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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2008 9:59:36 GMT
Hello everyone. I just purchased a Hanwei Bearded ax from Kultofathena.com. I wanted to personalize it a little when it arrives. I wanted to give it a name, and carve it in runes on the haft of the weapon (I'd inscribe it on the ax-head, but I still haven't quite figured out how to do it myself...I may give it a shot sometime later.). But I can't figure out how to translate any of the possible names into old norse, and then into runes. The only old norse translator I could find was just a dictionary, and i'm fairly certain combining two words is a lot more complicated that simply mashing them together. I also haven't figured out how to correctly spell out words in runes either. If anyone could help me with translating any of the possible names into norse/runes, i'd be grateful. Possible names: Sea-wolf Iron-wolf Spine-breaker Shield-splitter Man-slayer I wasn't sure which forum section to post this in...so since this is "Other weapons" and my topic relates to axes, I thought i'd post it here. If there's a more suitable topic section, point me in the right direction. Thanks in advance for any help you might be able to give. - Vidarr
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2008 10:50:07 GMT
Well translated into norse/icelandic Sea Wolf - Sjor Ulfur In the lesser futhark; Iron Wolf - Jarn Ulfur Spine Breaker - Hryggur Brotsjor Shield Splitter - Skjoldur Skerandi These are quite hard to do when I can't do inflections or umlauts of the more intersting symbols.
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Post by Brendan Olszowy on Nov 29, 2008 14:30:45 GMT
If you want to learn about the language of Old Norse and how it was structured, this is an online book which should tell you what you need. But I haven't studied it yet: www.utexas.edu/cola/centers/lrc/eieol/norol-TC-X.htmlIf you found that PDF dictionary which translates english to old norse you may have found the same one as me: www.yorku.ca/inpar/language/English-Old_Norse.pdfWikipedia has a great page on runes from all different cultures. And there are alternative commonly used runes available too - For my Conan's fathers sword I just took the prettier ones for each letter: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RunesBB was saying that runes are used phonetically, and spell out the sound of a word, rather than our spelling. I don't know much about it though. I don't know what century that axe is based on, but the younger Futhark is apparently the one to use for post 9thCentury Good Luck - Keep us posted with pics and all. Are you going to burn them on with a soldering iron? Thats what I did on my Conan's Father's sword - I ilke burning.
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Post by brotherbanzai on Nov 29, 2008 15:43:37 GMT
Yeah, it's my understanding (which may be flawed, I'm no historian) that runes are an alphabet not a language. In the same way that our modern English (Roman) alphabet is used by many different languages, runes were used by peoples who spoke different languages. Saxon, Danish, Norse, and others, then old English. Runes are phonetic so they are pronounced the same no matter what language they are in. You write them as the word sounds rather than how it is spelled. For English words that means things like no doubled letters unless they are both pronounced (better would become beter) and no silent letters (knife would become nif with the long I rune rather than the short I rune). To write in old Norse you would need to know how the words sound when spoken rather than just how they are spelled, if there is a difference.
Though it might be kind of cool to write the runes in old Norse, it isn't exactly necessary to do so to be "correct". Since runes were originally used for a number of different languages, there's no reason why they can't be used for modern English as well.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2008 18:30:23 GMT
I recognise most of the words in the PDF- document as some of these words still are in use in my dialect (which is based on norse and not danish as other norwegian dialects). Some of them are wrong, some has to be used in a special context, but most are right. I believe the non-important vocals were let out, so shield writes skialdr, wolf writes ulfr, at least this is how it is written on rune stones. The younger futhark is the one you should use, in my opinion of course the Norwegian/ Swedish lesser futhark. The danish one is perhaps more visual. My versions of your names: Hafulfr Jarnvargr (or stalvargr - steel wolf) Vargr is the aggresive name of wolf. Have no translation of the last two, but what about shield biter? Biter was used for norse axes and swords. Shield biter - Skialdbitr Stone biter - Stainbitr Head biter - Hufudbitr Or simply carve in the rune of Ty, the god of war, which many did for good luck in stridr (battle).
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2008 7:34:27 GMT
I think I like the sound of 'Skialdbitr'. My ax finally got here today (Of course, I don't get home til' midnight.), and i'm pleased with it so far. I'm probably going to work on it this weekend. Here's some pics of it right out of the box: @ Ichiban: How would you pronounce Skialdbitr? To me it looks like it would be pronounced Skee-ald-bitter. Is that correct? @ Brendan: I was just thinking of carving the runes into the haft. How would burning the runes into the haft with a soldering iron work? I'm sure it's more complicated than it sounds. Would you suggest that over carving the runes? @ Everyone in general: Thanks for all your help so far on the matter, I appreciate it.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2008 9:03:02 GMT
Using a wood burner to carve the Runes is acceptable, you are still carving them, remember, that Icelandic is closer to old Norse than Norwegian is to day, So, do you use the old Norse terms in Runic, or your modern, And spelling is whatever works, there is no correct way of spelling in Runic.....SanMarc.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2008 21:32:18 GMT
Skialbitr is pronounced Sholldbiitar, with the weight on -oll and -bi.
Icelandic is closer to norse than norwegian written, but not spoken. It is because they have kept the old grammatics. I can read some icelandic, faeroic, danish, swedish and some of the old norse based on my dialect, but I understand only spoken danish and swedish. I speak socalled nynorsk, which was a written language directly based on norse and norwegian dialect words and made during the 1850's. It was an opposition to danish which was the official language till the 1880's. My daughters actually speak norwegianized danish.
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ExtremeDeathman
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Are you staring at my Sword? You wanna taste it!?!
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Post by ExtremeDeathman on Dec 15, 2008 15:10:44 GMT
It needn't to be pronounced Sholldbiitar, as it isn't spelled Sholldbiitar. Skee-aold-bettur is the right pronounciation if you wright it Skialdbitr. Such bearded axes were sometimes called Bluhtsscavel [! Old Danish writing !] in the old Swedish slang which means Bloodshovel. Icelandic is closer to old norse with it's grammar, but the pronouncing is modern to.
Well I can speak the very old german and norse, also wright some of it, but I can't speak the modern norse languages.
@ Ichiban:
Your Daughter is speaking norwegianized danish??? How comes that? Does norway don't have an own language nowadays?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 3, 2009 21:54:49 GMT
@ Ichiban: Your Daughter is speaking norwegianized danish??? How comes that? Does norway don't have an own language nowadays? We have two different written languages, three if you count Sami. Norway actually wasn't a free country until 1905. Before that it had been in union with Sweden or Denmark since the 1300's, longest with Denmark. Norway was a land of peasants and fishermen, and the nobility, priests and officials were all danish or later educated in Denmark. The written official language was danish since the 1500's, and in eastern Norway people actually ended up speaking a language consisting of danish with norwegian dialect melody. In the other parts of Norway people spoke their dialects but wrote danish. In the 1850's a language researcher decided to make a new written language based on the dialects as an opposition to the danish. He made a grammar and collected words and made a new laguage based on the dialects and old norse. By the end of the 18th century the two languages, bokmål and nynorsk, were equalled as written language. There are lots of similarities, but different words and pronounciations. Danish and bokmål is very much influenced by modern german. Bokmål is mostly spoken in eastern Norway, nynorsk in western Norway. Some of the old dialects in western Norway are still very similar to the language spoken in early medieval times. To give you an example on how different the languages are, the word butterfly in bokmål is sommerfugl. In nynorsk it is fivreld. Fivreld is also the old norse word for butterfly. Friend in bokmål is venn, but in nynorsk it is frende.
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Post by ebsw0820e on Jan 4, 2009 7:44:58 GMT
'the gramrock'
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Post by swordboy bringer of chaos on Jan 4, 2009 8:36:54 GMT
care ful with the "gram rock" one there are a few places around here that yelling "GRAMROCK" could start a stampde
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Post by Brendan Olszowy on Jan 25, 2009 13:13:38 GMT
Just came back to this Vidar - did you try soldering the name in the wood. It's really that easy. I draw it in pencil first. I hold the iron in a vice and maneuver the wood. It's heaps easier than carving.
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Post by genocideseth on Jan 25, 2009 19:01:49 GMT
Do you just use a regular electrician soldering iron?
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Post by Brendan Olszowy on Jan 26, 2009 1:44:20 GMT
Yup. Wait til it gets real hot. Mine has a round tip cut on a 45 degree angle. It can cut a nice straight line or you can practice rolling the piecs around the tip for smooth curvy lines. It's a good look. You can do pretty detailed pictures with minimal practice. Have a try. Just draw the pic first in pencil to give you a line to follow.
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