Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2009 11:13:02 GMT
i would like to know your opinions/experiences on the Valiant Armoury Crecy short sword
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Insane
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I'm not mental... Just Insane
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Post by Insane on Nov 8, 2009 11:43:12 GMT
I was thinking about getting a VA standard line sword. But after reading a lot on them i think it's better to wait till next year. Because Sonny is planning on making a lot of changes concerning the swords. I hope he's gonna look at the complete line and correct where it's needed. Because i really like most of the models in that line.
The problem with the old models are that they can be pretty heavy and have a thin tang.
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Post by Tom K. (ianflaer) on Nov 8, 2009 17:39:02 GMT
my opinion is wait till next year when the new Crecy is release based on Atrim designs and made to VA's current standard. it will be a good sword while the current one will not be.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2009 21:01:04 GMT
I wouldn't go so far as to say that the current one will not be a good sword. It will be unattractive, it will be heavy and perhaps cumbersome...ok. I see your point.
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Post by Tom K. (ianflaer) on Nov 9, 2009 21:15:50 GMT
the more I handle really good swords the more I am willing to pay the extra money for better swords. Valiant Armory are still in the range of quality that I can accept but they have become the standard, I simply will not buy anything that isn't at least as good as a VA practical series sword. I'm afraid I'm turning into a sword snob. I think the only thing that saves me is I still understand that not everybody sees things the way I do and some swords that doen't work for me will work for others. now I just have to remember that.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2009 21:29:53 GMT
Truly; lets just not let that snobbery deter any new enthusiasts from discovering the lower-priced offerings; it is why this site was started and how we got started, right?
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Post by Tom K. (ianflaer) on Nov 9, 2009 21:40:02 GMT
True, however I also would like to help prevent new folks from purchasing bad products and move them towards the good. this is also why this site got started.
my reccomendation for waiting on the new crecy is based on the fact that I have heard nothing good about the old VA Standard line and there will be a replacement soon that is bound to be a really good sword for a very reasonable price. so I still think that unless timing is a factor of consideration that waiting a few months will net a much better sword for the investment. I'm all for lower priced swords but there needs to be a line drawn where the quality loos for financial savings becomes too great. I would draw that line above the entire VA Standard line until I hear a reliable report to the contrary.
there are many Windlass models that fall above that line and many that do not so there would be an alternate route of exploration for our OP that would not require more money to be spent. I just can't help but think "gosh there's so much better stuff available and soon to be released why reccomend this?"
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Post by Tom K. (ianflaer) on Nov 9, 2009 21:50:53 GMT
ok let's take a look at the stats for this sword: Overall Length: 29.25" Blade Length: 22" Handle Length: 7" Cross Guard: 7" Blade Material: Hand hammer forged carbon steel Handle Material: Macassar Ebony Weight: 2 lbs. 12oz. Scabbard Included: Two-tone genuine leather scabbard. Crecy Short Sword: This versatile high carbon steel sword was named in honor of one of the most important battles in the Hundred Years War. Favored by archers for its swiftness and ease of use, short swords like these were used all through out Europe by professional infantry and peasants alike. Light enough to be carried on the side without being encumbering and strong enough to get the job done, this is a no-nonsense sword built for the serious man at arms. At 22-inches this sword is perfectly sized to be used in confined spaces like the narrow walk ways of a castle’s palisade or in the heavily wooded back roads found through out Europe. (Leather Scabbard Included) copied from www.valiant-armoury.com/standard.phpso we have a sword with a 22" blade and a 7 inch handle. there are longswords that have handles that long. and it weighs 2 pounds 12 ounces. that's terribly heavy for such a short sword. add to that a reputation for weak tangs poor assembly and QC I find myself thinking that this sword is not worth $189.99 especially when a practical arming sword is only $25 more. heck I'd rather get a 303 and cut it down to make a shortsword than buy one of these. but this is my personal opinion and if some one out there really likes the look of this sword and its stats and wants to take the plunge I fully support that and ask that they review it please
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2009 22:02:19 GMT
Just putting this into a martial artist's (although not a western sword art admittedly. Many filipino blade arts have spanish and portugese sword art influences, however) perspective; a lot of southeast asian blades have 6-7-inch long handles with 22-inch blades. I don't see the problem with that type of handle length, personally. In fact, I am quite comfortable with these exact blade and handle length specs.
The thin tang, poor assembly, and poor quality control makes me cringe, though. Also, this may just be personal taste, but I find the unsharpened ricasso kinda ugly and wall-hanger-like.
If they do decide to update this sword later this year to have a meatier tang and up the details a bit, but keeping the handle and blade length, I think I'd buy. I'd love a european style blade with the length similar to what I'm used to handling as a filipino escrimador.
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Post by Tom K. (ianflaer) on Nov 9, 2009 22:09:55 GMT
having a 7 inch handle is fine on a short sword, if that short sword is a wakizashi or a sword type DESIGNED to have a 7 inch handle. this sword design should have a 3.75 to 4.5 inch handle and that's a big difference. it's like having a wakizashi with a 22" blade and 12 inch tsuka. it makes it an entirely different sword.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2009 22:13:43 GMT
I'm not trying to argue with you, Tom, I'm just trying to put it in a different perspective. Of course, as I have stated, I'm not a practitioner of western fencing or any western sword art, and I have bigger hands than most so admittedly my views may be a little skewed.
With that being said, I think I'll take your advice and wait for next year's models to come in. I think we can all agree that to wait a little bit for good product is better than to immediately receive less-than-on-par product.
As a side note: Do you practice any WMA? I'm actually pretty interested in a lot of european sword arts as of very recently. I really like what I have seen so far.
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Post by Tom K. (ianflaer) on Nov 9, 2009 22:26:29 GMT
As a side note: Do you practice any WMA? I'm actually pretty interested in a lot of european sword arts as of very recently. I really like what I have seen so far. Almost 20 years worth. ( I started in 90-91) plus I have studied some Japanese swordsmanship although informally and infrequently. my main source of training has been SCA and self study out of books. but I have fought in many tournaments, many melees, and a few wars. I have even won a few tournements but that has been a while.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2009 23:15:36 GMT
I think the handle is made longer by the pommel, so it's not "really" 7 inches.
But I agree that there are better short swords out there for equivalent price.
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Post by Tom K. (ianflaer) on Nov 9, 2009 23:18:23 GMT
that's the thing though, sometimes they measure the pommel too, but sometimes they don't. now if I really wanted to know I'd contact Sonny and ask him but I'm not that interested but I would certainly reccomend someone who thinks they might want this sword to ask. even still there are sufficient other concerns to make me very cautious about this sword.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2009 0:40:40 GMT
By comparing the length of the blade vs total length vs handle length, unless my math is horrid I think we can conclude the pommel is included.
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Post by Tom K. (ianflaer) on Nov 10, 2009 1:10:31 GMT
most of the time I have found sword stats on the web to be pretty inaccurate especially with the lower end swords. there are stories of low-end swords coming to buyers vastly different than the stats state. I think what is important to understand here is that this old line of VA swords the Crecy is from comes from a different age of european reproduction swords. an age when much less was demanded, and understood. things have changed dramatically in the last 2 years or so for European swords. anything more than 2 years old is made based on an entirely different standard. a lesser standard than we have today.
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