Aikidoka
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Monstrous monk in training...
Posts: 1,452
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Post by Aikidoka on Jul 20, 2014 20:49:08 GMT
This morning I practiced Schielhau, one of the Liechtenauer master cuts (meisterhauwen) from his German system of swordsmanship, with my Christian Fletcher Borderwatch sword on a few Mugen Dachi tatami targets. I've spent the past couple of weeks figuring out how to perform the cut. It was difficult to see exactly how the cuts were being performed in some of the YouTube videos that I watched. I ordered the Liechtenauer DVD from Freelance Academy Press and that helped quite a bit. For example, it clearly described the two types of grips for the longsword (standard and thumb grip) and explained that Schielhau is performed with the short edge of the sword, while utilizing the thumb grip. Once I grasped the basic principle of the cut, I performed a lot of repetitions with my Cold Steel plastic longsword on a tire pell that I recently built. It took me a couple of mats to figure out how to make the cut work, but once I did, the rest of the session went pretty well. Here's the video: Here are some pictures of the tire pell that I built from a heavy bag stand ($70 at Walmart), a free flat tire from the Walmart automotive department and some rope and bungee cords that I had at the house. I used this pipe for some strength conditioning on the pell, but, as I mentioned above, I preferred the plastic sword when practicing Schielhau strikes. Those Cold Steel plastic swords can take a lot of abuse :lol:
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Post by JGonzalez on Jul 20, 2014 22:01:30 GMT
That pell is awesome and I really dig that cutting stand. Did you make it?
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Aikidoka
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Monstrous monk in training...
Posts: 1,452
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Post by Aikidoka on Jul 20, 2014 22:07:15 GMT
Yes, I made the cutting stand from plans that I received from the Bugei website. They will probably email them to you if you ask. In the past, they sold this stand on their website, but I don't see it there now.
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Post by johnwalter on Jul 21, 2014 0:55:08 GMT
That was cool!
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Aikidoka
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Monstrous monk in training...
Posts: 1,452
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Post by Aikidoka on Jul 21, 2014 1:53:56 GMT
Thanks John!
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Post by Lukas MG (chenessfan) on Jul 21, 2014 6:51:18 GMT
Cool that you're doing the meisterhaue now!! Good job. May I offer some constructive criticism? I'd start from right vom Tag, without the "build up". What you're doing looks more like a Zwerch from Pflug, especially since you end up with the hands higher than the blade. Now there are MANY variations of the meisterhaue and especially the Schielhau, some do indeed end up with the point lower than the hilt. If that works for you, that's fine, though I absolutely recommend trying that out with a partner. I do it more like this, which makes the Schielhau look like a short edge oberhau: I step a bit differently though.
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Aikidoka
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Monstrous monk in training...
Posts: 1,452
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Post by Aikidoka on Jul 22, 2014 22:34:14 GMT
Yes, please! I've had no fencing training whatsoever. I've just watched videos and, as I mentioned above, it's often difficult with some of these more involved cuts to figure out what is going on.
Thanks for the help. I'll start from right vom Tag from now on.
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Razor
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Post by Razor on Jul 23, 2014 3:44:41 GMT
I personally don't like this interpretation of the Schielhau. The Schielhau is a Meisterhauwen against a Buffel(buffalo). A buffalo is a cloddish fighter, who uses brute strength to cut or thrust, and when he pulls back to charge a powerful attack that give the time needed to do a Schielhau. In this video the opponent isn't being a buffalo, so I can see why he doesn't have time to step. A Zornhua, Krumphua, and a Zwerchhua would be a better Meisterhuawen with the cut his opponent was doing. With him not moving his right leg forwards goes against what was said in the fightbooks Ringeck:" If you strike an Oberhua from the right, follow the blow with you right foot. If you do not the blow is wrong and ineffective, because you right side stays behind. Because of this the blow will fall short and cannot travel in it's proper arc towards the left. If you strike from the left and you don't follow the blow, it is too wrong. That is why no matter from what side you are striking follow the blow with the same foot so you will succeed in all techniques. This is how you shall strike all blows." Not just Meyes but Talhoffer and Paulus Kal have pics of the hilt high when cutting with the short edge against High strikes to protect the head. Kal has pics with his right leg forward with the Zornhua and slicing with the short edge that looks like a Schielhua. Talhoffer does too, but I did see at lest one plate that has him cutting from the right with the short edge with his left foot forward. I like this Schielhua interpretation better. After watching your vids Aikidoka2012, I'm sorry to say you're cutting like a buffalo. I never said anything before, because I saw you as a backyard cutter having fun, but now that it looks like you want to learn swordsmanship, I had to say something. I would recommend you learning the basics before you start doing the Meisterhau, like the guards, foot work, and basic cuts. You are also cutting in false times and the way you land with your right foot when you do a passing step, can really start to hurt your knee. your toes and knee should be facing your mat, because that's were your weight and momentum is going and it is really hard on your knees. Also if you land heel toe instead of toe or flat footed you will draw your weight into your cut, giving you more power to your cut or thrust.
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Aikidoka
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Monstrous monk in training...
Posts: 1,452
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Post by Aikidoka on Jul 23, 2014 4:04:22 GMT
Sound advice. And thanks for pointing that out with regard to my step. Yikes! I didn't realize I was turning my foot to that degree. Not good :?
And allowing my momentum to carry forward (heel -> toe), rather than absorbing the force by landing toe first.... great advice! Thank you.
At the moment, the WMA schools nearby only hold class at a time when I can't attend. When that changes, I'll be there. Until then, I'll work on improving my footwork, using proper guards and improving the cuts, both basic and Meisterhau.
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