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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2007 0:59:42 GMT
He makes his own blades via stock removal and has them heat treated at some sort of professional facility that has the latest, greatest heat treating gear (Mike can probably be more specific).
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2007 8:45:35 GMT
Gus's regular job, as I understand it, is milling Aircraft parts. He has a several dozen thousand dollar CNC milling machine, that'll basically take any piece of steel and grind it to any sort of exact specifications fed into it with a special 3D-modeling program like AutoCAD or SolidWorks. He uses this equipment to make his swords.
His swords are perfect in that respect. There really isn't any deviance in them, which isn't the case with handforged stuff. It does mean that you can count on it though. I've NEVER heard of ANY case of a 'bad' atrim getting out. If I get an AT1611, and so does Shootermike, you can be guaranteed that his and mine will be EXACTLY the same(at least, the blade will be, short of any personal customizations shooter or I do to our own blades)
The downside is that his stuff doesn't seem to have as much 'soul', so to speak. Just like you can take a Symphony by Mozart or Beethoven and have a computer program play it perfectly and it doesn't sound the same(or as good) as with a live musician.
For his target market(martial artists and collectors of *performance* oriented blades) this is just fine. I'd love to own some of his stuff. But I'd also love stuff like an Albion as well that has more spirit in it. Call me hokey if you want. I've a very big spiritual side to me.
Anyway, because anything that goes through his heat-treat has to be so specific(again, AIRPLANE parts... if a bad piece gets through, PEOPLE DIE!) you can get official good-enough-for-the-government certification for any of his blades to be through hardened to a legitimate RC52.
Dang fine swords. The overal quality is better than albion, though the authenticity and historicity of them is debatable, and generally considered inferior to Albion.
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Post by Brendan Olszowy on Jun 24, 2007 9:07:09 GMT
Sweet. Very useful information Adam +1. It really paints a picture of what these swords are like, although you can see form photos how presice they are.
Do you know how they blacken their parts, is it paint or a treatment etc?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2007 9:33:05 GMT
My guess is either some form of chemical blueing or electrolysis.
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Post by rammstein on Jun 25, 2007 0:28:45 GMT
Durability wise I agree with you, but in terms of fit and finish and other important areas of "quality" I'd have to disagree. It seems that we're on the same page here from reading the whole of your statement, but I just thought I should point out that there is many more facets of quality than how durable a sword is.
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Post by ShooterMike on Jun 25, 2007 1:06:57 GMT
Hey all, Been quite busy as of late, so I couldn't address this thread earlier. But here is some updated info. The part about all the blades of a particular model being identical is mostly correct. Gus has a setup where he can run a Computer Numerical Controlled (CNC) milling program on a given piece of bar stock and the mill will execute the cuts the same every time. However, he can vary the length of the blade and the tang based on program variances as well as the length of the stock he starts with. This can result in two swords run with the same program but having quite different "personalities." Add to this the fact that the grips are all individually hand-made by Eric Blacksmith, and you get some pretty individual swords. Enough so that Christian Fletcher won't make a scabbard for one without having the individual sword in hand. To the best of my knowledge, the sword pictured above is a one-of-a-kind sword. It is not a cataloged model and has no number assigned. It's just something Gus made one day because he thought it would be a cool sword. And I talked to him right after it was finished, before he had a chance to advertise it. So I bought it on his recommendation. Regarding the finish options, the guard and pommel are polished and hot-blued (same as a high-end firearm). The dark finish in the fuller is a spray-n-bake polymer coating. I suspect it's just something he was playing with that day to test out. Regarding Gus' full-time gig, he subcontracts parts for the U.S. Navy. Not sure whether it's for airplanes or ships or what. He uses the same heat treater for swords as he uses for Navy contract parts. Therefore, due to DOD regulations the blades must be certified as to heat treat and temper, just because they are handled by that shop. Hope that clarifies some things that were a little fuzy.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2007 1:13:58 GMT
does the handle come off the tang by loosening the hex screw? what model is that? if i may ask, cost? did it come with a scabbard?
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Post by ShooterMike on Jun 25, 2007 1:26:42 GMT
Durability wise I agree with you, but in terms of fit and finish and other important areas of "quality" I'd have to disagree. It seems that we're on the same page here from reading the whole of your statement, but I just thought I should point out that there is many more facets of quality than how durable a sword is. I have to agree with Rammstein for the most part. I have a total of 9 swords Gus made over the last 6 years (and 2 more on the way in the next 1-2 weeks). The fit of the earlier ones definitely support Rammstein's assertions. As you look at them based on the time they were manufactured, you can see a definite progression toward the level demonstrated by Albion Next Generation swords. But it's definitely not the same, just like Arms&Armor swords are not just like Albions. They are all a little different and stress different aspects of the sword. Gus is getting better all the time with the finishes on his swords, and the fit as well. However, you must keep in mind that an ATrim of a given type will retail for approximately half of what a similar Albion costs at retail price. So you can't expect to get everything for no additional cost. For example, an Albion Knight Type XII single hand sword retails now for $799. Gus just made a Type XII that was shown at the Atlanta Blade Show. It is a very close match to the Albion Knight is size, and handles maybe a little better in my opinion. It retails for $450. Are the Albions (and Arms&Armor swords for that matter) more historically accurate? Definitely, without a doubt. Do they handle as well? Some do, some don't. But they are all close. Are the Albions as durable as ATrims? Probably not. And for the practitioner of WMA, the added benefit to the ATrims is that it only takes a 5mm Allen wrench/Hex key to completely disassemble them for maintenance, repair and customization. So I like them.
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Post by ShooterMike on Jun 25, 2007 1:31:23 GMT
does the handle come off the tang by loosening the hex screw? what model is that? if i may ask, cost? did it come with a scabbard? The hilt can be completely disassembled with a 5mm Allen wrench. The one above is a one-of-a-kind to the best of my knowledge. The longswords are $550 and a simple heavy leather campaign scabbard is $100. I have one mounted on a historic leather suspension belt system and it works pretty well. And you can't break it no matter how hard you try by tripping over it and stepping on it. ;D
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Post by randomnobody on Jun 25, 2007 2:02:08 GMT
Dreadfully late to this thread for whatever reason, I must say, that is one very fine looking sword.
I've been thinking about exploring this guy's stuff for a little while now. Most of what I've seen is very attractive, and I'm content enough with the pricing on them. I've got a fair bit of self-imposed financial strain facing me for this month and next, but come August-September, I'll be back in the market for a new sword, and will certainly be considering one buy this guy.
"This guy" = Angus Trim/Gus Trim/ATrim/Mr. Trim/that guy who makes those sword things/other: _______
Not overly familiar with these yet, so you'll have to forgive my vague references.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2007 2:04:18 GMT
an 'Atrim' is a sword made by 'Angus Trim', commonly referred to as 'Gus'.
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Post by randomnobody on Jun 25, 2007 2:11:08 GMT
So would "atrim" be the most acceptable reference to the swords themselves?. Or if I were to refer to Gus himself as "that guy who makes those sword things?"
Maybe I should just buy one. Eventually...
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2007 2:16:51 GMT
Yes, 'atrim' is the easiest way to refer to a sword that is made by angus trim.
Everybody should buy one eventually.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2007 5:21:09 GMT
one last question...what type of edge does he use, convex, flat, secondary bevel?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2007 5:41:31 GMT
He grinds a secondary bevel on them, but does a good job blending them into the grind of the body of the blade so you don't see it really. In effect it's a very acute appleseed bevel because there's no sharp transition line that you see on the edge.
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Post by ShooterMike on Jun 25, 2007 15:03:09 GMT
Just a bit of further clarification about Angus (Gus) Trim's swords for those reading the thread. Gus usually designates his standard designs with a letter-number combination. These model numbers are: AT - for Angus Trim-made swords Two numbers denoting the medieval century when the design would have likely originated Two numbers denoting the order the designs were created Thus, an AT1314 was Gus' 14th design from the 13th century. And Kriegschwert's AT1502b is a second version modification to the blade length of the second sword design from the 15th century. Also, you will see a few swords in the ATrim line that have different letters, such as the DD1404 "Moonbrand" sword. I believe the "DD" denotes the initials of a different designer. I just don't know who "DD" is.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 26, 2007 9:42:07 GMT
Wow... didn't know abt the reasoning behind Gus' naming convention though I own 1 of his early model ;D Thanks, Mike
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2007 17:34:30 GMT
mike, what do you think of the blade's finish?
jason
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Post by ShooterMike on Jun 30, 2007 18:04:19 GMT
mike, what do you think of the blade's finish? jasonVery nice. The equal of any Next Generation Albion, at least that I've seen. Gus has really put in a lot of work making his latest swords look good as well as preform well.
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Marc Ridgeway
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Post by Marc Ridgeway on Jun 30, 2007 20:16:11 GMT
But I'd also love stuff like an Albion as well that has more spirit in it. Call me hokey if you want. I've a very big spiritual side to me. . I'm under the impression that Albion are milled as well... In fact , I know I've read they use autocad and cnc milling...
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