# Communities > Antique Arms & Armour Community > Antique & Military Sword Forum >  Confederate Swords and Sabres

## A.Ducote

Nothing seems to have been uniform in the Confederacy, down to the cavalry sabres.  The general pattern is a copy of the US 1840, but there is much variation, mainly in the hilt.  Most blades are slightly curved and have an unstopped fuller and exhibit some form of crude manufacture.  Exceptions always abound and there are some blades that have no fuller at all. 

Below are photos of Boyle & Gamble (Richmond, VA), Confederate States Armory (Kenansville, NC) and Louis Haimon & Bros (Columbus, GA) hilts.  The Boyle & Gamble has an enlongated grip with one strand of iron wire. Notice that is blade is unfullered -- hence the name in the collecting world "Boyle & Gamble flat blade".   The bars of the Kenansville guard tend to be more flat with a flattened pommel cap.  The Haiman grip is remarkedly tapered downward.  Haiman's  also have a fault at the ricasso and may be found with either leather or painted canvas grips typically bound by one strand of thick iron wire.  

The fourth hilt is a true Confederate imported British P1851 cavalry sword.  Many of these swords are assumed (most without basis) to be Confederate imports.  The only P1851s accepted as Confederate either bear some provenance, have period "Issaac & Co." stamped on the spine or are are stamped "Mole" and have a brass hilt.  This one is a Mole with a brass hilt.  They should always be devoid of any British government markings. 

Ok . . . . I started the ball rolling on this. Does anyone have some picture of other Confederate swords or sabres to share?

Andre

PS -- looks to me like the Boyle & Gamble has been regripped.  If anyone has a better picture of one, please post it.

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## A.Ducote

Here is the first model Kenansville

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## A.Ducote

Here is the Haiman

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## A.Ducote

Here is the CS British P1851 import

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## George Wheeler

Andre,

Nice CS swords.  Here is an example of a "Dog River" sword manufactory CS cavalry sabre.  No one knows who made this sword but an identical one is in the CS Museum in New Orleans.  Notice the quillon on the guard and the crude casting and finishing.  Also, notice the brass suspension bands on the iron scabbard.

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## Mark McMorrow

Neat swords!  Just to make things interesting, here is a D-Guard of the type commonly attributed to Froelich (Confederate States Armory) and there seems to exist at least some uniformity among surviving examples of the type.  Note the dots located on the inside of the guard by the grip (similar dots can be seen on another example pictured on JS Mosby's site).

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## A.Ducote

> Andre,
> 
> Nice CS swords.  Here is an example of a "Dog River" sword manufactory CS cavalry sabre.  No one knows who made this sword but an identical one is in the CS Museum in New Orleans.  Notice the quillon on the guard and the crude casting and finishing.  Also, notice the brass suspension bands on the iron scabbard.



If they were but mine, George.  Still, I'm working on it.   

Yep. That's a Dog River all right.  I tried to go to the CS Museum in New Orleans in January, but it was closed for renovations.  The Museum is owned by Tulane University.  Tulane tried to shut it down and convert it to a different Museum.  Public outcry kept it open.   

Andre

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## A.Ducote

> Neat swords!  Just to make things interesting, here is a D-Guard of the type commonly attributed to Froelich (Confederate States Armory) and there seems to exist at least some uniformity among surviving examples of the type.  Note the dots located on the inside of the guard by the grip (similar dots can be seen on another example pictured on JS Mosby's site).



That's a nice Bowie, Mark.  I have read that the dots are associated with Froelich.  Froelich also used Roman numerals on his swords.  The numerals scratched into the base of the guard on his swords are supposed to match those on the top of the throat of the scabbard (if they are a matched set).  

Interestingly, on my Haiman, someone scratched Roman numerals on the base of the guard.   We believe these to be done in modern times.  There is no doubt that my sword is a genuine Confederate made sabre.  However, until about 10 years ago, it would have been called a "Dog River" -- unknown maker, but Confederate.  In recent years, collectors and appraisers put two and two together and started looking at the traits of the marked Haiman's and comparing them to all of the "Dog River" sabres out there.   My guess is that someone tried to give my sword a name (i.e. "Kenansville") prior to its association with Haiman by scratching some Roman numerals on it.  My sword, as shown below, looks nothing like a Kenansville, but it has that pronounced curve of the grip, single strand of iron wire and painted canvas wrap that is common on Haimans.  To my knowledge, Haiman did not mark swords with Roman numerals. 

Andre

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## George Wheeler

> If they were but mine, George.  Still, I'm working on it.   
> 
> Yep. That's a Dog River all right.  I tried to go to the CS Museum in New Orleans in January, but it was closed for renovations.  The Museum is owned by Tulane University.  Tulane tried to shut it down and convert it to a different Museum.  Public outcry kept it open.   
> 
> Andre


Yes, I saw the pictures of the museum with water halfway up the steps to the front door.  Very sad and Tulane should be ashamed to try to close it as it was built specifically for its purpose as a Confederate museum.  I saw the sword that is a duplicate of mine there years ago but they only had an ancient aquisition card that listed it as a gift from a CS veteran and did not list his unit or any information about where the sword was made.  I have had this particular sword since the 1960s.

So as not to short the Artillery, here is another Confederate "Dog River" Heavy Artillery sword from my collection.  This one is neat in that it has the original frog.  The frog has a leather front and a sack cloth back.  While the South was short of leather, they had plenty of cotton available for accouterments.  I think that the frog is as rare as the sword.

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## A.Ducote

> Yes, I saw the pictures of the museum with water halfway up the steps to the front door.  Very sad and Tulane should be ashamed to try to close it as it was built specifically for its purpose as a Confederate museum.  I saw the sword that is a duplicate of mine there years ago but they only had an ancient aquisition card that listed it as a gift from a CS veteran and did not list his unit or any information about where the sword was made.  I have had this particular sword since the 1960s.
> 
> So as not to short the Artillery, here is another Confederate "Dog River" Heavy Artillery sword from my collection.  This one is neat in that it has the original frog.  The frog has a leather front and a sack cloth back.  While the South was short of leather, they had plenty of cotton available for accouterments.  I think that the frog is as rare as the sword.




George,

Tulane has become a haven for political correctness.  That was the motivation behind changing the museum. It will remain as is.   

That is a nice artillery sword, expecially with the frog and scabbard. The frog is very rare. I bet you could it for as much as the sword.  

You are right about the leather.  Apparently, there was a major textile mill in Columbus, GA. Hence the proliferation of Haiman's with painted canvas grip wraps. 

Andre

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## J.G. Hopkins

Is there a "Holy Grail" of Confederate swords--a particular model by a particular maker, perhaps?  

Jonathan

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## A.Ducote

Here is another CS cavalry hilt. This one is a Memphis Novelty Works product.  Memphis Novelty works got around,  under a different name and at different locations.  Memphis Novelty Works became Leech & Rigdon.  It moved from Memphis, TN to Columbus, MS and finally to Greensboro, GA -- running from the Federal army all the way.  Still, with the uprooting, this company managed to produce an astounding number of cavalry sabres, officer's swords, knives, bayonets and cutlasses.  In addition, it produced some 1500 Colt knock off percussion pistols.  

Please note that I believe that this grip has been rewrapped. Although professionally done, it has the look of being a little too nice. 

Oh, and George, I don't own this one either, but its on the list.  

Andre

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## A.Ducote

> Is there a "Holy Grail" of Confederate swords--a particular model by a particular maker, perhaps?  
> 
> Jonathan


Well, Robert E. Lee's sword would be nice, but . . . . :Big Grin: 

Actually, for me, its would be a Dufilho or Pradel (New Orlean's makers) Louisiana State seal staff officer's sword.  An original Dufilho is depicted below.  That sword appeals to me because of my Louisiana heritage.  I can't think of any other mass produced (as much as the Confederacy could mass produce) officer's sword that has a state seal incorporated into the guard.  It is not really known if Pradel was just an etcher or made swords.  However, there are enough examples with his name on them to make the experts believe that he manufactured them.   

Other than that, I think that a Boyle & Gamble (Richmond, VA) staff and field sword would also look nice in my collection.  A picture of the hilt is depicted below.   

Both of these swords have been mass produced as replicas.  Some were made back in the 1960s and have naturally aged making them look really good. 

The Dufihlo/Pradel is typically stamped with something assinine like "Richmond Arsenal" or "Atlanta Arsenal" and the date 1862.  First of all, Confederate government arsenals did not issue officer's swords.  Certainly not staff and field swords.  As with the majority of armies of the time, Confederate officer's bought their swords.  Second, even if a government arsenal did issue officer's swords, why would any arsenal outside of one in Louisiana issue a staff and field sword with the LA state seal on it?  

The repro Boyle and Gamble staff and field sword will have the top of the star entering the border.  On all originals, the star never enters the borders.  

Any supposed CS sword bearing the date 1862, or for that matter any date, stamped in the blade should be looked at with high scrutiny.  Then again, any CS sword should be looked at with high scrutiny.  This is one area that it pays to buy only from a very reputable dealer.  Still, some fakes are so good that they slip through. 


Andre

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## A.Ducote

Here is a reproduction Dufilho.

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## A.Ducote

Here is an image of an original Boyle & Gamble staff and field guard.

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## A.Ducote

And here is a picture of a repro Boyle & Gamble staff and field hilt.  Notice the crude, ugly, unproportional star reaching into the border?  Boyle & Gamble was not that crude of a manufacturer and, in fact, made swords for many different retailers in Virginia and possibly other states.

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## George Wheeler

Here is an interesting sword that is Confederate by association.   :Cool: 

This is a Masonic Knight's Templar sword made by Henderson-Ames circa 1890.  It is identified to a Confederate Veteran by the initials engraved on the ivory grip and his name etched on the blade.  The sword itself is a rather standard Knight's Templar sword but the owner makes this one different.

Private Jesse M. Simpson served in Company D of the 57th Virginia Infantry (Galveston Tigers) CSA.  The 57th was originally commanded by Lewis Armistead who later commanded the brigade of which the 57th was a part at Gettysburg, where he (General Armistead) was killed in Pickett's Charge.  Pvt. Simpson fought at Seven Days, Second Manassas, Antietam, Fredericksburg, Chancellorsville, and was wounded at Gettysburg.  After being captured and paroled at Gettysburg, he continued his war fighting in the Wilderness, Spotsylvania, Cold Harbor, and Petersburg.  He was with General Lee when Lee surrendered at Appomattox.  

There was no sword for Confederate Veteran associations (like the Union Grand Army of the Republic swords) but this CS veteran did have a sword.  And... this is it.

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## George Wheeler

Whoops!  I forgot to show the grip initials.

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## A.Ducote

> Whoops!  I forgot to show the grip initials.



Very interesting sword, George, and one that belonged to a seasoned veteran.  The 57th was at the front of the pack with Armistead at the wall.  It is an amazing that Simpson survived. 

Andre

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## Mark McMorrow

George,

Some older lodges can be pretty amazing in terms of the material they keep.  If you know his place of residence, you might be able to find his lodge (if it still functions).  Its a long shot, but you never know...

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## Hugh B.

I was lucky enough to find this sword hidden between the rafters of my attic.  Unfortunately, I know little about it apart from the obvious.

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## Glen C.

Hi Hugh,

It looks like it might be a College Hill Arsenal effort. Here is another.



This sword is and has been reproduced. Here is a present offering. I don't have great overall pictures of my example of these but I'll put something up hopefully this weekend.

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## Glen C.

Here is my reproduction. I had bought it more to have an infantry length sabre to cut with than for really needing a CSA reproduction. That it does have a steel backstrap and the guard and scabbard do bear some resemblence means that with some work, these might fool someone with little reference. Especially if photo angles are just right, some of the most obvious traits could be easily hidden.




Cheers

hotspur; _snuck in some outside time between showers_

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## A.Ducote

Hi Hugh,

I'm not sure if your's is the real deal or not.  It may be.  If your sword is original, I'm not sure if the scabbard is the original mate to it.  My understanding of Nashville Plow Works/College Hill Arsenal scabbards is that the metal scabbards have brass bands on the suspension rings.  Still, with all things Confederate, there is variation.  I suggest that you have the sword inspected by a professional.  If original, your sword's value is substantial.

A little bit about these two firms. Nashille Plow Works, aka Sharpe and Hamilton, was pre-war exactly what its name implied -- a plow works.  The other ranks sabres generated by Nashvill Plow Works certainly look like they came from a plow manufacturer.   College Hill Arsenal is described as a competitor of Nashville Plow Works located the same town.  These two firms produced a cavalry officer's sword with practically identical hilt that is otherwise unique to the Confederacy (as opposed to a standard 1840/181 type hilt).  The hilt of both firm's swords distinctivly have "CSA" incorporated on the underside of the guard as depicted above.  There are some subtle differences between the two -- most evident being that the Nashville Plow Works hilt has the firms name cast into the underside of the guard opposite the CSA.   There are some who believe that these guards were all made by Nashville Plow Works with some being made for College Hill on a contract basis.  The other main difference concerns the backstrap and pommel.  The vast majority of Nashville Plow Works backstraps and pommels are brass, while the College Hill backstraps and pommels are iron. This difference in the pommel and backstrap would lead one to believe that each firm assembled their own swords.  If College Hill contracted for hilts, why not the whole thing (guard, backstrap and pommel)?   One thing is for certain, both of these firms were busy in the early days of the Confederacy.  There are relatively speaking quite a few known examples existing from each firm.  Production for both ceased in 1862 when Nashvillle fell to Federal hands. 

Take a look at the pictures of the Nashville Plow Works enlisted sabre that I have attached.   See what I mean about looking like it was made by a farm implement manufacturer? 

Andre

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## Javier Ramos

My first sword was a Spanish line cavalry officer sword from Toledo, dated 1860 and in a wonderful condition. The thing appeared in Georgia and was being sold as a Confederate Civil War import. What was unlikely.

Then I was surprised a couple of years ago when I saw this:











And it seems it was not a scam!



Javier

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## A.Ducote

Javier,

There certainly are some unexpected twists.  I have not heard of Spanish swords being mass imported by the Confederacy. Only recently I learned that the Confederacy imported Enfield rifle muskets made in Spain under contract.  

What you have produced to us would be an officer's sword -- and probably for quite a wealthy officer.  The CSA did not provide swords to officers, so it would have been a private purchase item.  Parts of Florida, Alabama, Mississippi and Louisiana were once Spanish colonies. So it is not outside the realm of possibility that an officer from one of those regions would purchase a Spanish sword.  Also, it may have even been imported by a retailer.  Spanish blades have a reputation of being of very good quality.  

There is a tendency for collectors and dealers of ACW militaria to assume that any period sword which fits a pattern and is found in the US is an import for the CSA or the USA.  Personally, I don't ascribe to that believe as there is no provenance which links the sword to either government.  However,  there are often swords that fit that bill and have good provenance.  

This is the first time that I have seen this particular sword.  I, like you, wouldn't expect a Spanish sword to have any CS provenance.  Looking at the sword without the reference, I would tend to want to give some different meaning to "CS" other than Confederate States.  

If I may ask, what book is that from?   I have just about all of the CS sword books. Based upon the drawing, I'm thinking that maybe it is Albaugh's illustrated Confederate Swords book.  I have the photographic supplement, but not the original book. 

Clarify this for me --- did you purchase the sword marked CS?   

Andre

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## Javier Ramos

The sword was at an ebay auction. I think it finished between $500 and $1000. Something not exagerated but enough to purchase a XVIII century piece, which I would have prefered, so I did not buy it. The seller included the book illustration. The curious thing is that the hilt also looks similar (French) to Toledo examples from the period, it is not just a blade crossing the Mexican border. The factory was used to carry personal orders and that is what this seems to me, although I would have expected a blade from 1859-1864, not from 1855. Storaged?

I was told once the following. The last Carlista civil war in Spain finished in 1875 by a peace agreement. The weaponry from the Carlistas with no inmediate use was stored at artillery magazines all through Spain. This included much surplus material from both sides of the French Prussian war of 1870-71. Most of this obsolete material was still there after the civil war of 1936-1939. And in the 1960s when Spanish dictator Franco got quite a lot of US military stuff from WW2 and Corea wars, the magazines were emptied in order to make room and the Americans bought much of it for just pennies. That is the reason of why there are so many Spanish 1895 and Puerto Seguros cavalry swords in USA or 1907 bolo knifes... and maybe many of those spurious US civil war imports from France and German states!

Regards.
Javier

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## A.Ducote

> The sword was at an ebay auction. I think it finished between $500 and $1000. Something not exagerated but enough to purchase a XVIII century piece, which I would have prefered, so I did not buy it. The seller included the book illustration. The curious thing is that the hilt also looks similar (French) to Toledo examples from the period, it is not just a blade crossing the Mexican border. The factory was used to carry personal orders and that is what this seems to me, although I would have expected a blade from 1859-1864, not from 1855. Storaged?
> 
> 
> Regards.
> Javier



Yes, the blade date would not be what you would normally expect with a CS hilt.  I would think 1860-62 more likely.  I believe that after 1862, the Federal blockade was pretty effective to slow up blockade runner traffic to the CS.  Mail to Europe was probably not a prime cargo for a hard pressed outgoing blockade runner, nor would one sword made on special order be all that attractive either.  Rather, blockade runners needed something that would make it worth their time -- outgoing cotton and incoming mass produced arms and accoutrements.  

Still, who knows.  I could see an older blade being mated with a CS made hilt by a Confederate maker, but isn't the hilt on this sword of Spanish design? 

Andre

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## Juan J. Perez

Javier, do you really read "CS" on this hilt? I think that what you have there is "VL", which stands for "Voluntarios de la Libertad", a well-known Spanish liberal militia active in mid-19th cent. This swords are not so rare, and their variety is notable, not being for regular units. It is based on the M1851 sabre for regular Spanish Infantry officers.

Other possibility is "Y II" (Ysabel II, Elisabeth II of Spain), the current Queen in that moment. Difficult to tell with that picture.

Juan J.

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## Javier Ramos

Actually i do not see the CS more than you do... once I forget the book illustration!

It will be nice if somebody is able to identify the book it belongs, and check if the blade matched to the CS hilt was from Toledo.

Javier

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## A.Ducote

> Actually i do not see the CS more than you do... once I forget the book illustration!
> 
> It will be nice if somebody is able to identify the book it belongs, and check if the blade matched to the CS hilt was from Toledo.
> 
> Javier


Yes, I would like to know what book that is what sword is the source of the drawing as well.   

Andre

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## Harvey A

Here's one: Leech and Rigdon Cavalry Officer's Sabre, Columbus Mississippi

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## Harvey A

> Is there a "Holy Grail" of Confederate swords--a particular model by a particular maker, perhaps?  
> 
> Jonathan


There are several at the top of the list:

Any high grade, presented, one of a kind type
Leech & Rigdon Cavalry Officer 
Dufilho Staff
CS Naval Officer
Haiman Staff 
Griswold Fort Hilt

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