jhart06
Member
Slowly coming back from the depths...
Posts: 3,292
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Post by jhart06 on Sept 17, 2011 2:43:54 GMT
PM sent, and I'm eagerly awaiting to get this ball rolling!!
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Post by chrisperoni on Jul 3, 2012 16:40:23 GMT
can we get this stickied!?
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Post by Lonely Wolf Forge on Jul 5, 2012 12:32:28 GMT
id deff uggest taking jeffreys advice in starting with a dagger, or two, or three, youl get al the concepts down, and learn from enough mistakes to really shine when you do the full size sword
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Post by Stromlo_Swords_USA on Sept 11, 2012 8:06:15 GMT
I just re-read this to get motivated on starting a blade project. Fantastic post. Thanks BB!!!!
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Post by aussie-rabbit on Nov 19, 2012 11:37:32 GMT
I would also raise an alternative - some years ago I was asked to run off some blank knives, in the traditional "last week would be good please" rush, meanwhile my cutoff saw had thrown a bearing, my normal bandsaw had blown a motor, so what to do. Necessity is the mother of invention, tucked away in the corner was an industrial butchers band saw from the 1950's, a great white enamel thing with a blunt blade designed for cutting meat.
So with a sandstone block on the reverse direction of the blade I ground off the teeth, leaving just enough for a "wavy" edge, what I had now was a friction cutter, I cannot take credit for the concept - that was passed to me by my local 80+ year old driller of water wells who could turn the mundane into the surprising.
Yes, it worked a treat, I now live in the city, yet I still have an air compressor made by him from an LPG tank, 1950's fridge compressor and a 1/2 HP motor, it simply refuses to die.
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Post by aussie-rabbit on Nov 19, 2012 11:42:39 GMT
Well I'm stuffed, I use a tungsten vinyl cutter  |
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Post by aussie-rabbit on Nov 19, 2012 12:25:11 GMT
As a bit of a Ps. if anyone knows where to get a 1 x30 or 1x42 belt sander in Aussie I'd love to know. Thanks
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Post by julien m on Mar 14, 2014 8:41:16 GMT
Fantastic thread Brotherbonzai, extremely informative and detailed, thanks for taking the time to share your ways.  I have this A bare blade too, and I'm working to hilt it as one of Philadelphia's type XVIII sword here: www.myarmoury.com/talk/viewtopic ... c&start=20 I've just discovered the grinding power of the angle grinder, and I was wondering if it was a bad idea to clean up the blade with it using the angle grinder with a finer grit sanding wheel (the one with the overlapping sand paper bits). I see you are going about it with a file straight on, so I figure there must be a good reason for that  I can also imagine that one can ruin a good blade quickly with the angle grinder...it's rather unforgiving and once material is removed, all is said. In any case I want to keep and enhance the very shallow hollow ground that's set on this blade, but I also have a type XV from Albion that I have to finish, and obliviously it's a tedious job to do by hand. Again, great stuff and very nice work. Cheers, J |
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Post by brotherbanzai on Mar 15, 2014 18:58:31 GMT
Thanks and you're welcome julien m. You can use an angle grinder with one of those wheels, though it isn't ideal. You'll still want to use hand files afterward as the grinder will leave the surface somewhat wavy. A better setup for the angle grinder would be the grinding/sanding discs on a firm spiracool backing pad.
If you don't have a lot of experience doing controlled or delicate work with an angle grinder, be very careful. One slip over the center and you'll ruin the central ridge, get stuck for half a second near the edge and you'll burn it (ruining the heat treatment in that area) or dig too far into the edge and leave a divot.
On the occasions when I use a grinder for anything, I have a wide pvc pipe sealed at the bottom end and filled with water that I frequently dip the blade into to keep it cool. About 10 passes and then dunk to avoid overheating. The steel can heat up very quickly and goes from slightly warm to too hot before you know it.
Keep your movements steady and even. Don't put your weight into the grinder, let the speed of the disc do the work. Rotate the blade frequently so the grind doesn't become uneven as the disc wears. The more patient you are, the better your results will be. I've seen people do some real crap work because they just wanted to get through it as fast as they could.
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Post by exiel on Apr 7, 2014 14:30:24 GMT
Thanks for sharing your methods, bro BB, it makes me want to make a sword designed by me, and in doing so, some problems occured to me which i would like to seek some help here, to you especially. 1. What if, the steel plate i started from was already bent, and i have to bent it back to straight by hand and vise, is there any thing i can do to prevent the rough finished blank from bending by heat treatment? (Does the stress relieving process help?) 2. I read the datas provided by the steel manufacturer, there are two process invoving stress relieving, one with the critical temperature mentioned in many articles, the annealing, the other with temperature about 1-200 degree lower than the critical, the stress relieving, why heat up to critical point while the stress relieving process serves sufficient? (unless, it doesn't ) 3. When grinding the distal taper, it's easy to grind one side when the other still has flat shape, but when it's near finished, how to hold the blank still ? Again, thank you for the sharing, bro BB, you really inspired many people like me. |
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Post by aussie-rabbit on Apr 8, 2014 10:52:16 GMT
Rush and regret |
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Post by brotherbanzai on Apr 8, 2014 12:59:20 GMT
Hi exile, 1. Normalize as many times as it takes to come out straight. It's possible to straighten one last time immediately after the quench though it requires some thick gloves. 2. Bringing the blade to critical will dissolve and regrow the grain structure, undoing the damage done while forging/grinding. I don't know exactly how this would work bringing the blade to a temperature lower than that. May have to do with machined parts rather than blades. 3. clamp it by the tang, which will still be flat on both sides. Duh  Yep |
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Post by Lukas MG (chenessfan) on Apr 9, 2014 16:28:20 GMT
Regarding the first question: my steel always comes not entirely straight. I just cut out the blade shape and then tap/bend it straight. So far I haven't had any trouble with a blade "remembering" any sets (at least I haven't noticed a difference between blades that used to be bent more than others curving more during HT. All blades curve somewhat). But I agree with BB: normalizing is your friend.
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Post by Brendan Olszowy on May 4, 2014 12:46:32 GMT
I think the key here is the difference between correcting grain growth caused by heating far above critical, which is likely in a forged blade, VS only relieving stress using the lower temp, while not necessarily being concerned with correcting grain size, as would be more the case in a purely stock removed blade. Heating to only 650/ 700*C is not going to correct your grain growth in a forged blade.
CF- I've had blade blanks that have sabred simply from cutting the flatbar stock in half, while cutting out the blade profile. There's a seriously strong force hidden in some otherwise straight (viewed down the flat) flat bar, when it is cut and one side of the cut just wants to jam over onto the other. Twice I've had this happen, with completely different steel types (9260 and 316 S/S), and each time it has clamped so hard onto my angle grinder's cutoff disk it has launched the grinder out of my hands - one time landing me in hospital.
I have learned to minimise the danger by always cutting from the outside in, so that the closure is progressive- you may notice it happening, dragging on the disk. The first time I was cutting from the inside out; all that force was released the instant the cut was completed. *SNAP* shut. Launched angle grinder around, slamming cutoff disk into right hand forefinger. Plastic surgery to repair. Hooray for our public health system.
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Post by Lukas MG (chenessfan) on May 4, 2014 17:24:20 GMT
And I thought I was the only one who had trouble with the angle grinder occasionally getting stuck... no injury so far but once the grinder was thrown into my side and luckily got jammed with cloth before it could reach anything fleshy...
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Post by zooligan on May 16, 2015 20:21:16 GMT
Total newbie (to sword making, not to "crazy" projects) here. Great article! Got a couple questions:
I'm wanting to make a hybrid Philippine/Thai style blade,full-tang, single edge. What needs to be taken into account for single edge designs vs double edge designs as in your article? I'm guessing the heat treating of a non symmetrical needs some special consideration to avoid warping issues.
I'm considering making a full size mock up from wood or aluminum to help me refine bevel grinding techniques and jig development. I would love to make mock ups that have similar balance points to the final steel blade with wood handle slabs. What materials could I use for handle slabs on a wood mockup that would have the same density ratio as steel:wood?
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Post by fe3c on Aug 25, 2015 22:44:23 GMT
I realize this is an old thread, but I want to say thanks to brotherbanzai for putting it together. The combination of text and photos is really clear and readable. I'm just getting into grinding blades, and I have been lurking here for a while now. This tutorial (along with others from people like Tinker and Brendan) have been really helpful.
Just to toss out an idea, I think it would be great to format this tutorial into a printable PDF. Reading the whole thread online is okay, but being able to print it out for reference could be useful for beginners like myself. I would be happy to help with this, with brotherbanzai's permission or course.
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Post by aussie-rabbit on Aug 26, 2015 2:56:37 GMT
Yep, that and also, I bought this particular set of $12 calipers for he specific purpose of marking the lines on the blade blanks so that I wouldn't have to bother making the little special tool. So, as far as I'm concerned, these particular calipers are a tool made for scribing. For those who need a scribe here is a simple trick, next time you are in the hardware store buy a packet of 4" concrete nails, when you get home put one in your drill chuck and spin it against some 80 grit paper, or use your angle grinder, you can make a fine point or a steep one, concrete nails are hardened, these can be used as small centre punches or scribes, easy to make, easy to use, cost a few cents |
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Post by makopat on Jan 29, 2017 18:58:19 GMT
I joined SBG in 2010ish...so I learned enough about sword to not embarrass myself. The time has come that I decided to making a few knives instead of just modifying or buying. So I decide to start with a simple friction folder via stock removal. And low and behold here is a sticky post on SBG! Thanks again friends.
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Post by usher on Dec 16, 2019 7:16:24 GMT
is that what I think it is?
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I can also imagine that one can ruin a good blade quickly with the angle grinder...it's rather unforgiving and once material is removed, all is said.
