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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2008 3:09:29 GMT
Hello On another thread, someone pointed out this sword: www.armsofvalour.com/miva/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=AOVL&Product_Code=IP-085-2&Category_Code=ICIB It's rather remarkable because of its weight - 1.5 pounds. However, in the same thread, someone pointed out that they owned one, and it was 2 3/4 pounds - a lot more plausible statistic. This made me a bit... uneasy, but I thought it was just a fluke. Then today, I got the hanwei/CAS iberia 2007 catalog. I was looking at it and... well in many cases, the printed numbers don't match what's on the own company's website! So... how reliable are published sword weights and PoBs?
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Post by shadowhowler on Nov 10, 2008 3:20:04 GMT
A damn good question. I often see differant numbers given by differant retailers for the same sword. I also find it hard to belive the sword in you example above is that light. I'd LOVE to get my hands on one and find out.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2008 3:26:40 GMT
Well these are hand made so weight is bound to be variable. If it was albion making these mistake I wouldn't say the same thing but it isn't.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2008 3:36:05 GMT
Small variance is like an ounce or two. Anymore then that and it's not forge variance anymore...it's a shoddy job.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2008 3:48:31 GMT
How reliable the weights are seems to depend on the manufacturer. Albions seem to be very close, as do Atrims, The new Valiants also seem pretty good. The rest of the sub $300 market seem to be pretty hit or miss. Darksword probably gets the loudest complaints, as a fair number of people have had their swords gain weight in transit (myself Included).
My advice is buy a digital food scale that will weigh up to 10 lbs, and be prepared to send them back if they are too heavy for your liking. That said how much is too much weight gain is really up to you. 1 of my swords arrived 2 lbs heavier than I was expecting it to be. I did not send it back, I also don't take it off the wall often.
My opinion is that they should be 4oz or less different than published weight. Also some swords conspicuously do not have weights published on their manufacturer's web sites. You can expect these swords to be heavy.
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Marc Ridgeway
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Post by Marc Ridgeway on Nov 10, 2008 4:07:07 GMT
I have two Oni Forge Ryu here in my lap. Same model , same year. Different polisher, obviously. One is noticably heavier than the other with a POB .5 inches futher out, thicker through th eshinogi and with less cutback in the shinogi ji... the other is light , fast and a wicked soft target cutter
Two very differently biased swords from the same model... both good swords...
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Post by Tom K. (ianflaer) on Nov 10, 2008 5:09:22 GMT
this is why I purchased a digital fish scale and weigh all my swords. If I'm expecting a 2 lb 10 oz. sword and get 4 pounds 1 ounce, I'm gonna send it back, but if it's 2 lb 8oz or 2 lb 14 oz I'll keep it. I see those numbers as very "ball-park" and don't trust them much at all.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2008 5:18:36 GMT
Wait but if we get a heavier sword than what's listed doesn't that mean we just got more for our money? Isn't that better? ![::)](//storage.forums.net/forum/images/smiley/eyesroll.png) Seriously though yeah unfortunately vendors and manufacturers are not all completely reliable to give proper weights. What's been recommended is a good idea. Measure them and find out. If its within a few oz. its acceptable. If its much heavier than that send it back as its not the sword you purchased.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2008 5:47:27 GMT
So far, now that I take care to notice, my cold steel Viking was spot on, I await my new DSA 10th c. Viking.....Efing UPS!!!!! I will see how it does as it is advertised as 2lbs8oz......SanMarc
WHERE'S MY SWORD!!!!! AARRGGHH! (S.A. withdraws)
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Post by kidcasanova on Nov 10, 2008 6:28:06 GMT
A DSA Viking lighter than my VA 303CT? Honestly, I'd be really impressed. Kudos to DSA if that's the case.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2008 6:32:39 GMT
A DSA Viking lighter than my VA 303CT? Honestly, I'd be really impressed. Kudos to DSA if that's the case. Like I said "when it gets here I'll see" .............SanMarc.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2008 13:12:55 GMT
I'm starting to wonder if there is some fundamental error in the printed 2007 Cas Iberia catalogue (the sword and knives one). According to it, this sword www.casiberia.com/product_details.asp?id=SH2369 weights 5 pounds... this is the worse example, but more than half the weights of the quoted weights for the Iberia line look fishy.
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Marc Ridgeway
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Post by Marc Ridgeway on Nov 10, 2008 13:40:52 GMT
I'm starting to wonder if there is some fundamental error in the printed 2007 Cas Iberia catalogue (the sword and knives one). According to it, this sword www.casiberia.com/product_details.asp?id=SH2369 weights 5 pounds... this is the worse example, but more than half the weights of the quoted weights for the Iberia line look fishy. When I look at that link I see 2 lbs 15 ozs.
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Post by Brendan Olszowy on Nov 10, 2008 14:29:09 GMT
Knowing how much weight is removed from flat bar to finished blade I can tell you that forging or grinding differences due to being made by hand can account for maybe 4 or 5 ounces at the absolute max.
A pound is just outright negligence or lieing. Either of which is unacceptable.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2008 14:43:22 GMT
I bought a sword from Arms of Valor. I had Jason unpack it and weigh it on a scale. He will do that for you if you ask. Any sword that is handforged can have a variance of up to 2 or 3 ounces in either direction from its prototype.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2008 23:09:13 GMT
I'm starting to wonder if there is some fundamental error in the printed 2007 Cas Iberia catalogue (the sword and knives one). According to it, this sword www.casiberia.com/product_details.asp?id=SH2369 weights 5 pounds... this is the worse example, but more than half the weights of the quoted weights for the Iberia line look fishy. When I look at that link I see 2 lbs 15 ozs. Yes, and so do I. The website says that, but the *printed* catalog says 5 pounds.
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Post by bpogue on Nov 11, 2008 0:28:51 GMT
When I look at that link I see 2 lbs 15 ozs. Yes, and so do I. The website says that, but the *printed* catalog says 5 pounds. Ancalagon, The printed catalog has the old Philippine made Iberia line and was probably an in-scabbard weight (yeah, I know). The website is the Hanwei version of the same sword design. A bit after the '07 catalog was finalized we went back and re-measured many many swords, which is why you see so much more information on the website for the vast majority of swords. Swords also used to be weighed by in-the-box weight... no kidding. This kind of info is important for retailers (for shipping) but obviously not to you ![;)](//storage.forums.net/forum/images/smiley/wink.png) So, no mass conspiracy or purposed lying. That being said we're all human and a slip of a 2 and a 5 happens. When in doubt go by the website, it's far more current. Blake
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2008 0:36:06 GMT
Ah good old shipping wieght ![:)](//storage.forums.net/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png) . Useless to us the end user...but vitally important to the retailers hehe.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2008 1:26:12 GMT
bpogue, I certainly wasn't accusing hanwei of being dishonest, and I am sorry that it came across like that. What I was getting at, is that errors are made, and sometimes pretty big ones. In some other cases, it's sheer dishonesty ... but I don't feel it's the case for this time. The weights are all over the place. Some are too high, some are too low etc... I definitely will consult the website ![:)](//storage.forums.net/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png) This brings another issue though - the "same" sword being made by different people. They look the same, but are they the same? I guess that perhaps should be another thread.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2008 1:33:50 GMT
So... how reliable are published sword weights and PoBs? Added to the list ![:D](//storage.forums.net/forum/images/smiley/grin.png) .
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