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Post by Brendan Olszowy on Nov 25, 2008 14:28:06 GMT
I recommend using a cheap hand held belt sander with the handle in a vice. You can do a bit of work on a belt before it gets hot, plus you get to keep your fingers on it as a thermometer. It's gutless enough not to get you in any trouble.
I did my first reshaping with a bench grinder with a jig for the blade and a water drip. That worked, but a belt sander is better.
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Post by Matt993f.o.d on Nov 25, 2008 18:48:42 GMT
Just make sure its not a woodworking model. They're no cop for steel grinding, and it can stress the motor, bearings and belts themselves. Can be dangerous.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2008 19:09:35 GMT
not to beat the dead horse...
I tried to quench a blade ground out of mild steel (A36?) using snow and lots of agitation.
I did this having heard that ice water could be substituted for a "super quench" (Im aware that snow is not ice water)
Anyway... it didnt work.
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Post by Matt993f.o.d on Nov 25, 2008 19:39:36 GMT
You'll never get mild steel to harden by heat treating. Its carbon content is insufficient.
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slav
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Post by slav on Nov 25, 2008 20:14:21 GMT
Yes, A36 will never harden. It is not a blade steel. I learned that the hard way, back when I was young.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2008 21:17:29 GMT
A super quench is supposed to harden even "non hardenable" steels.... like A36.
When I get some time Ill try the Superquench as suggested as well as Ice water and see if it makes a difference.
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Post by Dan Davis on Nov 25, 2008 22:16:12 GMT
Correction: All steels will harden, just as all steels (and any other iron alloy under the sun) will form austenite. Even A36.
What you cannot do is get a mild steel like A36 to a hardness acceptable for use as a sword or knife blade.
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Post by brotherbanzai on Nov 25, 2008 22:22:20 GMT
Hey Mythos, The last time I reshaped an already heat treated blade, I clamped it to a table with a bucket of water next to it. I would take a couple passes with the grinder and then run a water soaked sponge over it. That way I didn't have to keep unclamping the blade to cool it. However you might be surprised at how quickly nice files will remove metal. Not as fast as a grinder of course but they do a much nicer job and don't throw sparks all over the place.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2008 4:08:27 GMT
Hey Mythos, The last time I reshaped an already heat treated blade, I clamped it to a table with a bucket of water next to it. I would take a couple passes with the grinder and then run a water soaked sponge over it. That way I didn't have to keep unclamping the blade to cool it. However you might be surprised at how quickly nice files will remove metal. Not as fast as a grinder of course but they do a much nicer job and don't throw sparks all over the place. This is true...there seems to be a LOT of good advice on this thread =). Even if 90% of it is off topic =p. One last thing...remember that even western through hardened swords are offten differentially hardened as a function of cross section. Be very careful with what work you do to change the geometry. The sword was built the way it was (if it's a quality product to begin with) for a reason. If you get into the softer spine it might create a flaw in the blade that could cause problems when cutting. How far in is safe? Will it actually cause problems for sure? I don't know...it's more a function of the original geometry and heat treat than anything else. Just something to keep in mind though. If you do, make sure and post your results so we can all learn from it though =) Cris
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Post by mythosequidae on Nov 26, 2008 12:08:25 GMT
Wow. This is terrific info. for amateurs like myself. Thanks so much. I've been reading the railway spike thread, and am very humbled by those of you who are involved with that, i.e. the last few of you to offer advice here. You fellows know your stuff. There is a clear line on this forum between those like myself who simply love swords, but really don't know very much about them, and you folk. We are not really compatible for sensible discussion, but yet you continue to address our questions which are undoubtedly trivial to yourselves. Know that we learn very much from you. Your knowledge and experience is much appreciated, and really instigates development for the rest of us. BB et al., your artistic ability is not comprehensible to most people. WOW! Thank you all.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2008 0:59:52 GMT
There is a clear line on this forum between those like myself who simply love swords, but really don't know very much about them, and you folk. We are not really compatible for sensible discussion, but yet you continue to address our questions which are undoubtedly trivial to yourselves. Know that we learn very much from you. Your knowledge and experience is much appreciated, and really instigates development for the rest of us. Thank you all. This is what this forum section is all about, not a hoity toity place with restricted access, but a place where anyone can come to learn. Keep up the good work everybody
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Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2008 1:58:34 GMT
Wow. This is terrific info. for amateurs like myself. Thanks so much. I've been reading the railway spike thread, and am very humbled by those of you who are involved with that, i.e. the last few of you to offer advice here. You fellows know your stuff. There is a clear line on this forum between those like myself who simply love swords, but really don't know very much about them, and you folk. We are not really compatible for sensible discussion, but yet you continue to address our questions which are undoubtedly trivial to yourselves. Know that we learn very much from you. Your knowledge and experience is much appreciated, and really instigates development for the rest of us. BB et al., your artistic ability is not comprehensible to most people. WOW! Thank you all. Thanks for the reference to my thread =). I'm sure you realize this...but that was my first knife ever. My first ANYTHING ever involving a hammer and hot steel. Believe me...I say this not to boast...but to point out that a few short months ago, I wasn't much different than you, in that I loved swords but didn't know much about them as far as creational aspects =). Thanks to the help of the people on this forum and others...I've gone from that base, to a person who is actually making things and learning every time I pick up whatever piece of work I happen to be on at the time (not to mention all the learning in between working lol). It's sort of funny...almost everything in bladesmithing is a contradiction...the last piece I worked on was both easier than I expected, and harder by half. Taking that first step from collector to maker is much the same. It seems so very large looking at it from your side of the fence...but once you've taken it, next thing you know you have a boatload of tools (both bought and made), and look at almost everything in the world with an eye to how it could make your new addiction easier lol, or wondering just what it's made of...and what you can make OUT of it. It's a great feeling =). Cris
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Post by mythosequidae on Nov 27, 2008 2:51:42 GMT
Nope. I thought that you had been doing this for years, and had simply taken on some water during a perfect storm. I was listening to a program on CBC Radio about what makes an individual excel at anything. The bottom line was this; These people step outside of their comfort zone. They attempt things that they cannot accomplish. Because they cannot accomplish it, they repeatedly fail. They keep trying, and still fail. They still keep trying, until they do not fail. They try some more, and eventually become better than good. Finally they reach the pinnacle. They obsess about every minute detail. They hone their mental discipline to perfection. This applies to athletes, musicians, house moms, business professionals and blade smiths, to name a few. You put much time into explaining your ways here, and are able to converse with the pros. I honestly thought that you WERE a pro. It's easy to tell that you will be. Thank you.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2008 5:27:13 GMT
Nope. I thought that you had been doing this for years, and had simply taken on some water during a perfect storm. I was listening to a program on CBC Radio about what makes an individual excel at anything. The bottom line was this; These people step outside of their comfort zone. They attempt things that they cannot accomplish. Because they cannot accomplish it, they repeatedly fail. They keep trying, and still fail. They still keep trying, until they do not fail. They try some more, and eventually become better than good. Finally they reach the pinnacle. They obsess about every minute detail. They hone their mental discipline to perfection. This applies to athletes, musicians, house moms, business professionals and blade smiths, to name a few. You put much time into explaining your ways here, and are able to converse with the pros. I honestly thought that you WERE a pro. It's easy to tell that you will be. Thank you. Wow...I am absolutely honored. Truly. There is nothing more I can say that describes it. Now, if only you would come over to my place and have that same discussion with my steel stock, forge...and quench tank...I'm sure I'd be doing much, much better lol =). Maybe if they get it in their heads that I'm a pro...this next blade will come out just right =D. Seriously though, thank you for the kind words. They do mean a lot (probably why I have to make light). One can only do their best...but your radio show was correct...keep doing your best, and eventually...with dedication, it will be the best ever done. Thank you again. Cris
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Post by Matt993f.o.d on Nov 27, 2008 21:52:02 GMT
Crikey! You two'll be announcing your engagement if you carry on like that! lol ;D
I am fond of forums. They are a nice place to exchange and learn techniques and share in the experience of one's blademaking elders. Nevertheless, I don't think that one can learn exclusively from forums. A book or a practical course is worth a million hours spent at a computer. Learning this way helps you put what people say on forums into a good perspective. So long as you pick a good book!
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slav
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Post by slav on Nov 29, 2008 4:14:24 GMT
Correction: All steels will harden, just as all steels (and any other iron alloy under the sun) will form austenite. Even A36. What you cannot do is get a mild steel like A36 to a hardness acceptable for use as a sword or knife blade. Then I guess it all depends on your definition of hard. ...I was going with my girlfriend's definition.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2008 2:41:38 GMT
Then I guess it all depends on your definition of hard. ...I was going with my girlfriend's definition. Hehehe...
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Post by Dan Davis on Dec 7, 2008 13:36:09 GMT
Sam, PLEASE lock this thread. OR better yet, delete it entirely.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 7, 2008 14:20:43 GMT
Useless fat trimmed, and this thread will be locked for preservation.
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