# Communities > Antique Arms & Armour Community > Antique & Military Sword Forum >  Help in the identification of the sword

## Artem P.

Help in the identification of the sword

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## Glen C.

That's an interesting sword in several regards.  It almost seems to have more French use attributes than as a typical US eaglehead pommel.  The angels with acanthus wreath with a gladius in the center on the guard and what looks like a French infantry rolling thunderbolt on the knuckle bow.  Toss in an L monogram.

I'm stumped.  It is strange.

Cheers
GC

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## Glen C.

dupe/delete

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## Richard Schenk

Some photos of the blade would help.  Are there any maker's marks?  Engraved or etched designs?  Although the pommel and general design looks like an American militia officer's sword following the 1821 regulation, Glen is right about a lot of the decorative details looking French.  Blade details could resolve the matter.

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## Artem P.

Yes, there is a photo of the blade. on the blade are French motifs. But there is no initsial or brand of the manufacturer.

more photos on the site https://antiquegallery.com.ua/product/court-sword/

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## Will Mathieson

Possibly Solingen made and the letter in the wreath is an "F"

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## Eric Fairbanks

No doubt the blade is Solingen made with the ricasso castle possibly for French market. I see nothing resembling American motifs except the pommel.

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## Glen C.

F for?  L for Ludwig of Bavaria is found on a number of swords and would fit the blade's blue&gilt etch of the 1820s-1830s



Disregarding the scabbard, the hexagonal blade form also of the period up through the French restoration, post first empire (which retained these "stepping out" epee d ville swords).

The blade etch of the first quarter or so with Solingen graphics found marked to a couple of cutlers I can think of.  Helvig for one.  The ferrule and grip dividers can sometimes be compared to others and some elements almost iconic, such as palm fronds or lilies.  Here is my remaining older example of an evening sword with the floral on the side of the pommel that matches this ferrule.




Italian states and Romania used eagles but the associations later than this sword (imo).  I do seem to recall some swords at the political level of Bavaria and other states did use an eagle, of sorts.  From my files.  I'm pretty sure I have a MaxII of Bavaria emblazoned example of this one.  Drives and files everywhere  :Wink: 



In short, I'm still a bit stumped and have nothing like it in a dozen years of serious eagle archiving.  Thanks for a link to the sword as it shows more angles to the grip and the divider.  The scabbard to be disregarded entirely but the blade and b&g place it in time pretty well.   The gold deposition on the hilt parts as well of that period.  It is a premium sword in its time and not a run of the mill diplomats sword.  Someone important was the first owner.

Cheers
GC

PS

 The lion and hound on the guard are kind of Bavarian as well.

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## Will Mathieson

Glen if it's an "L" then the wreath is upside down and the letter too. Wearing the sword vertically shows it as an "F" and why would an L have a central horizontal, more of a swirl in this case. 
I understand that an L fits the name Ludwig but as an L upside down when the sword is worn and the wreath then also upside down.
The sword you pictured has the L in the correct position, upright when worn.

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## Glen C.

So F who?

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## Will Mathieson

What??  Austria had Ferdinand 1st and Francis Joseph 1st that fit into the time period for this sword.

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## Glen C.

There's a start Will.

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## Artem P.

The scabbard of the sword new. Does the sword look like a court official?

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## T. Donoho

Looks like a "married" piece--not quite right.

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