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Post by izzy on Dec 28, 2023 18:18:08 GMT
That is good to read, from my keyboard and screen it's easy to be disparaging and give critique, but reading that is stood up to about actual use and abuse better than some. I still think it could be improved some, but that can be said of a lot of things. If I remember correctly, the burl was right where the langets ended on the English WH--so it didn't have the benefit of that reinforcement. I think the long and deep socket on the original Tod based his on probably functioned much like langets to distribute force down the shaft. When I rehaft this hammer, I think I will make it shorter and perhaps pin the hammer head to the shaft too. Shorter handle should help...I have a son who also bangs way at stumps...we cut down a bunch of trees a few years ago, and he literally destroys the old stumps over time. His hammer is a old claw type, that has been welded to a steel pipe handle.
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Post by elemmakil on Dec 28, 2023 19:10:53 GMT
A note on the A&A version of this hammer: IIRC it was done in 1020 steel, so not nearly as strong as the Tod version of this piece.
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Post by izzy on Dec 31, 2023 23:21:25 GMT
A note on the A&A version of this hammer: IIRC it was done in 1020 steel, so not nearly as strong as the Tod version of this piece. I don't know if they were going for "historical accuracy" or what not, but that is a pretty low grade of steel. When I was younger I used to buy cast Tomahawks (The "Blackhawk" from Crazycrow, I think it was some Iron and steel alloy ? ) and still have a cast 4140 bearded axe ( bought off Ragnar / ragweed forge).
If you ever feel the need to rip through a steel drum let us know how it holds up.
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Post by AndiTheBarvarian on Dec 31, 2023 23:24:59 GMT
I assume you don't need quenched steel for a warhammer. No edge, not a real pointy tip even on the bec. And automatically work hardening.
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Post by elemmakil on Jan 1, 2024 5:38:39 GMT
A note on the A&A version of this hammer: IIRC it was done in 1020 steel, so not nearly as strong as the Tod version of this piece. I don't know if they were going for "historical accuracy" or what not, but that is a pretty low grade of steel. When I was younger I used to buy cast Tomahawks (The "Blackhawk" from Crazycrow, I think it was some Iron and steel alloy ? ) and still have a cast 4140 bearded axe ( bought off Ragnar / ragweed forge).
If you ever feel the need to rip through a steel drum let us know how it holds up.
It is an earlier piece, though I know that A&A has only recently started offering their axes and pole arms in high carbon steel (don't recall the specific alloy).
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Post by izzy on Jan 1, 2024 11:05:46 GMT
I assume you don't need quenched steel for a warhammer. No edge, not a real pointy tip even on the bec. And automatically work hardening. Well it would bash alright, I would worry the raised points to rip armor might deform easy if there was no no heat treat... I like the "work hardening reference"...so many folks in other circles are not aware that effect.
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Post by perignum on Jan 1, 2024 19:19:47 GMT
I assume you don't need quenched steel for a warhammer. No edge, not a real pointy tip even on the bec. And automatically work hardening. Well it would bash alright, I would worry the raised points to rip armor might deform easy if there was no no heat treat... I like the "work hardening reference"...so many folks in other circles are not aware that effect. The raised points aren’t supposed to rip armour. They’re like the cleats or studs on a football boot. They’re made to provide a bit of bite. I’d rather they deform than break off.
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Post by izzy on Jan 2, 2024 17:18:20 GMT
Well it would bash alright, I would worry the raised points to rip armor might deform easy if there was no no heat treat... I like the "work hardening reference"...so many folks in other circles are not aware that effect. The raised points aren’t supposed to rip armour. They’re like the cleats or studs on a football boot. They’re made to provide a bit of bite. I’d rather they deform than break off. First I was talking about war hammers in general, The Todd Hammer has smaller spikes than some War hammers ( and some War hammers have none on the face of the hammer).
These war hammers in the 2 Manuscript pics ( first link) have very large spikes, that is not just a bit of bite...not something I mentioned before, the spike on the back of many a hammer was for sure meant to do exactly that AFAIK.
So do we want to argue this for the next 3 pages, or can we say both of us have valid points?
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Zen_Hydra
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Post by Zen_Hydra on Jan 2, 2024 18:13:47 GMT
Something I've been curious about for some time is how effective langets are at reinforcing a wooden weapon haft.
On one hand the metal langets offer reinforcement of the haft through their material toughness, but on the other the rivets/pins securing the langets to the haft repeatedly compromise the integrity of the wood and create stress risers along the grain which may facilitate the haft splitting (and possibly doing so at multiple points simultaneously.
As mentioned previously, I'm also curious about how well shrink-fitted sinew and/or raw hide reinforcement of a wooden weapon haft would be at minimizing breakage and splitting in the wood. Edit: I seem to have mentioned the rawhide/sinew reinforcement in another thread, but it also fits in this conversation as well.
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Post by mrstabby on Jan 2, 2024 19:01:03 GMT
Something I've been curious about for some time is how effective langets are at reinforcing a wooden weapon haft. On one hand the metal langets offer reinforcement of the haft through their material toughness, but on the other the rivets/pins securing the langets to the haft repeatedly compromise the integrity of the wood and create stress risers along the grain which may facilitate the haft splitting (and possibly doing so at multiple points simultaneously. As mentioned previously, I'm also curious about how well shrink-fitted sinew and/or raw hide reinforcement of a wooden weapon haft would be at minimizing breakage and splitting in the wood. Edit: I seem to have mentioned the rawhide/sinew reinforcement in another thread, but it also fits in this conversation as well. Wrapping of any kind will strengthen wood by a lot. I have used a PET bottle on a broken hammer, split shaft. I just tried it because I wanted to know if it worked. Glueing with wood glue did nothing, split again as soon as I hit it few times. Then I put a 0,5l PET bottle over it and shrunk it with a heat gun. It was almost as good as new. Since then I have shrink wrapped a few broken wood parts, the bottles clamp down hard and are very tough, maybe not as tough as sinew, but it works extremely well (also a very cheap quick fix). If the grain isn't good, a wrap would probably make it pretty usable, just like on bows.
And about the metal, you need to bore the holes at a right angle to the grain, then it won't weaken the wood very much, but if you drill the wood between the grain or parallel to it, bad idea. At least that's what I have been told.
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seth
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Post by seth on Mar 30, 2024 2:47:49 GMT
I fixed my hammer! I used the same ash haft it came with, just cut down so it is about 18" overall in length versus 24". I had to drill out the socket which had wood and epoxy in there. I reshaped the shaft on a belt sander to fit as snug as I could and mounted with some epoxy thrown in for good measure. I also pinned the head and the base with mild steel. It's pretty handy now with a shorter lenght. I also mounted a Tod's German war hammer head to a hickory sledgehammer shaft that's been reshaped. I made it about 28" long. This thing is beastly. Next is linseed oil for both. Fun projects.
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Post by paulmuaddib on Mar 30, 2024 8:32:24 GMT
Those look great Seth. Looks like you hit something with your mace so hard you bent the wood. 😏
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Post by mrstabby on Mar 30, 2024 9:54:49 GMT
Such a sweet little guy, can I pet it?
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seth
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Post by seth on Mar 30, 2024 15:44:00 GMT
Yes I am surprised the mace head stayed attached! I am going to shorten the haft a bit and put a new head on--one from Tod which is much lighter than the one on there.
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Post by mrstabby on Mar 30, 2024 17:15:13 GMT
I honestly thought the mace was like that from the start, I didn't know you can bend wood like that without breaking it. Looks like it's deliberate.
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Post by paulmuaddib on Mar 30, 2024 20:27:33 GMT
I honestly thought the mace was like that from the start, I didn't know you can bend wood like that without breaking it. Looks like it's deliberate. Yeah I was joking on bending the shaft. I too thought it was done that way deliberately.
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seth
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Post by seth on Mar 30, 2024 22:25:07 GMT
I honestly thought the mace was like that from the start, I didn't know you can bend wood like that without breaking it. Looks like it's deliberate. Yeah I was joking on bending the shaft. I too thought it was done that way deliberately. The shaft is made from an ash flag pole. I was surprised too when it bent rather than breaking. There are some splits in it where it bent. Tough stuff.
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