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Post by larason2 on Apr 3, 2023 2:12:38 GMT
I also don't like a lot of the patent machines because I find a lot of them produce a concave edge. I guess they might work, but I don't like machines that do that. Water stones have their pros and cons, like anything else. They do lose truing quickly, but I have a silicon carbide truing stone that works quite nicely. Sandpaper and a flat surface works too (also works for the truing stone!). I like the feedback a water stone gives. As it wears, it also tends to give a more convex edge. I like the idea of an oil stone because it deeply oils the metal. I've used sand paper and mineral oil to restore a sword, and it has been very resistant to rusting. It doesn't wear as fast though, as has been mentioned. Water stones also last quite a long time though! I also use my stones to sharpen chisels and wood turning tools, so it's nice to have the flexibility to use them to do that. I think you just have to pick something that has the characteristics you want, and learn how to use it to get the results you want.
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Post by RufusScorpius on Apr 3, 2023 11:06:27 GMT
Now I'm worried. I spent $11,000 on an Eddie Van Halen replica frankenstrat, a 5150 tube amp with matching cab, an EVH custom guitar pic, a pair of leopard pattern parachute pants and a white EVH brand tank top, a 5150 guitar lead, and an EVH strap. Are you guys saying that I won't be able to also play like Eddie VanHalen? The guys at the Guitar Center told me that's what I needed. Tell me what am I missing and I will go out and buy it right away... From several years of exposure to you on the board, I expect you'll sound more like Ace Frehley. Ace Frehley? Ace Frehley? Let me think......? Oh yes! He's that guy that made $500 million dollars playing 3 chords! I could only hope to be like him someday. š
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Post by howler on Apr 4, 2023 1:22:32 GMT
From several years of exposure to you on the board, I expect you'll sound more like Ace Frehley. Ace Frehley? Ace Frehley? Let me think......? Oh yes! He's that guy that made $500 million dollars playing 3 chords! I could only hope to be like him someday. š The highest net worth figure I could find on Ace was $35 mill. (not too shabby) , but the BIIIIG KISS money certainly goes to Gene and Paul who call all the shots and have been with the band for the whole trip.
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Post by treeslicer on Apr 4, 2023 3:51:30 GMT
Ace Frehley? Ace Frehley? Let me think......? Oh yes! He's that guy that made $500 million dollars playing 3 chords! I could only hope to be like him someday. š The highest net worth figure I could find on Ace was $35 mill. (not too shabby) , but the BIIIIG KISS money certainly goes to Gene and Paul who call all the shots and have been with the band for the whole trip. I just don't see RufusScorpius in the role. Definitely more Van Helsing, than Van Halen.
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Post by sjoebarry on Apr 4, 2023 10:37:43 GMT
Hereās a dumb question from a dumdum. Why do all guides for whetstones, rods, strops etc show you pulling or pushing the knife/sword across the item rather than pulling/pushing the item across a stationary blade?
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Post by RufusScorpius on Apr 4, 2023 11:23:18 GMT
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Post by randomnobody on Apr 4, 2023 13:31:04 GMT
Hereās a dumb question from a dumdum. Why do all guides for whetstones, rods, strops etc show you pulling or pushing the knife/sword across the item rather than pulling/pushing the item across a stationary blade? Probably easier to control that way. If nothing else, if your sword skips or slips along your polishing medium, you might need to polish your sword again. If your polishing medium skips or slips along your sword, you might be short a few fingers... I've done both, personally. Only have a small stone, so I'll hold it flat and move small blades over it, but hold longer blades and move the stone over them.
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Apr 4, 2023 13:34:40 GMT
Hereās a dumb question from a dumdum. Why do all guides for whetstones, rods, strops etc show you pulling or pushing the knife/sword across the item rather than pulling/pushing the item across a stationary blade? I donāt understand your question. Most machines have guides. The blade is locked into a fixed position, then the abrasives are moved along the edge at some fixed angle dictated by the guide, 15Ā°, 20Ā°, etc. If by āguideā you mean tutorials; personally I use both methods depending but prefer moving the blade as I get a better feel for what is happening. There are times when this is not practical, such as with a sword having a hilt asymmetrical or otherwise that gets in the way and I cannot disassemble. In those cases I use a small wooden block with sandpaper and make the blade stationary. When I sharpened my pinuti on the previous page I moved the blade across stationary paper with a compressible backing to ease getting a convex edge stopping with 600 grit as I considered that sharp enough for any practical use I needed. Afterwards I decided the scratches it had accumulated needed to go and then reversed the process making the blade stationary and used a sanding block stopping with 1,000 grit and saw no point in going back to the edge in order for the two to match more closely.
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Post by MOK on Apr 4, 2023 13:55:48 GMT
Now I'm worried. I spent $11,000 on an Eddie Van Halen replica frankenstrat, a 5150 tube amp with matching cab, an EVH custom guitar pic, a pair of leopard pattern parachute pants and a white EVH brand tank top, a 5150 guitar lead, and an EVH strap. Are you guys saying that I won't be able to also play like Eddie VanHalen? The guys at the Guitar Center told me that's what I needed. Tell me what am I missing and I will go out and buy it right away... A couple of decades of practice! Absolute must have. If you can't find that for sale, that's alright, home made is just fine.
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Apr 4, 2023 15:31:27 GMT
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Post by larason2 on Apr 4, 2023 15:43:18 GMT
I agree with pgandy. Whether the blade or your sharpening method is stationary depends on the circumstances. Even togishos use a loose blade moving over the stone for the large stones, but when they move to fingerstones, the blade is stationary. Large stones are awkward to hold to sharpen a stationary blade, but it's doable.
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Post by sjoebarry on Apr 15, 2023 23:48:03 GMT
I dont know what I am doing wrong. Using my whetstone (1000 & 6000) and I just got a leather strop to try and hone the job but the knife I am trying to sharpen feels like itās getting duller?!? Any tips would be very welcome.
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Apr 16, 2023 0:32:09 GMT
I dont know what I am doing wrong. Using my whetstone (1000 & 6000) and I just got a leather strop to try and hone the job but the knife I am trying to sharpen feels like itās getting duller?!? Any tips would be very welcome. Oh me, I know that can be frustrating. I donāt know the condition of your blade to start with making the matter more difficult. To WAG it, Iād say your 1000 stone is too fine to start with. Try something more aggressive. With sandpaper Iāve gotten paper cutting sharpness a number of times with 220 grit. Start with that or an equivalent stone if stones are your bag. Once you have achieved a copy paper cutting sharp edge then itās time to go to finer paper/stones. I consider 220 good for shaping. The finer stuff is more for polishing. When you get a sharp edge with the 220 use increasingly finer grits to obtain a polish, which will allow the blade to slice more smoothly. If you already have a decent edge but it needs a little touching up then possibly start with your 1000 stone. At your stage to hone, or even strop is putting the cart before the horse. Your 1000 grit wonāt give you a sharp edge as such but make your sharp edge sharper. Depending, it will but with more work. There are numerous videos on YouTube showing common mistakes people make when sharpening. View these until you find your error. Keep in mind you may be committing more than one mistake and need several videos. Below is one to get you started. The best of luck.
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Post by sjoebarry on Apr 16, 2023 1:38:03 GMT
I dont know what I am doing wrong. Using my whetstone (1000 & 6000) and I just got a leather strop to try and hone the job but the knife I am trying to sharpen feels like itās getting duller?!? Any tips would be very welcome. Oh me, I know that can be frustrating. I donāt know the condition of your blade to start with making the matter more difficult. To WAG it, Iād say your 1000 stone is too fine to start with. Try something more aggressive. With sandpaper Iāve gotten paper cutting sharpness a number of times with 220 grit. Start with that or an equivalent stone if stones are your bag. Once you have achieved a copy paper cutting sharp edge then itās time to go to finer paper/stones. I consider 220 good for shaping. The finer stuff is more for polishing. When you get a sharp edge with the 220 use increasingly finer grits to obtain a polish, which will allow the blade to slice more smoothly. If you already have a decent edge but it needs a little touching up then possibly start with your 1000 stone. At your stage to hone, or even strop is putting the cart before the horse. Your 1000 grit wonāt give you a sharp edge as such but make your sharp edge sharper. Depending, it will but with more work. There are numerous videos on YouTube showing common mistakes people make when sharpening. View these until you find your error. Keep in mind you may be committing more than one mistake and need several videos. Below is one to get you started. The best of luck. THANK YOU
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Post by sjoebarry on Apr 16, 2023 12:32:49 GMT
Soā¦ā¦.. #1 - embarrassingly the ācheapā stone in the video is the one I have. Welp #2 - purchased diamond sharpening set of various grits. We shall seeā¦.. thanks again for the video.
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pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Apr 16, 2023 12:48:56 GMT
Soā¦ā¦.. #1 - embarrassingly the ācheapā stone in the video is the one I have. Welp Believe it or not, that very thought crossed my mind. I have one, I donāt like it, and now I know why. I never use it. Please let me know your experience with the diamonds. One more, thing after you get a good edge to the point of wanting to refine it a bit comes the honing and to a greater degree stropping. The video he linked at the end is surprisingly the same one that I listed earlier on this page concerning hair splitting sharpness. I will not elaborate on my experience concerning hair cutting sharpness at this time, thatās for another time.
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Post by pgandy on Apr 17, 2023 0:09:25 GMT
I donāt use diamonds nor intend to buy one. Not that I find anything wrong with them. Iām comfortable with my set up. However, I found the video informative enlightening me to many things I was unaware of. He promotes 300 grit initially where I suggest 220, not a big difference. Then go to 1000, although he also says the 300 then a stropping will do it. A bit late as you have already ordered your diamond but nice to know info for the future.
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Post by madirish on Apr 23, 2023 15:09:49 GMT
Soā¦ā¦.. #1 - embarrassingly the ācheapā stone in the video is the one I have. Welp #2 - purchased diamond sharpening set of various grits. We shall seeā¦.. thanks again for the video. I've always been intimidated by whetstones. Even as a kid with a simple pocket knife and stone, I never seemed to be able to get a good edge. I've relied on a Spyderco Tri-angle Sharpmaker someone gave me years ago to keep my kitchen knives sharp. It does a decent good job, but I find keeping the vertical alignment required is tough and I could never make it work right to keep tips sharp enough. I finally broke down this year and picked up a set of 3 stones (a Cerax 320, a King 1200 and a King 6000) for about $25 each (so not too bad). Used a damp towel on top of a baking pan as my platform, no bridge. I started with one of the cheapest knives in the block and got into it. I may not have matched the factory angle perfectly (I'm sure I didn't), but found it surprisingly easy to repair the edge with the 320 and get a good, sharp edge with the 1000. I did 2 other knives, including an 8" chef's which I've always had trouble getting the tip and heal sharp on the Spyderco and I don't think they've ever been sharper. I used a magic marker on the edge to judge my progress, went slowly, and did my best to stay consistent. Seems to have worked.... Am I ready to try to tackle a sword? Uh, heck no, lol.
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Post by dirtydan on May 2, 2023 2:32:13 GMT
Professional knife sharpener here putting in his $.02.
Sharpening is the act of removing material, by using an abrasive medium, to create a new edge. This is the fundamental principle of the operation; sharpening mediums, equipment, techniques, etc are mere details. Choose an edge geometry that compliments the blade geometry and the intended use of the blade. Maintain a consistent angle, speed and pressure. Work up through an appropriate grit progression. Do all that and almost any sharpening medium will do.
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Post by treeslicer on May 2, 2023 22:16:07 GMT
Soā¦ā¦.. #1 - embarrassingly the ācheapā stone in the video is the one I have. Welp #2 - purchased diamond sharpening set of various grits. We shall seeā¦.. thanks again for the video. I've always been intimidated by whetstones. Even as a kid with a simple pocket knife and stone, I never seemed to be able to get a good edge. I've relied on a Spyderco Tri-angle Sharpmaker someone gave me years ago to keep my kitchen knives sharp. It does a decent good job, but I find keeping the vertical alignment required is tough and I could never make it work right to keep tips sharp enough. I finally broke down this year and picked up a set of 3 stones (a Cerax 320, a King 1200 and a King 6000) for about $25 each (so not too bad). Used a damp towel on top of a baking pan as my platform, no bridge. I started with one of the cheapest knives in the block and got into it. I may not have matched the factory angle perfectly (I'm sure I didn't), but found it surprisingly easy to repair the edge with the 320 and get a good, sharp edge with the 1000. I did 2 other knives, including an 8" chef's which I've always had trouble getting the tip and heal sharp on the Spyderco and I don't think they've ever been sharper. I used a magic marker on the edge to judge my progress, went slowly, and did my best to stay consistent. Seems to have worked.... Am I ready to try to tackle a sword? Uh, heck no, lol. Something I haven't seen discussed here. Classic rectangular bench whetstones have specific methods associated with them, and fall into two categories based on whether they are oil stones or water stones, and two more based on natural or man-made. What they have in common is that they are all intended to be used with a lubricant. Using a stone dry will pack it up with small, sharp metal particles, which will also contaminate the area, and maybe get into your eyes.
Water stones, which include the cheap aluminum oxide Shapton knockoffs discussed in one video (did you know this?), are designed to wear away during use, and form a polishing slurry. They should be used wet, with an excess of water repeatedly replenished. They should never be used dry, or with oil. Jnats (Japanese natural stones) are all water stones, also. Water stones need to be dressed (flattened) periodically to keep them flat, usually with a special hard stone or diamond dresser (like for a grinding wheel), which wears them even more.
Oil stones are harder, and wear much more slowly. Man made sintered ruby (red aluminum oxide) stones hardly wear at all. Most modern oilstones are man made from either aluminum oxide or silicon carbide ("Carborundum"). The most common natural oilstones encountered are Arkansas stones, which geologically are novaculite, contain silica, much softer than alumina or silicon carbide, and slower to sharpen an edge.
Natural whetstones nearly all contain silica (silicon dioxide, best known as quartz) in some form, most have rounded rather than sharp grains of it, and so are less likely to scratch a blade than man-made stones, which usually have harder, sharper-edged abrasive grains. OTOH, as noted earlier, they will sharpen more slowly. Harder natural whetstones, such as emery, rare to start with, have virtually disappeared from the market due to synthetic competition.
Diamond plates (which are actually a sort of rigid metal sandpaper) fall outside this classification scheme, and most are best used dry. DMT plates in particular can be damaged by lubricants, and lose their diamond particles, because slurries made during sharpening can undermine the metal matrix. In particular, do not use them to dress waterstones. Diamond plates cut very fast, but leave the worst scratches.
I apologize for the long read, but I noticed too much information being left out of those videos.
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