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Post by novak77 on Jan 7, 2022 15:09:05 GMT
Been talking to the some of the above and I would remove Josiah from the list. He is not even taking custom orders because he can't be bothered with getting the specs right. He just makes swords and then you pay $3500 for mono $7500 for folded (bare blade) if he happens to have anything you like in stock. So even more if you want it mounted. Rado is €2700 for bare blade and €4000 for basic koshirae. Michael Sabatier is around €2500 depending on what options you want and posssibly a bit unreliable with time. Currently says he has a production time of 6 months. Pierluigi is around $4000 and has a long waiting list, currently 10-11 months before he can even start production. As a reference I also talked to Huawei that explained 2021 had been a messy year for them for personal reasons but they expect to be back on track now and can deliver a sword in 3 months (guess we'll see about that). It's a shame that there's such a leap from china blades to local smiths. I would love to support local and not china but with such an expensive sword I wouldn't dare to use it... I guess Motohara is the only mid-range custom option at about $2000 but I'm not into the micro-bevel on their swords. did you happen to get the turn around time for Rado? hes expensive but still abit of a deal for the attention to detail you get.
Also lol at huawei, "Jacky" has been telling people 3 months through out the whole pandemic, I get semprini happens, but can't really trust what he says aftter bullsempriniting so many people.
I'm working with Rado right now. He's fantastic when it comes to communication, he sends lots of pics, and updates.
I hit him up around July, when Pavel went silent. He had a few orders ahead of me, and started forging around October. The first blade had some long ware in the hamon, so he had to forge a new one. He is working on the polish and hi, of the second one now.
I am going to have him do a nozarashi (weathered skull) theme for the koshirae, so it shouldn't be overly complicated.
As far as him finishing it, I haven't really asked lol.
Cheers
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Post by vidar on Jan 7, 2022 15:14:10 GMT
It's a shame that there's such a leap from china blades to local smiths. I would love to support local and not china but with such an expensive sword I wouldn't dare to use it... I guess Motohara is the only mid-range custom option at about $2000 but I'm not into the micro-bevel on their swords. I agree, personally before hiring a custom smith, a person should a broad understanding of sword design and take the time come up with something unique. I don't understand why someone would shell out several thousand for just a typical shinogi blade with standard dimensions and bland koshirae they didn't even design themselves. While you wait for the smith to start working on your sword, you can entertain yourself by looking for antique fittings. I bought an antique tsuba and sent it to Sabatier for mounting on my sword. That definitely gives the sword a unique and authentic touch.
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Post by JH Lee on Jan 7, 2022 16:11:15 GMT
Been talking to the some of the above and I would remove Josiah from the list. He is not even taking custom orders because he can't be bothered with getting the specs right. He just makes swords and then you pay $3500 for mono $7500 for folded (bare blade) if he happens to have anything you like in stock. So even more if you want it mounted. Just because a smith doesn't want to accomodate a customer's millimeter-specific requests is no reason to write him off. Personally, if/when I can afford it, I'd be happy to ask Josiah to "make me a tanto" or whatever and just trust him do his special thing. Bladesmithing is at least as much art as it is craft; and not all artists may want to be constrained by their customer's specs. And I think that's great. If you'd prefer to have more control/input, then there are many others who will happily take your money. But let's not create a culture of "the customer is always right" when it comes to works of art. Just my opinion.
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Post by Arlequin on Jan 7, 2022 16:30:30 GMT
I agree, personally before hiring a custom smith, a person should a broad understanding of sword design and take the time come up with something unique. I don't understand why someone would shell out several thousand for just a typical shinogi blade with standard dimensions and bland koshirae they didn't even design themselves. While you wait for the smith to start working on your sword, you can entertain yourself by looking for antique fittings. I bought an antique tsuba and sent it to Sabatier for mounting on my sword. That definitely gives the sword a unique and authentic touch. I actually have a few tsuba designs in mind. Hopefully Rado gets back to me soon, we've already exchanged a few emails, his next email is supposed to be a first draft sketch. I'm still debating if I wanna go mono or folded. My design is pretty detail heavy so it might be pricey enough as a mono lol
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Post by shepherd214 on Jan 7, 2022 18:48:27 GMT
Been talking to the some of the above and I would remove Josiah from the list. He is not even taking custom orders because he can't be bothered with getting the specs right. He just makes swords and then you pay $3500 for mono $7500 for folded (bare blade) if he happens to have anything you like in stock. So even more if you want it mounted. Rado is €2700 for bare blade and €4000 for basic koshirae. Michael Sabatier is around €2500 depending on what options you want and posssibly a bit unreliable with time. Currently says he has a production time of 6 months. Pierluigi is around $4000 and has a long waiting list, currently 10-11 months before he can even start production. As a reference I also talked to Huawei that explained 2021 had been a messy year for them for personal reasons but they expect to be back on track now and can deliver a sword in 3 months (guess we'll see about that). It's a shame that there's such a leap from china blades to local smiths. I would love to support local and not china but with such an expensive sword I wouldn't dare to use it... I guess Motohara is the only mid-range custom option at about $2000 but I'm not into the micro-bevel on their swords. Are you actually trying to censor a smith because he won't accommodate your specific specs and because he is comfortable with his prices? You are exactly the type of customer I'd want to avoid. 110%.
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Post by junesbanunes on Jan 11, 2022 13:23:47 GMT
Considering the many hours required to make a sword, a price of 2000-3000$ is very reasonable I would say. Mr Sabatier needs 3 weeks to make a sword. While you can and should use these swords for tameshigiri at some point, I would still advice to also buy a cheaper sword (like a basic T10 Chinese sword) for practising as long as you’re not confident about your skill. And considering the living costs in europe I agree the price is reasonable. Like I said the issue is more about actually using something so expensive. I expect the swords are fully functional but no matter how good you are there's always the risk of accidents, imagine driving your car without any insurance. much much cheaper if you go with mono steel. I think a basic nono steel with basic koshirae is around 1.5 to 2k I asked for his prices and those are the ones he gave me so I assumed he doesn't offer mono steel. did you happen to get the turn around time for Rado? hes expensive but still abit of a deal for the attention to detail you get.
Also lol at huawei, "Jacky" has been telling people 3 months through out the whole pandemic, I get semprini happens, but can't really trust what he says aftter bullsempriniting so many people.
No info on Rado's waiting times but using novak77's order as an example he seems to have a few months waiting time. Also lol at huawei, "Jacky" has been telling people 3 months through out the whole pandemic, I get semprini happens, but can't really trust what he says aftter bullsempriniting so many people.
Yeah, reaching the conclusion that this was my best option I went ahead and ordered one so I guess we'll see. I'll have it remounted in custom koshirae. Just because a smith doesn't want to accomodate a customer's millimeter-specific requests is no reason to write him off. Personally, if/when I can afford it, I'd be happy to ask Josiah to "make me a tanto" or whatever and just trust him do his special thing. Bladesmithing is at least as much art as it is craft; and not all artists may want to be constrained by their customer's specs. And I think that's great. If you'd prefer to have more control/input, then there are many others who will happily take your money. But let's not create a culture of "the customer is always right" when it comes to works of art. Just my opinion. Are you actually trying to censor a smith because he won't accommodate your specific specs and because he is comfortable with his prices? You are exactly the type of customer I'd want to avoid. 110%. I think it's fair to exclude a smith who doesn't do custom work from a list of custom smiths.
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Post by Stef on Jan 11, 2022 16:32:52 GMT
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Post by Stef on Jan 11, 2022 16:35:20 GMT
Considering the many hours required to make a sword, a price of 2000-3000$ is very reasonable I would say. Mr Sabatier needs 3 weeks to make a sword. While you can and should use these swords for tameshigiri at some point, I would still advice to also buy a cheaper sword (like a basic T10 Chinese sword) for practising as long as you’re not confident about your skill. And considering the living costs in europe I agree the price is reasonable. Like I said the issue is more about actually using something so expensive. I expect the swords are fully functional but no matter how good you are there's always the risk of accidents, imagine driving your car without any insurance. much much cheaper if you go with mono steel. I think a basic nono steel with basic koshirae is around 1.5 to 2k I asked for his prices and those are the ones he gave me so I assumed he doesn't offer mono steel. did you happen to get the turn around time for Rado? hes expensive but still abit of a deal for the attention to detail you get.
Also lol at huawei, "Jacky" has been telling people 3 months through out the whole pandemic, I get semprini happens, but can't really trust what he says aftter bullsempriniting so many people.
No info on Rado's waiting times but using novak77's order as an example he seems to have a few months waiting time. Also lol at huawei, "Jacky" has been telling people 3 months through out the whole pandemic, I get semprini happens, but can't really trust what he says aftter bullsempriniting so many people.
Yeah, reaching the conclusion that this was my best option I went ahead and ordered one so I guess we'll see. I'll have it remounted in custom koshirae. Just because a smith doesn't want to accomodate a customer's millimeter-specific requests is no reason to write him off. Personally, if/when I can afford it, I'd be happy to ask Josiah to "make me a tanto" or whatever and just trust him do his special thing. Bladesmithing is at least as much art as it is craft; and not all artists may want to be constrained by their customer's specs. And I think that's great. If you'd prefer to have more control/input, then there are many others who will happily take your money. But let's not create a culture of "the customer is always right" when it comes to works of art. Just my opinion. Are you actually trying to censor a smith because he won't accommodate your specific specs and because he is comfortable with his prices? You are exactly the type of customer I'd want to avoid. 110%. I think it's fair to exclude a smith who doesn't do custom work from a list of custom smiths. rado most definitely does monosteel my order is in mono steel
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Post by haon on Jan 11, 2022 21:07:49 GMT
And considering the living costs in europe I agree the price is reasonable. Like I said the issue is more about actually using something so expensive. I expect the swords are fully functional but no matter how good you are there's always the risk of accidents, imagine driving your car without any insurance. I asked for his prices and those are the ones he gave me so I assumed he doesn't offer mono steel. No info on Rado's waiting times but using novak77's order as an example he seems to have a few months waiting time. Yeah, reaching the conclusion that this was my best option I went ahead and ordered one so I guess we'll see. I'll have it remounted in custom koshirae. I think it's fair to exclude a smith who doesn't do custom work from a list of custom smiths. rado most definitely does monosteel my order is in mono steel I assume that this isn't the final polished state, but may I ask you to post a detailed thread how it turned out? I'm excited to see it, and how the activities show themselves in the hamon, and maybe steel grain
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Post by Stef on Jan 12, 2022 19:23:40 GMT
rado most definitely does monosteel my order is in mono steel I assume that this isn't the final polished state, but may I ask you to post a detailed thread how it turned out? I'm excited to see it, and how the activities show themselves in the hamon, and maybe steel grain I don't know if it is finished in regards of polishing but the last pic I got is is this.
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Post by pellius on Jan 12, 2022 19:43:12 GMT
…You are exactly the type of customer I'd want to avoid. 110%. Shepherd214 Please consider this to be an official warning for violating Rules #4 and #5. Another Rules violation within the next 30 days, or an egregious violation at any time, may result in your account being temporarily or permanently suspended. If you feel this warning was wrongfully given, please feel free to PM me or another moderator of your choice, pursuant to the Rules. Thank you.
“4. To treat other Members, staff and moderators with respect at all times..”
“5. Keep other Members’ threads on topic by not derailing or otherwise hijacking the topic of a thread..”sbg-sword-forum.forums.net/thread/18656/quot-rules
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Post by junesbanunes on Jan 13, 2022 8:15:48 GMT
I assume that this isn't the final polished state, but may I ask you to post a detailed thread how it turned out? I'm excited to see it, and how the activities show themselves in the hamon, and maybe steel grain I don't know if it is finished in regards of polishing but the last pic I got is is this. Does anyone know why most modern katana have the yakiba and ji colours reversed like this? Meaning most nihonto have a darker blade with a whiter hamon but like in above picture the hamon is a mirror polish and the rest of the blade a matte finish. I always though it was the chinese getting it wrong but if even a high level custom smith produces blades like this I'm thinking maybe it has to do with the modern steel or something?
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Post by haon on Jan 13, 2022 8:53:23 GMT
I don't know if it is finished in regards of polishing but the last pic I got is is this. Does anyone know why most modern katana have the yakiba and ji colours reversed like this? Meaning most nihonto have a darker blade with a whiter hamon but like in above picture the hamon is a mirror polish and the rest of the blade a matte finish. I always though it was the chinese getting it wrong but if even a high level custom smith produces blades like this I'm thinking maybe it has to do with the modern steel or something? As you already mentioned, I think it has to be something with the steel, too. However, I'm far from being experienced or knowledgeable I this regard, so take it with a grain of salt. IIRC, traditional tamahagane has more irregularities than modern steel and also different impurities, and therefore reacts different to a traditional polish. As you can see in the lower part of the photo, the blade actually looks quite dim and the hamon is very subtle. I've seen nihonto in museums where you couldn't make out the hamon, or just very hard at the right angle, let alone a hada. And photographing the hamon in a way that it shows up perfectly us not that easy, when making photos from my tanto I often capture only a segment of the hamon. Also, but I might be wrong here, I read that nihonto are photographed in a special way when it comes to the papers and "advertised" pictures on websites, so that all or most features appear evenly over the entire blade. It's something like showing a detailed "blueprint" of a car to show what it can do and look like, even thoughmost people won't take it apart. Hopefully, I remember correctly on that last paragraph about the photography, feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.
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Post by novak77 on Jan 13, 2022 13:55:00 GMT
I assume that this isn't the final polished state, but may I ask you to post a detailed thread how it turned out? I'm excited to see it, and how the activities show themselves in the hamon, and maybe steel grain I don't know if it is finished in regards of polishing but the last pic I got is is this. It looks effin awesome
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Post by treeslicer on Jan 13, 2022 14:30:34 GMT
I don't know if it is finished in regards of polishing but the last pic I got is is this. Does anyone know why most modern katana have the yakiba and ji colours reversed like this? Meaning most nihonto have a darker blade with a whiter hamon but like in above picture the hamon is a mirror polish and the rest of the blade a matte finish. I always though it was the chinese getting it wrong but if even a high level custom smith produces blades like this I'm thinking maybe it has to do with the modern steel or something? IMHO, besides subtle differences in the steel, less-than-subtle differences in polishing are involved. Production blades won't get hadori (which whitens the yakiba a lot, I personally don't like it, but it's trendy on nihonto), ji darkening with nugui, or migaki burnishing of the shinogi ji, and what polishing they do get will involve rotary stones and buffers. The enhancement of hardness irregularities won't be done by subtly contouring with fingerstones, but yanked out with an acid etch.
In the case of the blade illustrated, that's what you get on a monosteel usually, and besides that, it looks to me like the yakiba was carefully mirror polished, not fingerstoned.
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Post by Lord Newport on Jan 13, 2022 15:15:23 GMT
Been talking to the some of the above and I would remove Josiah from the list. He is not even taking custom orders because he can't be bothered with getting the specs right. He just makes swords and then you pay $3500 for mono $7500 for folded (bare blade) if he happens to have anything you like in stock. So even more if you want it mounted. Rado is €2700 for bare blade and €4000 for basic koshirae. Michael Sabatier is around €2500 depending on what options you want and posssibly a bit unreliable with time. Currently says he has a production time of 6 months. Pierluigi is around $4000 and has a long waiting list, currently 10-11 months before he can even start production. As a reference I also talked to Huawei that explained 2021 had been a messy year for them for personal reasons but they expect to be back on track now and can deliver a sword in 3 months (guess we'll see about that). It's a shame that there's such a leap from china blades to local smiths. I would love to support local and not china but with such an expensive sword I wouldn't dare to use it... I guess Motohara is the only mid-range custom option at about $2000 but I'm not into the micro-bevel on their swords. Are you actually trying to censor a smith because he won't accommodate your specific specs and because he is comfortable with his prices? You are exactly the type of customer I'd want to avoid. 110%. Even Howard Clark will tell you that he will make every effort to get your agreed on specs but that the forging and heat treat process may result in slight variances. The difference between an amateur and a professional in ANY endeavor is "consistency". Howards blades came in almost exactly on the specs I had asked for (sori was a little more shallow that I wanted). You pay a smith for his ability to consistently meet expectations again, it is not as easy as it looks.
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Post by Stef on Jan 13, 2022 23:15:00 GMT
I don't know if it is finished in regards of polishing but the last pic I got is is this. Does anyone know why most modern katana have the yakiba and ji colours reversed like this? Meaning most nihonto have a darker blade with a whiter hamon but like in above picture the hamon is a mirror polish and the rest of the blade a matte finish. I always though it was the chinese getting it wrong but if even a high level custom smith produces blades like this I'm thinking maybe it has to do with the modern steel or something? all the above motioned but also for the price you cannot expect the same result as a togishi polish. bare in mind he does get that wite hamon on his oroshigane and does do a great job considering he isn't a togishi and he is doing all the work that is usually divided into o multiple craftsman for what is a vey reasonable price
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Post by shepherd214 on Jan 14, 2022 2:19:51 GMT
Considering the many hours required to make a sword, a price of 2000-3000$ is very reasonable I would say. Mr Sabatier needs 3 weeks to make a sword. While you can and should use these swords for tameshigiri at some point, I would still advice to also buy a cheaper sword (like a basic T10 Chinese sword) for practising as long as you’re not confident about your skill. And considering the living costs in europe I agree the price is reasonable. Like I said the issue is more about actually using something so expensive. I expect the swords are fully functional but no matter how good you are there's always the risk of accidents, imagine driving your car without any insurance. much much cheaper if you go with mono steel. I think a basic nono steel with basic koshirae is around 1.5 to 2k I asked for his prices and those are the ones he gave me so I assumed he doesn't offer mono steel. did you happen to get the turn around time for Rado? hes expensive but still abit of a deal for the attention to detail you get.
Also lol at huawei, "Jacky" has been telling people 3 months through out the whole pandemic, I get semprini happens, but can't really trust what he says aftter bullsempriniting so many people.
No info on Rado's waiting times but using novak77's order as an example he seems to have a few months waiting time. Also lol at huawei, "Jacky" has been telling people 3 months through out the whole pandemic, I get semprini happens, but can't really trust what he says aftter bullsempriniting so many people.
Yeah, reaching the conclusion that this was my best option I went ahead and ordered one so I guess we'll see. I'll have it remounted in custom koshirae. Just because a smith doesn't want to accomodate a customer's millimeter-specific requests is no reason to write him off. Personally, if/when I can afford it, I'd be happy to ask Josiah to "make me a tanto" or whatever and just trust him do his special thing. Bladesmithing is at least as much art as it is craft; and not all artists may want to be constrained by their customer's specs. And I think that's great. If you'd prefer to have more control/input, then there are many others who will happily take your money. But let's not create a culture of "the customer is always right" when it comes to works of art. Just my opinion. Are you actually trying to censor a smith because he won't accommodate your specific specs and because he is comfortable with his prices? You are exactly the type of customer I'd want to avoid. 110%. I think it's fair to exclude a smith who doesn't do custom work from a list of custom smiths. I'd back up a little and reread how the comment and the attitude with which he presented his reasoning. I got a warning for saying I'd avoid the customer for that attitude and yet the dude is blatantly "vendor bashing", but it's not a SBG brand so they don't flag him
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Post by junesbanunes on Jan 14, 2022 11:35:27 GMT
I'd back up a little and reread how the comment and the attitude with which he presented his reasoning. I got a warning for saying I'd avoid the customer for that attitude and yet the dude is blatantly "vendor bashing", but it's not a SBG brand so they don't flag him This forum is for sharing experiences about available sources for swords and this thread specifically about local smiths as an alternative to the chinese or mass producion. I passed on the information that this smith told me me himself and sure, with my phrasing insinuated how I feel about not doing custom work for such prices. I never talked about any milimiter specs or crazy requirements. But my argument is there for everyone to see just like yours is so I don't see how that's censoring and I wouldn't call it blatant vendor bashing either. In that case everyone on this forum would be banned.
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Post by bradc on Jan 15, 2022 17:10:16 GMT
Since there have been a couple comments around custom Koshirae. Are we talking about fully custom carved fuchi kashira menuki tsuba? Even with custom nihonto at the 10k usd mark you will find "production or limited production" fittings are the standard.
I have done some research looking into getting a set of koshirae made and estimates typically land in the price range of 3 to 5k (and up for shakudo) among well reputed artists.
So the question: Are there custom Koshirae makers at lower price points I should be aware of? Not to derail the smith thread too much.
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