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Post by ggolden219 on Jan 31, 2023 21:31:32 GMT
First, I have replied to Yagoro's feedback of my recent purchase from him, and will include it here.   Outside of everything mentioned above, shipping was a bit annoying because he had to print two different labels. Full disclosure: He said he had a lot going on with school and could ship on Friday, but if not on Saturday. I asked him to hold out until Monday, because I worked for UPS and understand that weekends aren't the best time to ship. He agreed, so I patiently waited. Unfortunately, the first tracking number had to be changed because apparently, a new person messed up the label and it needed a new one. I took him for his word, after sending him a message about the package not moving. He later updated me with a second tracking number and the waiting game began once again. All of this is understandable, and not an issue because the package did eventually arrive. I was a little worried when I received the package from the UPS driver because the sword was in an oversized box and was not secure within the box. The sword was shifting around the box with only a few pieces of bubble wrap inside. Luckily, I know my driver and could grab my package 30 minutes into his delivers, instead of it riding around in the truck all day. Maybe the seller wrapped the blade in bubble wrap before shipping, but since nothing was secured, I opened the box to a loose sword with the bubble wrap that looked like it was randomly tossed into the box. I'm honestly surprised it survived with this kind of shipping and personally, I would never ship a sword so loose and free to bounce around in a giant box - seems careless and negligent. I will say, shipping a sword without oil, especially with the current weather conditions was a poor decision on the seller's part. If he had oiled the blade, maybe it would not have arrived with the light rust, which from the seller, may or may not have been present when he shipped the sword. If the blade had rust before shipping, it was not mentioned and he has apologized for the rust being present. I brought my concerns to the seller (privately) and he wasn't pleased with what I had to say. Moving forward, I will save the listed post and not just the pictures, in case this issue arises in the future with other sellers. He is offering to send me the sageo and possible a small refund for the issues, but after this feedback, I will move on from this purchase, and chalk it up to a "Not so good buying experience." Personally, I won't be purchasing from Yagoro again because I'm not pleased with how things transpired between our private and public chat. To be honest, there is different level of professionalism between the seller, and I, and we just don't mesh well. We clearly communicate differently and have different expectations when selling or buying on the second hand market, and imo, his past experiences have soured his expectations and we aren't on the same page. This is not a buyer beware because we all have different expectations when dealing with the second hand market, but I would advise anyone who is buying from this seller or any seller, to save the postings and conversations, incase things don't go as planned. Obviously, my experience with this seller is my own, and you may see things differently, but because I do buy and sell on this forum as well, it's only fair to hear my side of things. |
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Yagoro
Member
Ikkyu in Kendo and Kenjutsu Practitioner
Posts: 1,416
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Post by Yagoro on Jan 31, 2023 21:53:09 GMT
First, I have replied to Yagoro's feedback of my recent purchase from him, and will include it here. Outside of everything mentioned above, shipping was a bit annoying because he had to print two different labels. Full disclosure: He said he had a lot going on with school and could ship on Friday, but if not on Saturday. I asked him to hold out until Monday, because I worked for UPS and understand that weekends aren't the best time to ship. He agreed, so I patiently waited. Unfortunately, the first tracking number had to be changed because apparently, a new person messed up the label and it needed a new one. I took him for his word, after sending him a message about the package not moving. He later updated me with a second tracking number and the waiting game began once again. All of this is understandable, and not an issue because the package did eventually arrive. I was a little worried when I received the package from the UPS driver because the sword was in an oversized box and was not secure within the box. The sword was shifting around the box with only a few pieces of bubble wrap inside. Luckily, I know my driver and could grab my package 30 minutes into his delivers, instead of it riding around in the truck all day. Maybe the seller wrapped the blade in bubble wrap before shipping, but since nothing was secured, I opened the box to a loose sword with the bubble wrap that looked like it was randomly tossed into the box. I'm honestly surprised it survived with this kind of shipping and personally, I would never ship a sword so loose and free to bounce around in a giant box - seems careless and negligent. I will say, shipping a sword without oil, especially with the current weather conditions was a poor decision on the seller's part. If he had oiled the blade, maybe it would not have arrived with the light rust, which from the seller, may or may not have been present when he shipped the sword. If the blade had rust before shipping, it was not mentioned and he has apologized for the rust being present. I brought my concerns to the seller (privately) and he wasn't pleased with what I had to say. Moving forward, I will save the listed post and not just the pictures, in case this issue arises in the future with other sellers. He is offering to send me the sageo and possible a small refund for the issues, but after this feedback, I will move on from this purchase, and chalk it up to a "Not so good buying experience." Personally, I won't be purchasing from Yagoro again because I'm not pleased with how things transpired between our private and public chat. To be honest, there is different level of professionalism between the seller, and I, and we just don't mesh well. We clearly communicate differently and have different expectations when selling or buying on the second hand market, and imo, his past experiences have soured his expectations and we aren't on the same page. This is not a buyer beware because we all have different expectations when dealing with the second hand market, but I would advise anyone who is buying from this seller or any seller, to save the postings and conversations, incase things don't go as planned. Obviously, my experience with this seller is my own, and you may see things differently, but because I do buy and sell on this forum as well, it's only fair to hear my side of things. I edited my remarks regarding you as a buyer since I thought we had dealt with this in pms. And despite you disclaiming that this isnt a buyer beware, it still comes off as one, and will still affect my ability to sell things on here(not like theres much else ill be selling). I sprayed the blade with ballistol before shipment, which i do with every blade i ship, and Im not sure if this one was just unlucky or if I did not apply enough this times. I am aware that I am not the gold standard when it comes to shipping things on time on here, but as a college student I try to have stuff sent out when I have free time. This time the UPS store was at fault, but I should have just waited on shipping it until later last week or this week because we had a huge snow storm which could probably be partially blamed for the rust on the mune. |
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Post by ggolden219 on Jan 31, 2023 22:45:09 GMT
I understand that you may feel this was all a misunderstanding, and if you had kept the conversation private before posting in the public section, I would not have spent any time with this write up. Hell, it could've ended with a positive "good seller" if you didn't let your feelings get in the way and decide to bring the issue public first.
As far as everything I have said, there are no lies, and I hold no ill will towards you, but I personally, will not be doing business with you any time soon, if ever. That is my personal choice, and maybe one day, I can change my view on doing business with you. Yes, your situation as a college student and the conditions of the weather are all understandable, which I stated above. However, you need to understand that your actions and words have consequences, and I advise you think before you act moving forward.
The blade was dry and I have never used ballistol, so I can't say with certainty whether it was used a little, or not at all. This is new sword day number 70 something for me, and I am confident in my ability to assess blades upon arrival. I am not an amateur in this aspect, but you chose to treat me as if I didn't understand how all of this works. I told you I was going to leave some feedback on this purchase (in private), but before we had resolved the issue, you felt the need to jump the gun and leave a negative buyer experience first. What you posted and then later changed could have been seen by a number of people, which would hurt my reputation as a buyer and seller. You didn't think about that before you haphazardly posted in a public forum without the issues at hand being resolved first - another mistake on your part.
I'm sorry if you feel my post may affect your future sells, but if anyone were to take the time to read what has been said, they can come to their own conclusions on whether or not to do business with you. Private chats exist for a reason, but so do public ones. I hope you learn from this experience, as I have, and I wish you luck on your future endeavors.
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Yagoro
Member
Ikkyu in Kendo and Kenjutsu Practitioner
Posts: 1,416
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Post by Yagoro on Jan 31, 2023 23:24:27 GMT
I told you I was going to leave some feedback on this purchase (in private), but before we had resolved the issue, you felt the need to jump the gun and leave a negative buyer experience first. What you posted and then later changed could have been seen by a number of people, which would hurt my reputation as a buyer and seller. You didn't think about that before you haphazardly posted in a public forum without the issues at hand being resolved first - another mistake on your part. Ok well for one, you were the one who initially stated you would be leaving me a negative review. You didnt say "possibly" you said what this screenshot says, since that seems to be the game you enjoy playing. So dont try and act like youre on the high ground and that you attempted to "keep it in pms". To add to this, rather than start off displaying pics of the issues, you insist that I stated the blade was in "pristine" condition, and then state it is "barely passing". You didnt say "im going to leave feedback for this purchase" you stated that "Im going to have to leave a negative review for this purchase", without even waiting for me to respond. Attachments:
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Yagoro
Member
Ikkyu in Kendo and Kenjutsu Practitioner
Posts: 1,416
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Post by Yagoro on Jan 31, 2023 23:33:00 GMT
It seems you expected me, as the seller, to just sit there patiently waiting for your response as you threatened to leave a review that could very well potentially destroy a secondary source of income for me. You stated you only bought 1 other sword secondhand before this. How does that make me confident at all that you know what to expect when buying a sword secondhand? If anything it makes me think that you have no idea what to expect when buying a used sword, let alone one thats 8 years old. While yes, the sageo missing was all on me, I told you the rust was not there when i shipped it. Its funny because apparently you mustve thought id just sit around while you insult my character. Keep in mind, before this you never said that you dont buy blades which have been used for cutting. Had you mentioned this before purchasing the sword, I wouldve told you that the previous owner cut with it, or that ive cut with it(which i did, but only water bottles) Also, again you didnt provide pics the first time I asked, or the second time. When i posted the review I assumed you were just lying about the rust on the mune. Heres the rust btw imgur.com/a/Rj1u2b0Attachments:
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Post by ggolden219 on Feb 1, 2023 0:51:23 GMT
Everything I said was still in the private chat, and nothing was public. You thought you were getting ahead of the situation by posting first, and by the time you retracted your statements in a public forum, the information was already out there for others to see. I'm sorry you assumed I had little experience purchasing swords, and when it comes to second-hand, I'll give you that. However, not purchasing second hand is not an indicator of not purchasing numerous other swords new, and it was a poor assumption on your part. Did it take me awhile to post the pictures of the rust, yes. Why? Because you had already went public with me being a poor buyer, and I'm sorry I wasn't able to take pictures on my phone, send them to my computer, and then uploaded them quick enough for you. Our conversation today, both publicly and private, took place over a relatively short period of time, and I have other things to do in my life besides just this hobby. Also, I said I could not leave a positive review, and you assumed it would be a negative review, rather than what facts I could actually prove. I mentioned above, I will save all post moving forward to prevent the back and forth of what was listed and what was not. Once again, I had no need to ask if it was used for cutting because your post said it had not. This point is moot considering there is no proof for either of us to confirm or deny what was actually listed. I know what I saw and why I made the decision to purchase, and like I said, I am very selective in doing so. It was my mistake not to ask for more pictures and to trust in the words and pictures posted on your sale post, and for that, I'll take loss.   Whether the rust was caused during or after shipping is besides the point - it's there, and you clearly aren't sure when it could have happened. Maybe it happened when you were examining the blade before shipping, as you said above, or maybe it was the lack of protection with a blade being sent across the country during a cold and wet winter, which you also think is possible. Is it something I can correct - of course. In my feedback, would I have included that the blade arrived with a bit of rust and the seller apologized and compensated me for the trouble - yes again, which is exactly what is stated above. If you think I had insulted your character before I posted anything public, I disagree, I was simply going off the current situation and what I had received vs what I believed was promised. You made a bad call trying to be proactive vs reactive, and your back peddling is evident in more than just this conversation. Also, if your going to "quote" someone, there is no need to paraphrase in your own words and use "quotes" as if they were they were the words actually said. |
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Yagoro
Member
Ikkyu in Kendo and Kenjutsu Practitioner
Posts: 1,416
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Post by Yagoro on Feb 1, 2023 1:21:18 GMT
Everything I said was still in the private chat, and nothing was public. You thought you were getting ahead of the situation by posting first, and by the time you retracted your statements in a public forum, the information was already out there for others to see. I'm sorry you assumed I had little experience purchasing swords, and when it comes to second-hand, I'll give you that. However, not purchasing second hand is not an indicator of not purchasing numerous other swords new, and it was a poor assumption on your part. Did it take me awhile to post the pictures of the rust, yes. Why? Because you had already went public with me being a poor buyer, and I'm sorry I wasn't able to take pictures on my phone, send them to my computer, and then uploaded them quick enough for you. Our conversation today, both publicly and private, took place over a relatively short period of time, and I have other things to do in my life besides just this hobby. Also, I said I could not leave a positive review, and you assumed it would be a negative review, rather than what facts I could actually prove. I mentioned above, I will save all post moving forward to prevent the back and forth of what was listed and what was not. Once again, I had no need to ask if it was used for cutting because your post said it had not. This point is moot considering there is no proof for either of us to confirm or deny what was actually listed. I know what I saw and why I made the decision to purchase, and like I said, I am very selective in doing so. It was my mistake not to ask for more pictures and to trust in the words and pictures posted on your sale post, and for that, I'll take loss. Whether the rust was caused during or after shipping is besides the point - it's there, and you clearly aren't sure when it could have happened. Maybe it happened when you were examining the blade before shipping, as you said above, or maybe it was the lack of protection with a blade being sent across the country during a cold and wet winter, which you also think is possible. Is it something I can correct - of course. In my feedback, would I have included that the blade arrived with a bit of rust and the seller apologized and compensated me for the trouble - yes again, which is exactly what is stated above. If you think I had insulted your character before I posted anything public, I disagree, I was simply going off the current situation and what I had received vs what I believed was promised. You made a bad call trying to be proactive vs reactive, and your back peddling is evident in more than just this conversation. Also, if your going to "quote" someone, there is no need to paraphrase in your own words and use "quotes" as if they were they were the words actually said. I agree, this back and forth is worthless. This transaction has soured my opinion of you, and it seems its soured yours of me. I will still honor my previous offer of shipping the sageo, as well as a 20 or 30 dollar refund due to shipping issues and the rust on the mune, in case you change your mind about not taking it. Also, when you say I cannot leave a positive review, I take that as meaning the review as being negative, in case you couldnt tell. I am confused how stating that "I am starting to think you are dishonest, and not a man of your word." is not insulting, especially to an Eagle Scout. Look, I describe things how i see them. My descriptions are my OPINIONS of the sword. If you want to form your own OPINIONS, you ask for more detailed pictures so that you may form them. That is what I expect buyers of my swords to do, and thats what I expect sellers to expect from me. When you said how particular you were, I thought you meant handling wise, NOT aesthetics or appearance. |
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Post by ggolden219 on Feb 1, 2023 1:42:17 GMT
I agree, this back and forth is worthless. This transaction has soured my opinion of you, and it seems its soured yours of me. I will still honor my previous offer of shipping the sageo, as well as a 20 or 30 dollar refund due to shipping issues and the rust on the mune, in case you change your mind about not taking it. No worries - I'm good. One final note: I made the mistake of trusting your word, that this blade felt about the same if not slightly heavier than a Huawei dotanuki, which is what you said. I'm guessing it had a bohi because this does not weigh anything near a Huawei dotanuki, at least not the ones I have owned and handled. This sword weighs 985g, which is the same as my iaito. Another lesson learned here. If anyone reading this has a Huawei dotanuki with a bohi, please list the weight, with proof if you can, as I have become a bit skeptical about things today. Thanks in advance. |
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Post by ggolden219 on Feb 1, 2023 1:50:41 GMT
I agree, this back and forth is worthless. This transaction has soured my opinion of you, and it seems its soured yours of me. I will still honor my previous offer of shipping the sageo, as well as a 20 or 30 dollar refund due to shipping issues and the rust on the mune, in case you change your mind about not taking it. Also, when you say I cannot leave a positive review, I take that as meaning the review as being negative, in case you couldnt tell. I am confused how stating that "I am starting to think you are dishonest, and not a man of your word." is not insulting, especially to an Eagle Scout. Look, I describe things how i see them. My descriptions are my OPINIONS of the sword. If you want to form your own OPINIONS, you ask for more detailed pictures so that you may form them. That is what I expect buyers of my swords to do, and thats what I expect sellers to expect from me. When you said how particular you were, I thought you meant handling wise, NOT aesthetics or appearance. Jeez, I can't even respond to your message before you edited and added 6 more sentences. Look man, I'm over this. We're both wasting our time at this point and there is no reason to keep going around in circles. To the audience - No worries about posting the weight of a Huawei dotanuki with a bohi because frankly, I just don't care anymore. It was a $300 sword that turned into a circus act, and I'm done. Now, time to go enjoy tacos and tequila - good day! |
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pgandy
Moderator
Senior Forumite
Posts: 9,519
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Post by pgandy on Feb 1, 2023 1:59:06 GMT
OK, this has gone far enough. Ggolden219 you have made your point and Yagoro you have responded. Any further correspondence will be made by PM. This thread is locked.
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Things have changed!