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Post by Gunnar Wolfgard on Feb 27, 2018 20:53:37 GMT
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Post by kalkikrosah on Feb 28, 2018 3:31:53 GMT
I was looking at the hilt furniture and it looks like the same sword to me. The coloration is different but that's probably due to lighting.
I spotted another difference in the writing: Windlass is peened, Ebay is a Brass nut. Only thing is that I do not see any nuts on the pommel of that Ebay version. Ebay says that it is sharp but the Windlass version is unsharpened. I have my doubts but it probably is the same sword. You may have to sharpen it yourself if you do go with Ebay, but if you have the tools to do it then that isn't a problem.
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stormmaster
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I like viking/migration era swords
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Post by stormmaster on Feb 28, 2018 3:49:54 GMT
while it looks similar i believe it might be a similar situation to those german bastard swords you see on ebay, a similar forge in india copied windlass's idea and made their own, it might be pretty good but it wont be as good as windlass's i remember the bootleg german sword being like 70% as good as a real windlass one, its a risk tho cause it could be total crap
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Post by zabazagobo on Feb 28, 2018 6:05:13 GMT
Off of MRL, the usual sbg discount code doesn't seem to work for out of stock items. But when I priced the sword of Robert the Bruce, also priced at $325, with the sbg discount code the total was $303.50, and standard shipping was free. (MRL seems to wave shipping fees on orders above $200).
In my opinion, spending the extra $100 is worth it as you're getting the genuine article from Windlass rather than a knock-off with similar fittings. MRL has good warranties/policies and Windlass has a positive reputation for steel and general build quality, so I'd trust them over what looks like a total knockoff. Build quality is dubious on the other seller, so I'd pass (plus that scabbard looks pretty gross i.m.o.)
But I'm still waiting with you for VA's model. Starting to wonder if it's just a myth
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Post by Gunnar Wolfgard on Feb 28, 2018 15:33:16 GMT
Forgot that MRL gives free shipping on $200 or more. As far as quality control, I haven't had any luck with Windlass in many years now. Every sword I've gotten from them in the last few years have had miss align pommels or guards or off center blades. As for being a knockoff I guess we could say the Valiant's Suontaka will be a knockoff of Albion's Valkyrja. And hundreds of other swords are knockoffs of other swords too. I checked for reviews on this sword but I guess it's just to new now. I was thinking even if the blade is crap I could use the SOLID BRASS pommel and guard and possibly the handle with my DSA hema Viking blade. Other than Raymond's Quiet Press dagger sized Suontaka guard and pommel where are you going to find them for $200 ? I wouldn't even consider it with Windlass's copper plated who knows what fittings, besides their 1 3/4 inch wide blade opening would be a major hassle to make work on the DSA 2 1/4 inch wide blade. I put a WTB for Suontaka fitting in our classifieds and got nothing.
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stormmaster
Member
I like viking/migration era swords
Posts: 7,649
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Post by stormmaster on Feb 28, 2018 15:34:58 GMT
Suontaka fittings are so intricate they are pretty much bound to be really expensive
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Post by Gunnar Wolfgard on Feb 28, 2018 15:45:30 GMT
Once the molds are made you're just pouring brass or bronze into them and polishing them up after. It's not like they're making each individual piece by hand.
Hey if Sonny's first batch of Suontaka's had his blade we wouldn't even be having this conversation. He seemed to be able to get fitting quick enough for that batch why such a long delay on getting them for this run?
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stormmaster
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I like viking/migration era swords
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Post by stormmaster on Feb 28, 2018 15:52:47 GMT
Even then sculpting the molds would be quite the undertaking
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Post by Gunnar Wolfgard on Feb 28, 2018 16:09:25 GMT
Well you're never going to recoup your time in making it if you don't get it out there to sell. Start up cost are high on anything new but you make it back buy selling them not by talking about it. Look at RQP Suontaka fittings, they're only $60 Unfortunately they're a little to small for a proper looking sword. But if he made them a little larger and even tripled this price we would be looking at less then $200. It can be done.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 28, 2018 16:36:03 GMT
Phhht... take a look on their ebay-shop: these guys are ripping of about all major viking designs for quite sub-deepeekan prices - what could you possibly expect for that money and that kind of business model? I saw most of these things on a big medieval market festival in Germany last year... and the quality is ALSO sub-deepeekan! Wavy fullers, uneven grinds, some little bends and twists... i wouldnt trust those things.
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Post by Gunnar Wolfgard on Feb 28, 2018 16:58:12 GMT
Well there we go we just woke Holg up, the beast is on the loose. These days knockoffs are the norm. One of your favorite sword making countries China is the greatest for that. Right or wrong copyrights and patents are worthless these days so as soon as you advertise something you know someone is going to copy it at a lower price. Even the major companies do it. If Albion make a copy of an original sword then a small company make a copy of the Albion aren't they doing the same thing Albion did. Windlass didn't create that design some Viking swordsmith did so that mean Windlass made a knockoff too. Just because you made the first copy doesn't mean you own the right to it.. We live in a copycat world.
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Post by MOK on Feb 28, 2018 19:06:46 GMT
Well there we go we just woke Holg up, the beast is on the loose. These days knockoffs are the norm. "These days" nothing! Just look at all the bootleg Ulfberht swords, of various misspellings and varying quality, present in the archaeological record. That said, there is also a very real difference between several manufacturers making reproductions of the same historical artifact on one hand, and one manufacturer reproducing another manufacturer's reproduction of said artifact on the other. As with toys, firearms and everything else, the latter usually leads to problems even aside from legality and morality because most knockoff artists don't actually understand the intended function and purpose of the features they're copying (see e.g. the perfectly tooled but entirely inoperable sights on many early 20th Century Chinese knockoff handguns for one glaring example), and it can only get worse with each successive "generation" of copying. A copy of a copy of a copy is never as good as a copy of a copy.
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Post by Gunnar Wolfgard on Feb 28, 2018 19:54:47 GMT
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 28, 2018 20:53:03 GMT
I am always awake... i am aware of the D(SA)RK SIDE - and its followers!
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Post by Gunnar Wolfgard on Feb 28, 2018 21:36:37 GMT
I am always awake... i am aware of the D(SA)RK SIDE - and its followers!
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Post by Timo Nieminen on Feb 28, 2018 21:46:13 GMT
Look at RQP Suontaka fittings, they're only $60 Unfortunately they're a little to small for a proper looking sword. But if he made them a little larger and even tripled this price we would be looking at less then $200. It can be done. The fittings on this particular sword look the same size as the RQP fittings (about 4" guard, 2 and bit" pommel). If the RQP are too small, then these are too small. (How big is the original? If it's a 4" long grip, it's 7" and 3"; if a 3" grip then 3/4 of that.) Doing Suontaka-style fittings chunky-thick and solid at the full original size is a recipe for bad fittings (overweight). The historical solutions are to make them hollow (like the actual Suontaka sword) or thin (like many originals with fittings of the same profile, like the sword that inspired the Albion Knud: www.albion-swords.com/swords/albion/nextgen/knud-inspirations.htm ) The modern solution is to make them solid and thick, but tiny. (Rather than weight, it might be to give about a similar guard-to-blade width ratio, and on a narrower blade, that means a shorter guard.) The Langeid sword: www.khm.uio.no/english/research/collections/objects/02/langeid-sword.htmlhas a 6.5cm wide pommel, and a guard a little under 14cm.
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Post by Gunnar Wolfgard on Feb 28, 2018 22:19:05 GMT
Well RQP says the blade opening on their guard is 2 inches and as you can see by the picture there is very little room left to widen it and the blade on the Amazon/ebay sword is 2 1/4 inches wide there's no why they're the same size. Look how much guard is sticking out past the 2 1/4 inch blade on this sword. Click on picture to enlarge.
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Post by Timo Nieminen on Feb 28, 2018 22:56:09 GMT
If it's a 2.25" wide blade, then this sword has a wider guard. I measured based on the length of the blade in the photo; based on the length, the blade is only 2" wide, and the guard would be about the same size as the RQP. Note that the two guards aren't the same shape. On the RQP guard, the "inside" of the guard (the distance between the two forward points) is less than 60% of the whole length, while on the ebay/amazon sword, it's about 2/3. Even if the guards are the same length, the ebay/amazon one is about 1cm/0.5" bigger on the "inside". There's a simple (but expensive) solution: buy it and measure it (and the blade). The much more expensive (but potentially much more satisfying) solution is to buy an Albion Ulvbane, with its 19cm/7.5" guard. A nice project using the RQP fittings: myarmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.28045.html - petite for sure, but can work given the right blade.
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Post by Gunnar Wolfgard on Feb 28, 2018 23:10:49 GMT
The blade on the Amazon/ebay sword is 2 1/4 inches because I asked the seller Sharp Knives what the width was and he said 2 1/4 inches. He has no idea that that is now my minimum width for a Viking blade. Trying to take measurement off a picture is at best very inaccurate.
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Post by zabazagobo on Mar 1, 2018 0:09:36 GMT
Huh, somehow I must've gotten lucky because my three Windlasses didn't have any significant flaws. Only real flaws were on my Musketeer rapier which came with one slightly loose bolt for the cup-guard and a bent quillon, but a simple twist of the wrist later and it became perfectly straight. Then again, the more you buy the more room there is for errors to emerge
I don't think that the ebay sword is completely without merit, I'm just fairly wary of most sources off Ebay. Could be a hidden gem for all I know.
(that "yikes" image was classic)
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