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Post by Larry Jordan on Apr 3, 2011 12:25:23 GMT
It's a dagger that is gripped in a closed fist and can be employed with straight punches. It can also be used for slashing, but this seems awkward for a knife held in this fashion. There's no question that knife retention is excellent. For a more detailed discussion of the push dagger philosophy I refer you to Phil Elmore's Understanding the Push Dagger. The knife depicted above is a little large for my purposes: To provide an easiliy carried, quickly deployable tool to facilitate handgun retention. At first for such duty I mounted my Spyderco delica (3" folder) clipped to my left front pocket and trained drawing and opening with the weak hand. This is challenging even when not under pressure. So, I began to look for a fixed blade solution. I quickly honed in on the Cold Steel Counter Tac II, with its 3 3/8" inch blade. I was carrying this until I noticed a shinkendo student with something attached to the front of his belly bag. I soon discovered this was a cold steel SafeKeeper II (3 3/4"). I opted instead for its littler brother. SafeKeeperIII (2 1/2"), Secure-ex Sheath Mounted semi-concealed on the belt in the appendix position the knife's handle can be quickly gripped, drawn (punch chambered) and thrust (jabbed) into the threat. Edge and Handle Shape/Thickness Closeup of 4116 Krupps Stainless Steel Blade As you can see it is "technically" a dagger. The top edge is sharpened, though not full length. I purchased mine a few years ago when Cold Steel was making it in Krupps 4116 cutlery grade stainless. I didn't know anything about the steel, but I can vouch for its edge retention. I've been using a Roach Belly for several years at work for kitchen duty. It's a non issue now, since Cold Steel offers the SKIII in AUS8A. Overall Length 5" One last observation on carry: The short overall length of the knife makes for much easier carry. The longer, linear Counter Tac II (6 3/4") is not as comfortable to carry. Even with its handle, as short as it is, one can feel it pressing against the ribs. Not so with the rounder, horizontal SKIII handle.
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Talon
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Post by Talon on Apr 3, 2011 14:33:24 GMT
nice review larry alas push daggers are illegal over here (though i did make a couple when i was younger) i've been meaning to as ,what is that knife picture in youre avatar :? it looks like a straight razor style handle with a japanese wrap,very cool
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Post by Opferous on Apr 3, 2011 15:56:07 GMT
Ah, I love push daggers. Too bad it'd be an illegal carry here Good to see someone else reads the Martialist/Phil Elmore. Can't say I agree with everything but at the very least, they make for good reads.
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Post by Larry Jordan on Apr 3, 2011 16:17:15 GMT
Thanks! The "knife" in my avatar is a Barry Dawson "Dark Knight" Wakizashi. Check out my review.
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Post by Larry Jordan on Apr 3, 2011 16:27:47 GMT
I enjoy entertaining Mr. Elmore's concept papers/pamphlets. My favorite is "Flashlight Fighting", though it was panned by many: His most controversial has to "Street Sword": One reviewer writes "LARPing gone mad[e]". It's a collectible now.
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Talon
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Post by Talon on Apr 3, 2011 16:32:21 GMT
i wasnt expecting that,that is seriously one wicked blade im not usually all that into tac's ,but that is impressive,i feel a bit of a burk for calling that a knife now :lol:
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Sean (Shadowhowler)
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Post by Sean (Shadowhowler) on Apr 3, 2011 18:47:56 GMT
The first push dagger in the pic is huge... biggest of the type I have ever seen. I would not be comfortable with one that large at all. A much smaller push dagger tho, I am very comfortable with and used to carry one at all times when I was younger.
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Post by Larry Jordan on Apr 4, 2011 15:27:29 GMT
It is huge! I was looking for a generic pic and that was the first I found! The biggest, baddest, PKn that doesn't look like someting a Klingon would carry. I also own a 4 1/2" SafeMakerI: But I prefer the smaller blade models, like this SafeMakerII:
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Post by birdman on Apr 4, 2011 15:57:13 GMT
I bought a "Safekeeper III" many years ago, back when it came in a leather sheath and was called the "Urban Skinner". It's nice because in most places in the US, it falls within legal limits, being short and single-edged. It still goes with me when I travel.
Of course if I want to use a REALLY big push dagger, there's always my 19th century Indian katar...
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Post by Larry Jordan on Apr 4, 2011 23:08:21 GMT
The model I have has a sharpened secondary edge, although not as sharp as the primary, nor the full-length. This is not true for your early model? Does it have a false edge? Here is a coldsteelforum's thread on the History of CS Push Knives. What constitutes a dagger? Does partial sharpening of the secondary edge convert it into to a double-edge knife and thus a dagger? Or is the law dangerously ambiguous? Cold Steel's Special Projects web pages has this to say about the SafeKeeperIII: How does Canadian law banning so-called push daggers describe their function/features?
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Post by GUEST on Apr 5, 2011 6:24:57 GMT
I have the Safe Keeper III it is consider a push knife since the top egde is a false edge not fully sharpened. The false egde does help in penetration. The Safe Keeper II is a push dagger since both egdes are fully sharpened. Safe Keeper III top Safe Keeper II bottom The Safe Maker II and III are push daggers.
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Post by birdman on Apr 5, 2011 15:02:54 GMT
Interesting! The "Urban Skinner" I own has a sharpened false edge/swedge, but it's still considered to be single-edged last I knew.
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Post by birdman on Apr 5, 2011 15:08:42 GMT
Yes, it does have a false edge, exactly as you have described. I bought it about 20 years ago at a MilSurp shop in Waukegan, Illinois (my dad was stationed at NTC Great Lakes at the time).
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