daoist
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Daoist in search of a dao.
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Post by daoist on Apr 12, 2024 2:42:12 GMT
I am a Chinese martial arts practitioner in search of a sword to practice with. Specifically, I am looking for a dao (alternatively a Chinese "saber" or "broadsword" if you like) that would be dull and fairly light, and thus suitable for practice and tournaments. In my search for such a sword, I have so far only encountered either - Finely crafted weapons that are rigid, pointy, and have a sharp edge that is intended for actual slicing; or
- Utter scrap metal pounded into a big Chinese-inspired butter knife and bolted to a handle.
I recently ordered a sword that was most certainly a case of "A" and hoped I could dull it into a practice weapon (blasphemy, I know). However, I quickly determined that there was no way to make it safe to swing around while learning swordsmanship basics.
My concern with swords of the "B" ilk is that, if one of them takes anything more than a mild ding it will shatter and send shards flying everywhere. Nearly every dao I've looked into that is intended for martial arts training doesn't contain any detailed steel specs, if it even describes the steel at all. Common descriptions are "stainless steel", "spring steel", or simply "steel". These do not help me, as there are dozens of different stainless steel alloys of widely varying properties.
With all of that said, does anyone know of a quality dao that can take the kind of hits that novice wielders inflict on it?
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eastman
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Post by eastman on Apr 12, 2024 2:53:41 GMT
have you checked out the LK Chen products? I believe you have the choice to order swords as sharps or blunts. I don't have one of their dao, but I am pleased with the quality of their Euro swords and the Jian I own.
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AndiTheBarvarian
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"Lord of the Memes"
Bavarianbarbarian - Semper Semprini
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Post by AndiTheBarvarian on Apr 12, 2024 3:14:22 GMT
A weird idea perhaps, but a member here bought a Cold Steel Chinese Broadsword machete and cut down the handle to a single hand grip.
He liked it.
It's cheap, solid, not too heavy and can be dulled.
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Post by pellius on Apr 12, 2024 13:33:09 GMT
There are companies that specifically sell wushu dao. They are designed to be safe as reasonably possible, and meet fundamental requirements for training, demonstration, and performance of form sets. Often your Kung Fu school can order one to meet their curriculum, and make a couple of bucks to boot.
The wushu swords are functional in that they are suitable for basic sword practice and won’t break when abused. They are not suitable at all for “functional sword use” as the term is generally used on this forum. They are way underweight to practice using a functional sword in actual sword fighting (not that you would actually sword fight, but many folks want to practice to actually fight rather than practice to look good in a judged performance).
There is no sword that is of proper weight, geometry, construction, and rigidity that is also entirely safe to use to practice all sword use. Those qualities are what make a sword a deadly weapon.
IMHO, a blunted but otherwise functional sword is the only reasonable option. Such a sword must be treated as a live blade, because that’s what it is. You are just far less likely to grievously cut or stab yourself.
All that said, the best dao (niuweidao) I have found is the LK Chen. It has great balance and geometry, and is available “unsharpened.” It is of an appropriate size for a modern westerner, and the grip is durable and “grippy.” Be aware that the hilt is overly long for some form sets and techniques. While easily compensated for, it would likely be unsuitable for a judged performance of those forms.
Fwiw
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Post by mrstabby on Apr 12, 2024 14:59:48 GMT
I agree LK Chen is s great coice, also if you contact LK Chen they can somewhat customize your order. Different handle wrap and extra thick sparring edges for example should be possible. The NiuWei Dao has a pretty thin blade out to the tip, so it isn't something you can really whack against hard objects not expecting damage. Their steel is 60Si2MnA, some compare it to 5160, some to 9260, truth is probably somewhere in-between. It's very tough, no chance of bending without really trying to. They still are quite hard and the edges won't get damaged easily. They also come pretty sharp out the box
Hanwei has 2 Dao, the brass hilt "Oxtail Dao" is a good sword, relatively similar to the LK Chen, but a relativelyshort 64cm/25" blade. Steel is good, construction is solid. Their Practical Kung-Fu sword is a bit longer, 71cm/28", and has a short, 1 handed grip. Also agood , cheap sword. Both come very sharp They also carry a Practical Tai-Chi sword (Jian) which is very cheap and available in 3 length. It's very light, 500g/1lbs, but it is not beautiful to my eyes it looks cheap, but it's also serviceable. It is onla sharp on the last 20cm/8" or something of the blade for training, but I don't think this really matters if it's only sharp at the tip or the whole length, it's still capable of devastating injuries. Hanwei uses either 1566 or 5160 steel, both very good spring steels, also good temper and edge retention. Of course the LK Chen have better quality but also cost more. They do carry other Dao as well, but I don't like the rectangular grips. - Now thinking of it they might be able to make one rounded if I ask. There is also Dynasty Forge, they carry a few very nice looking pieces. Their Tri-Steel is a laminate of 1095/1080/1065, a nice mixture maybe not as tough as the spring steels. I have no idea how this steel performs, but it's very likely also good, and these swords are definately a head-turner. I think if you want something tough and customized, LK Chen is your best bet, especially with the customisation option. Especially since you might be able to ask them to make it thicker for example. You can also ask them for extra dull tips, on the Jian for example they can make you a completely rounded, dull tip.
EDIT:Dynasty Forge seems to be not very available right now though.
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Post by pellius on Apr 12, 2024 17:10:49 GMT
I’ve been waiting around half a decade for DF to produce more Chinese sabers. Pretty sure none are coming at this point.
Just as well, I suppose. The LKC’s have better geometry and handling, are bigger, and have a more secure grip wrap.
Still, the DF’s were pretty.
I got a couple of niuweidao from Sinosword/JKOO which are very nice. The fittings are not as nice as DF’s, but a step up from LKC.
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Post by larason2 on Apr 13, 2024 23:23:50 GMT
I also suggest LK Chen. I have an order for two jian from them in the works. However, they have a very wide range of Dao available, so you'd have to go through them and also pick one! I suppose the Niu Wei Dao is an obvious choice, but every era of Chinese history since about the Han dynasty had their own style of Dao, and it isn't wrong to train with a particular one if that's the one you like best.
Also it's worth mentioning that the Japanese always consider a wooden bokken as a step to using a live blade, even a dull one. The weight isn't that dissimilar, but the risk of injury is far less. There are some bokken like the saburito that are closer to a Chinese dao, depending on what you are interested in, and you can probably get a custom made one, say from Kingfisher.
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Post by ragebot on Jun 28, 2024 21:29:54 GMT
I am a Chinese martial arts practitioner in search of a sword to practice with. Specifically, I am looking for a dao (alternatively a Chinese "saber" or "broadsword" if you like) that would be dull and fairly light, and thus suitable for practice and tournaments. SNIP I am curious about details about practice and tournaments. I am a novice wushu guy and none of the practice or tournaments I know of involve more than one person. I do have a set of wushu swords but they are the standard flimsley metal that was never designed to hit anything. As others have mentioned LK Chen is the best place unless you want a totally one off sword; and even then LK Chen will work with you on that. |
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