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Post by Pino on Feb 3, 2018 18:50:35 GMT
 This sword sucks. No seriously: sometimes it happens that because of lack of source and material you come across a sword you know is rare and you think that there is no known reproduction and even though the description is sketchy and the pics a bit unclear you decide to give it a try and buy it, well this is one of those obscure replica model that you'll need to mark with a red flag. There was a thread by Uhlan about one like this sold by Empire Costume some years ago and shows the danger of getting these even from reliable places. I found one at an obscure auction for a decent price (but honestly too much for a replica) and felt the need to get the specimen to study it in detail in order to confirm how true to an original it could turn out to be. It was then only a matter of luck whether I got my hands on a gold encrusted jewel or a turd covered in vomit...and this is the turd covered in vomit.  It is one of those models that gives collector nightmares because of the original's scarcity and overvalue in the market; every time one of these appears in auctions or websites it is sold for big money as an authentic Russian HC sword. If it handled like the real thing it wouldn't be that much of a problem but no...no way. With its heavy built brass hilt and the much too forward POB, it handles very badly; the balance is way off and your wrist and arm will ache in pain after a while; it's an Indian-made, pallasch looking, crowbar that handles worse than the clunkiest Deepeeka! It is so poorly built that even when holding the sword vertically it will want to fall flat on your face as if it wanted to punish you for having wasted your money on it! Still unclear what manufacturer created this abomination and when (the 90's maybe or early 2000's) but the strong smell of the brass and leather composition spells India. Perhaps it was shat out of Hell after reading some unholy incantation, who knows... BTW the usual price range goes from 800-1500US$, yes unsuspecting collectors pay big money to get something so awkward and clumsy. Here are the specs of the sword: total: 45.5'' / 116cm sword: 44.5'' / 113cm blade: 38.5'' / 98cm POB: 9'' / 23cm Thankfully the markings of this beast are generic and the same in all these replicas, so now whenever you spot these numbers, stamps and especially the date 1839 you know now that it is a reproduction and you have absolutely no excuse. Another clue is the grip that also looks weird, it is always seemingly deformed like some sort of sword hunchback. Bottomline If you see it, step away. PixThe markings of Hell:     Hilt, notice the Hunchback of Notre-Sword:    The Thing:   For reference, original swords go like these: example 1Exampel 2exemple 3 |
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Post by Dave Kelly on Feb 3, 2018 20:22:40 GMT
That's one I've never seen before. Russian stuff is so rare I don't touch it. Seems like there are all sorts of bends in that stinker.
There is also a German 1845 Cuirassier out there. Legitimate cuirassier with an M1816 hilt and an ANXI hatchet faced blade. Never seen a rep for that one. (Unless the one I bought is one.)
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pgandy
Moderator
Senior Forumite
Posts: 10,296
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Post by pgandy on Feb 4, 2018 16:14:55 GMT
UGH. Looking at that thing reminds me of the Russian swords used in the Crimean War. It has been stated they were of inferior metal and would easily bend. It seems that when the government authorized a sword too often the manufacturers produced something of less quality than approved and they were issued as though inspectors were non-extant, could have been the result of more corruption on the part of manufacturers as well as the inspectors. You may very well have an authentic piece of history.
See chapter “The Crimean War” in “Swordsmen of the British Empire”.
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Post by bfoo2 on Feb 4, 2018 20:40:48 GMT
UGH. Looking at that thing reminds me of the Russian swords used in the Crimean War. It has been stated they were of inferior metal and would easily bend. It seems that when the government authorized a sword too often the manufacturers produced something of less quality than approved and they were issued as though inspectors were non-extant, could have been the result of more corruption on the part of manufacturers as well as the inspectors. You may very well have an authentic piece of history. See chapter “The Crimean War” in “Swordsmen of the British Empire”. I doubt it's real. The blade lacks the refinements of the originals. The ridges aren't as crisp, and the foible is way too thick and blobby. The wonky grip, lumpen blade, clumsy and thick etching and, most tellingly (at least to me), the clunky foible all scream India. I understand Pino's dilemma here. I was not aware they did a repro of this pattern. I thought this pattern was "safe" too. At least you got a serviceable scabbard out of the package  |
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Post by Pino on Feb 4, 2018 21:21:57 GMT
Hello guys, not to worry, I knew from the beginning what I was dealing with; there was this thread which I forgot to add & discussed the dangers of encountering one even in reliable websites. The original Russian cuirassier swords were much finely made and had different date and markings which were never the same unlike these repros. I wanted to try this one to see how really good it was. This is a warning review, let the word be known and be wary of these ones. |
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Post by Jordan Williams on Feb 4, 2018 22:22:10 GMT
Oof! But a very helpful review. With the quality of typical eBay pictures it would be easy assume this is safe if one didn't know the markings.
Also, is it me or do the fillers end, and then get shallower near the ricasso, along with the blade near the tip bending forwards?
Edit: So this is the pallasch from Uhlan's thread I presume?
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Post by Pino on Feb 5, 2018 16:36:14 GMT
Yes Jordan, it is the same type of replica as the one identified in Uhlan's thread except the other specimen had a leather scabbard. Hey Dave is this the 1845 sword you speak of? I may have something to say about it... |
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Post by Dave Kelly on Feb 5, 2018 23:22:31 GMT
Yes Jordan, it is the same type of replica as the one identified in Uhlan's thread except the other specimen had a leather scabbard. Hey Dave is this the 1845 sword you speak of? I may have something to say about it... Of that type. I bought one about three years ago. Bezdeck references in his book on German swords. |
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Post by Pino on Feb 6, 2018 13:40:36 GMT
Indeed, it is the so-called Prussian 1845 HC sword, seems like a pretty decent sword. A lot are sold on Hermann Hist.
The one on the ebay link however is another matter...I bought that specific sword 4 years ago and I returned it 3 days after I got it because the blade was just horribly heavy, as in made in India. The hilt looks true and so does the grip but it really felt as if this was a composite sword made of repro parts and original ones.
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Post by likehotbutter on Feb 10, 2018 0:57:10 GMT
I need to make a habit of checking the sword reviews sub forum
Many hidden gems of advice hidden here!
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Uhlan
Member
Posts: 3,121
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Post by Uhlan on Feb 10, 2018 11:32:32 GMT
The Russian from Empire at least looked decent enough to fool Mr. Guinhut and the collector he got it from. And me of course...... This one though is just Blach. The Ebay one has an unmarked blade, no date or regimental stamps, too large ricasso and the peen is awfully bad. Here is another one. No stamps either. Is this one good? It looks so clean.... This stuff gives me the creeps. archives.collectorsfirearms.com/?search=Portuguese%20Cup%20Cavalry%20Sword&page=3&category=&product=sw311Thanks for the warning Pino. So what are you going to do with it? Use the Russian as a spit at the BBQ? |
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Post by berntk on Feb 10, 2018 19:38:46 GMT
Yes Jordan, it is the same type of replica as the one identified in Uhlan's thread except the other specimen had a leather scabbard. Hey Dave is this the 1845 sword you speak of? I may have something to say about it... Dang, another one that would've fooled me from the pictures. B |
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Post by Pino on Feb 11, 2018 2:28:37 GMT
The Russian from Empire at least looked decent enough to fool Mr. Guinhut and the collector he got it from. And me of course...... This one though is just Blach. The Ebay one has an unmarked blade, no date or regimental stamps, too large ricasso and the peen is awfully bad. Here is another one. No stamps either. Is this one good? It looks so clean.... This stuff gives me the creeps. archives.collectorsfirearms.com/?search=Portuguese%20Cup%20Cavalry%20Sword&page=3&category=&product=sw311Thanks for the warning Pino. So what are you going to do with it? Use the Russian as a spit at the BBQ? Ah no I already got rid of it, sold for scraps to a gentleman in NY who knew what he getting into. Obviously lost money with this one but at least the info is now verified. Hey uh, wow, that sword form the link is actually real; from what I know it is a Prussian 1817 kurassier pallasch. These are rare and expensive! |
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Post by caraxia on Feb 22, 2018 12:52:18 GMT
Hello I, new to this forum but I would like to share my experience with what appears to be a good replica of a Russian saber. I recently bought a 1827 model light cavalry Russian saber with almost the same markings like the one posted by Pino. If this is a replica, which I believe it’s, it’s the best one I’ve seen in the market. The only that doesn’t t look authentic is the handling, way too heavy for al light cavalry saber.
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