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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2009 21:13:05 GMT
Over the last couple of months I have gone through several different ideas for what sword I should get next. However looking at my sword collection I have realised that I have a nice spread of historical sword types, (type X, XIV, XV and XVI) and I would like to fill in the gaps. I am not to bothered at the moment with later swords so probably could live without type XIX to XXI, but would like to get the reaming types (XI XII XIII XVII and XVIII). Obviously this is a fairly long term plan and I am not going to go out and buy 5 swords tomorrow.
Any way for my next acquisition and to fill in the next gap, I am thinking of a XVIII and in particular a replica of Henry V’s sword. I have looked at both the Gen 2 and the arms and armour version. I’m trying to decide if the extra expense of the arms and armour one is worth while. The gen 2 is almost half the price but is 11 oz heavier and this worries me as it should be a fairly light sword( the original was about 2lbs 3 oz according to Oakeshott)
The stats for both swords are:
Arms and Armour
$590 Overall length 33.1 Blade 27” Weight 2lbs 1.4 oz PoB 2 7/8 Thickness 4.5 -3.5 mm Grip Length: 3 5/8''
Gen 2
$279 Overall length 34 Blade 27” Weight 2lbs 13 oz PoB 3.18 Thickness 4.8 -1.9 mm Grip Length: 3 3/8''
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2009 21:16:53 GMT
DSA version!! Also, the distal taper on the Gen2 looks more appropriate of such a sword. 3.4mm at the tip is pretty thick.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2009 21:30:10 GMT
If you can swing it, go for the A&A...they are right on par with Albion, with Albion having the slight edge on finish, but fit, aesthetics, handling, assembly are all 'benchmarks' so to speak.
Then you have to ask yourself, given the dimensions as put forth on both swords, how does the A&A have less distal taper and also less overall weight? Better mass distribution is going to be the answer to that.
Not that the Gen2 isn't a good sword - I'd say that it is, as Gen2 has a history of putting out tough swords; they tend to run a little heavy because, at one point, the majority of their customer base were reenactors in one way or another and desired tougher blades. The DSA version will probably share similar weight and handling characteristics to the Gen2.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2009 21:33:43 GMT
Actually type XVIII should have reinforced tip so Gen2 version tip might be too fragile for what this sword is meant.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2009 21:34:27 GMT
chenessfan, I take it you mean the DSA archers sword? I do like it, but it is a little bit to ambiguous as to what type it falls in to(its kind of halfway between type XV and XVIII). I appreciate that oakeshott’s typology is an arbitrary division of swords, and that there are a spectrum of shapes, but I would like a sword that I can look at and know that it’s typical XVIII.
As to the tip, I would have to disagree with you, having looked at pictures of several historical type XVIII, (including the original Henry V sword) they all have quite thick reinforced tips.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2009 21:41:56 GMT
Actually type XVIII should have reinforced tip so Gen2 version tip might be too fragile for what this sword is meant. I think this picture, from the review by Stevew64 says a lot about the tip
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2009 21:47:01 GMT
Lol, yes it does. But hey, the sword is still a great and durable cutter.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2009 21:48:44 GMT
cutting isn't everything
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2009 21:49:06 GMT
Btw: /index.cgi?board=europeansword&action=display&thread=13382
The 1.8mm thickness is impossible. Eyal seems to have some problems with thickness measures during the last few days...
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Post by Tom K. (ianflaer) on Nov 23, 2009 21:51:24 GMT
I just got a Christian Fletcher modified AT1557 which is a type XVIII very similar to the type you are looking at and I think that you should go for the A&A version. I am extremely impressed with the 1557, so much so that if you can hunt around and find one on the second hand market I think it would be worth your time. or talk to Christian Fletcher and see if this is one of the swords from the original ATrim lines that he intends to keep around (I sure hope so) because it is just that good.
sorry to go off on that tangeant. check this out: shooter Mike has one each of the A&A and the Gen2 Henry V. he also has two 1557's and has handled the Monarch which is Valiant Armory's Regal line answer to a type XVIII so he should really know which sword is the best of these and if one is worth the expense and effort to get over the others. look at Mike's Collection page: /index.cgi?board=collections&action=display&thread=5357
here's Mike's review of the 1557: /index.cgi?board=swordreviews&action=display&thread=5054&page=1
so why all this about the 1557 when you want to know about the A&A? well I don't know the A&A model but I DO know the 1557 and it shows the difference getting a high-quality sword makes.
also for comparison here's my review of the Windlass Late Spanish sword which is a type XVIII. and while it is a good sword for the price it has NOTHING on the 1557. they are not even on the same planet.
in this case I think going for the higher end sword is the right choice if your budget will allow.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2009 21:59:15 GMT
Btw: /index.cgi?board=europeansword&action=display&thread=13382 The 1.8mm thickness is impossible. Eyal seems to have some problems with thickness measures during the last few days... Now that’s interesting!! I did not know DSA were doing a Henry V style sword. It adds third dimension to the mix. Though looking at their offering I think I would discount it. it’s a nice looking sword in its own right but strays a bit to far from the original for my taste. at 2lbs 13 oz its heavier then the A&A versions. It also lacks the width at the point of percussion and the extremely acute tip of the original.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2009 22:13:24 GMT
I take it that the AT1557 is no longer in production?
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Post by Tom K. (ianflaer) on Nov 23, 2009 22:25:24 GMT
it's hard to say. Christian Fletcher has said that the old ATrim models are being re-vamped and upgraded and the old models may not be available but it seems there are newer updates to them either comming or already done. either way he has none of them IN STOCK presently so you'd be looking at a wait but from what I can see looking at my new 1557 it is WELL worth the wait and expense. if I were you I'd talk to Mr. Fletcher and see what he says about making you one of these and you can use the extra time waiting to pay the extra costs over the Gen2. I don't know how much it would cost to have a plain model made but I know he charges for etching and mine has extensive complex etching on it so getting it plain should reduce the price noticeably.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2009 23:30:57 GMT
Arms and Armour has it in stock, so if you get it from them it will be fast. And... they have a very good reputation, but I haven't seen many reviews of their swords here. It would be nice to see
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2009 20:56:22 GMT
Tom, Its certainly beautiful and is close to what I would want in a type XVIII.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2009 14:25:38 GMT
Sure, if you have the money, go for ATrim or A&A. I meant the DSA Henry sword. It is right that the tip of the Gen2 Henry was too fragile but I think that was fixed on the next batch. Also, Mike tested a Gen2 Henry had he said it handles very well and cuts great. There was a cutting vid with impressive cuts on double mats and stuff.
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Post by ShooterMike on Nov 26, 2009 9:53:22 GMT
If you love the Henry V sword, my recommendation would be for the A&A hollow ground version, though it is significantly more expensive than the flattened diamond version I have. Also, Craig Johnson at A&A will build you a custom version if you like.
The 1557 is an outstanding sword, and a custom version from CF is a very historic specimen, especially the permanently assembled models. If you are wanting a "typical Type XVIII arming sword with outstanding handling properties" that would be a great choice.
The Gen2 version is a nice sword. But as mentioned, it is significantly heavier than the actual antique Henry V sword and some have experienced problems with the tip, as pictured above.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2009 21:21:27 GMT
If you love the Henry V sword, my recommendation would be for the A&A hollow ground version, though it is significantly more expensive than the flattened diamond version I have. Also, Craig Johnson at A&A will build you a custom version if you like. The 1557 is an outstanding sword, and a custom version from CF is a very historic specimen, especially the permanently assembled models. If you are wanting a "typical Type XVIII arming sword with outstanding handling properties" that would be a great choice. The Gen2 version is a nice sword. But as mentioned, it is significantly heavier than the actual antique Henry V sword and some have experienced problems with the tip, as pictured above. Thanks mike, I am defiantly leaning towards the AA version
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2009 13:33:41 GMT
Sounds like a good choice!
I just noticed you're in England - the silly "anti-sword laws" won't be a problem?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2009 16:41:35 GMT
Sounds like a good choice! I just noticed you're in England - the silly "anti-sword laws" won't be a problem? So long as the blade is not curved it is legal to import and own, so should be OK, though the last two swords I bought in to the country were both opened and inspected by customs before allowing in to the country.
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