# Communities > Antique Arms & Armour Community > Chinese, South-East Asia (CSEA) >  China Ming Dynasty Longquan Sword

## kevin.feng

one of my favorate sword in my reading room .....  enjoy  :Smilie:

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## kevin.feng

demostrating the power of the sword owner

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## kevin.feng

the "Ru Yi" head of sword means satification or fitness

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## kevin.feng

"dragon" on the sword

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## kevin.feng

though most of the green shark skin dropped, still a good antique sword

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## Phil Hettel

If possible could you post some pic's of the blade????

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## kevin.feng

> If possible could you post some pic's of the blade????


here it comes

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## kevin.feng

the edge

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## kevin.feng

http://hfsword.com/bbs/viewthread.ph...D0%C7%C2%ED%2B

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## josh stout

Can you please tell me what makes this Ming?  I can see that the fittings are more deeply carved than normal, and are a very fine quality, but they are so similar to Qing things.  

Examples of details that I would associate with Ming things are; a scabbard with a different suspension system broken up into three sections, a large pierced pommel, pommel and guard with open/pierced ironwork, or a guard with large eyed, large nosed monster face.  

If I had to guess, I would call this one early to mid Qing (early 18th/ late 17 th c.).  

I respect your opinions, and you have the sword in hand, but I would like to know some of the reasoning behind the Ming date.
Josh

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## kevin.feng

your points are valid in most of cases, but not you cannot find a single case for Long Quan;-)

Long Quan is well-known and huge volume produced Jian in south China during the past hundreds years, and actually the brand of Long Quan starts even longer - about 2000yr ago in bronze generation.

there's several reasons this Long Quan Jian could be considered as a Ming's one:

1. the Ru Ding (nipple) Ru Yi pommel 
    you can find the pommel with Ru Ding in Song or Ming's paintings but not in Qing Dynasty. And Ru Yi pommel is also less in Qing Dynasty. Qing's Long Quan is different. Qing's uses a lot of patterns ie. Chuan Zhi Lian (branch lotus), Cao Long (grass dragon) etc. that today's Long Quan is almost the same.

2. sheath fitting
   the Long Quan's fittings of sheath are typically in five pieces. Four pieces are considered earier. But this needs to be determined combined with other factors.

3. the blade
   Qing's blade is more thin and sharp in the point. 

It is not difficult to find a lot of Jian, pictures or paitings re this topic. It's been a hot topic several years ago in Chinese sword collectors.

But nothing is guaranteed. A humble and safe aging can be Ming to early Qing. But some of collectors still prefers to age this Long Quan as a Ming. A similar Ming's Long Quan from my friend can be found at http://hfsword.com/bbs/viewthread.ph...hlight=&page=1

BTW, a Long Quan with deeply carved fittings (like this one) can be typically found in Fujian areas.

Hope this clarified;-)

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## Kenneth, H.

> one of my favorate sword in my reading room .....  enjoy


Those fittings look very familiar. I believe I've seen a similar piece in the book "Steel and Iron swords of China" by Huang Fu?

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## kevin.feng

yes, Longquan Jian Series are all similar. But if you look into the details, they are very various. :Smilie: 

HuangFu (Alex) Jiang is preparing to write another book to introduce Longquan. 

small portion of Alex's collection:
http://hfsword.com/bbs/viewthread.ph...light=%2BWuDao

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## Hermann Bohn

A lot has been said and written on the Longquan swords, from antiquity to modern times.

After having seen Hungfu's book (best pics collection, his writings I take with a healthy critical approach as I myself have trained in sinology with a PhD, so my Wenyanwen is good enough to read primary sources myself) and having seen an exhibition on Longquan swords here in Taiwan (of course they didn't bring the good stuff?!), I also listend to a speech of Mr. Wu Qinrong, a Longquan respresentative, read his book 霜雪龍泉劍, and must say, that all this couldn't impress me very much.

My question: Is there any real quality stuff as repros comming out of Longquan nowadays?
Any links would be most wellcome!

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## josh stout

> your points are valid in most of cases, but not you cannot find a single case for Long Quan;-)
> 
> Long Quan is well-known and huge volume produced Jian in south China during the past hundreds years, and actually the brand of Long Quan starts even longer - about 2000yr ago in bronze generation.
> 
> there's several reasons this Long Quan Jian could be considered as a Ming's one:
> 
> 1. the Ru Ding (nipple) Ru Yi pommel 
>     you can find the pommel with Ru Ding in Song or Ming's paintings but not in Qing Dynasty. And Ru Yi pommel is also less in Qing Dynasty. Qing's Long Quan is different. Qing's uses a lot of patterns ie. Chuan Zhi Lian (branch lotus), Cao Long (grass dragon) etc. that today's Long Quan is almost the same.
> 
> ...


Thank you, that is very good information.  I have followed what I can on the various debates on how to date things.  The Ru Ding Ru Yi is a new characteristic for me though.  I mostly have tried to look at village things because they are what I can find and afford :Wink:   It is nice to see some refined things with characteristics that can be classified a bit more.  With village things I always have to wonder if something is representative of a type, or is one of a kind.  If you can show more examples of pieces with datable characteristics I would truly appreciate it. I am familiar with a few of the more commonly known characteristics, and have started to figure a few interesting things out for myself from my collection,  but you have already shown me several things I have never seen before.  More, more, more :Big Grin: 
Josh

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## kevin.feng

Josh, you are welcome.

this is another Ming's Ru Ding Ru Yi Shou Long Quan. But it is not 100% origional fitness.

http://hfsword.com/bbs/viewthread.ph...hlight=&page=1

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## kevin.feng

Here's several very good Qing's Long Quan

http://hfsword.com/bbs/viewthread.php?tid=25675

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## Liuxing Ma

> your points are valid in most of cases, but not you cannot find a single case for Long Quan;-)
> 
> Long Quan is well-known and huge volume produced Jian in south China during the past hundreds years, and actually the brand of Long Quan starts even longer - about 2000yr ago in bronze generation.
> 
> there's several reasons this Long Quan Jian could be considered as a Ming's one:


Gu bing qi zhuan jia

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