may not last thru even that. (Viking Holmgang limiting a fight to 3 shields...) So if you can over build to reduce one cause for catastrophic failure, I'd do that, and let the body of the shield get chopped to bits. I believe you are correct about shields being expendable. I remember reading one account, can’t remember where except somewhere up in Norse country, stating when two men had a quarrel it was settled by them being rowed to an isolated island where they fought it out. Each had a weapon, can’t remember the details on the weapons such as if identical, type, etc. I do remember each was given three shields, if the shields did not last the duration, tough luck. Probably the same references you are referring to. Your shield reminds me in some ways of my heater shield. It’s commercially made weighs 8.75 lbs. and is built to last. I think it will stop anything short of a bullet and ask for more.
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Post by pgandy on Jun 26, 2018 20:35:25 GMT
Clinched nails seem to be common on archaeological finds. Typically one per plank. But, indeed, not doomed ones. :) I think one thing that would help with trapping a blade would be thinning the planks out towards the edge, as seen on surviving historical shields of this type. The thin edge has more give so lets a thick (relative to a machete) blade in deeper and easier but also applies more friction against attempts to pull it out, and as the wood grows thicker away from the edge the resulting stress is more likely to break a piece off the edge rather than split the whole plank. Thinner wood has its advantages and during the two years of procrastinating I would swing back and forth between 9 mm and 12 mm thickness. At the time of purchase I was thinking 12 mm. The following week it could have very well been 9 mm. When I rest up from building this one I probably would like to build another but differently and since this is 12 mm that in all likelihood will be 9 mm. Whether round, heater, kit, is a bigger question as well as the hold. I considered a strap arrange until near the end when I realized that my hand and elbow would be near the edge and with a blade that is likely to come through encouraged me to go centre. One thing that I haven’t brought up so far is where to put another? Hazel said something to the effect that my stuff was on the table. With no carry strap I tied a cord to it and hung it from a hat rack behind a bolo. The hair dryer finally got worked on about an hour later and has a new home.
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Post by MOK on Jun 26, 2018 21:17:02 GMT
I believe you are correct about shields being expendable. I remember reading one account, can’t remember where except somewhere up in Norse country, stating when two men had a quarrel it was settled by them being rowed to an isolated island where they fought it out. Each had a weapon, can’t remember the details on the weapons such as if identical, type, etc. I do remember each was given three shields, if the shields did not last the duration, tough luck. Probably the same references you are referring to. Yeah, that's the holmgang, a type of formal, almost ritualized duel. The specifics vary from source to source and even from one translation to another; sometimes the fighters are specifically allowed three shields, sometimes they have assistants holding the shields for them, sometimes they actually take turns attacking, etc. It's kinda hard to say what elements are factual and what later embellishment or misunderstanding, especially considering that the custom probably changed considerably over time. The only real constants seem to be the restricted arena (either a small islet or, presumably when one wasn't handy, a predefined measure of land) and roughly matched armament. Thinner wood has its advantages and during the two years of procrastinating I would swing back and forth between 9 mm and 12 mm thickness. At the time of purchase I was thinking 12 mm. The following week it could have very well been 9 mm. When I rest up from building this one I probably would like to build another but differently and since this is 12 mm that in all likelihood will be 9 mm. I didn't mean just thinner overall, but thinner towards the edges and thicker in the middle! Almost all of these surviving shields and shield fragments show the shield to have been not quite a flat disk, but actually more of a lens shape. E.g. you could start with 12mm stock and, with a plane or draw knife, gradually taper it down to 6mm (or even less) at the edges while keeping the full 12mm thickness in the middle. Oh, yeah - while there's no evidence of guiges as such being used on round shields, some actually do have remnants of a sling or cord attached to the ends of the handle, presumably for hanging it on your wall or back when not in use. Plus it's just so practical.
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Post by pgandy on Jun 26, 2018 22:58:45 GMT
“I didn't mean just thinner overall, but thinner towards the edges and thicker in the middle! Almost all of these surviving shields and shield fragments show the shield to have been not quite a flat disk, but actually more of a lens shape. E.g. you could start with 12mm stock and, with a plane or draw knife, gradually taper it down to 6mm (or even less) at the edges while keeping the full 12mm thickness in the middle."
I know what you mean but in this case and probably the next would not be practical. In this case I used 7 ply plywood. To plane the outer circumference down to half its thickness or less would mean that I’d always be planning cross grain. That was a beautiful piece of wood but the manufacturer took a short cut and used a centre sheet that was not in keeping with the quality of the rest. I could throw in the additional issues of not having a work bench, no plane, no way to chuck the blank up while planning. Not to mention standing bent over for that length of time my back which already gives me problems if I mistreat it will be attacking me with vengeance. I could set on the disk while sanding with my orbit sander, but that presents another set of problems, mostly dust and huge amounts of it. With all of the issue involved and the fact that I’ll in all probability never use it in combat (I hope) doesn’t warrant the effort. Now if I was a young buck of yesteryear with my eye set on rape, burn, and pillage that would be another story.
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Post by MOK on Jun 26, 2018 23:14:30 GMT
Yeah, fair enough.
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