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Post by conaironvhs on Jul 22, 2021 22:45:05 GMT
I've received a katana from Swords of Northshire and it is incredibly dull (won't even cut through paper). After some back and forth for months as to what to do about this situation, I asked him whether the smith would sharpen it. He agreed that would be the best method, but I'm sure as you all know that it's illegal to send swords to China. The guy representing SoN is adamant that the sword shouldn't be seized; I thought a better method would be for the smith to just make another blade, send it to me, and then be done with it. The guy disagreed and, again, is adamant that I should just send the blade to China even though I've read customs eats swords like crazy. I asked if, in the event it does get seized, that he would refund the blade and he agreed -- but all this sounds like an absolute hassle. Basically my question is this: when you guys get bad blades, are the sellers usually insistent on returning swords this way? Further, what do you do about returns from swords that come out of China, do you just say "screw it"? Tiring stuff. Almost makes me never want to buy a blade again, to be honest.
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Post by conaironvhs on Jul 23, 2021 1:30:44 GMT
I've received a katana from Swords of Northshire and it is incredibly dull (won't even cut through paper). After some back and forth for months as to what to do about this situation, I asked him whether the smith would sharpen it. He agreed that would be the best method, but I'm sure as you all know that it's illegal to send swords to China. The guy representing SoN is adamant that the sword shouldn't be seized; I thought a better method would be for the smith to just make another blade, send it to me, and then be done with it. The guy disagreed and, again, is adamant that I should just send the blade to China even though I've read customs eats swords like crazy. I asked if, in the event it does get seized, that he would refund the blade and he agreed -- but all this sounds like an absolute hassle. Basically my question is this: when you guys get bad blades, are the sellers usually insistent on returning swords this way? Further, what do you do about returns from swords that come out of China, do you just say "screw it"? Tiring stuff. Almost makes me never want to buy a blade again, to be honest. Are you 100% sure it is dull-dull, are you sure it might not just require a good stropping? Sometimes there can be a minimal micro burr on the edge or just left over polishing compound or something on the apex. I have noticed this before with a Hanwei Tanto, The second I actually stropped it, it was hair-popping sharp. I know it sounds weird but it's something I have experienced. Dull as can be. Reason I know for absolute certain and not just because of my limited experience with swords is because a local sword shop confirmed it because I wanted them to sharpen it ($300 something dollars -- no thanks, dude; I got the blade for 196 dollars). Blade simply has no edge. |
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Post by MichaelRS on Jul 23, 2021 1:34:22 GMT
I deal with Hanbon Forge and so far I'm very happy with the service they provide. That being said, many people seem extremely happy with the customer service through Swords of Northshire.
There are several videos on YouTube where people have received a sword they thought was deficient in some way and they extol how it was corrected or replaced with what they want.
But you pay for that over the price of basically the same quality blade from HF.
But as to your problem...
You didn't mention the type of blade it was or where you live.
Meaning; if it's their basic 1060 blade, versus a 1095 clay tempered blade, that might influence the extent they're willing to go to correct any given particular type of problem.
Also, they have to watch out for people who are claiming some sort of deficiency and just trying to get an extra free sword.
Not directed at you at all. Just saying that would be one concern.
If I was in that business I would say send the sword back and we will correct the problem or give the person a new sword without the problem. But either way the person is ending up with just one sword.
Personally I would not expect a company to send me a whole new blade if mine simply was not as sharp as I wanted it to be.
And I can't think of another reason to ship my sword off unless I was going to ship it to Cottontails Customs to have them replace my tsuka or to somebody who was going to give it a badass polish job
But regarding the sharpening and where you live;
Are there no cutlery shops that can sharpen the blade?
I bet you they would do it for far less than the price it cost to ship it to China and back. They are telling you to ship them the blade so I was assuming that you're also paying for return shipping. But even if you're paying for only one way, I think a cutlery shop or knife specialty store or that sort of thing would be cheaper
At the price point your blade probably is.I doubt they can do a bad job that it would ruin it.
Or as the previous answer said, get yourself some sort of stropping tool and run it over the blade a few times.
Lots of YouTube videos out there on how to pick and use one (particularly on a katana) and they're not very expensive.
It may or may not solve the problem with this particular blade, but it would not be a waste of money either. It's a good tool to have in your arsenal of sword maintenance stuff and junk.
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Post by conaironvhs on Jul 23, 2021 2:20:26 GMT
I deal with Hanbon Forge and so far I'm very happy with the service they provide. That being said, many people seem extremely happy with the customer service through Swords of Northshire. There are several videos on YouTube where people have received a sword they thought was deficient in some way and they extol how it was corrected or replaced with what they want. But you pay for that over the price of basically the same quality blade from HF. But as to your problem... You didn't mention the type of blade it was or where you live. Meaning; if it's their basic 1060 blade, versus a 1095 clay tempered blade, that might influence the extent they're willing to go to correct any given particular type of problem. Also, they have to watch out for people who are claiming some sort of deficiency and just trying to get an extra free sword. Not directed at you at all. Just saying that would be one concern. If I was in that business I would say send the sword back and we will correct the problem or give the person a new sword without the problem. But either way the person is ending up with just one sword. Personally I would not expect a company to send me a whole new blade if mine simply was not as sharp as I wanted it to be. And I can't think of another reason to ship my sword off unless I was going to ship it to Cottontails Customs to have them replace my tsuka or to somebody who was going to give it a badass polish job But regarding the sharpening and where you live; Are there no cutlery shops that can sharpen the blade? I bet you they would do it for far less than the price it cost to ship it to China and back. They are telling you to ship them the blade so I was assuming that you're also paying for return shipping. But even if you're paying for only one way, I think a cutlery shop or knife specialty store or that sort of thing would be cheaper At the price point your blade probably is.I doubt they can do a bad job that it would ruin it. Or as the previous answer said, get yourself some sort of stropping tool and run it over the blade a few times. Lots of YouTube videos out there on how to pick and use one (particularly on a katana) and they're not very expensive. It may or may not solve the problem with this particular blade, but it would not be a waste of money either. It's a good tool to have in your arsenal of sword maintenance stuff and junk. I never intended to cast shade on SoN. They've been professional and friendly to me throughout. It's a 1060 blade, and I live in the US. I'm certain the guy believes me because I showed video proof of the sword not cutting through anything (it won't even cut through printer paper when I rub it along the edge of the blade). Regarding cutlery shops, I have my reservations about it because because of two things: I have an engraving on there (granted it's far down on the blade, but a katana is supposed to be sharp throughout), and that sharpening it will take off the fake hamon. Again, I cannot do justice enough in my post to tell you guys that this thing is dull as a butter knife and that minor adjustments on my end will not save it. |
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tera
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Post by tera on Jul 23, 2021 3:14:17 GMT
I'd be surprised if a cutlery shop or knife store would know how to properly sharpen (read:polish) a katana. If you are ok with them grinding a secondary bezel, that's something I'm sure the could do.
Maybe such shops are more savvy where you live, though. I don't know anyone near me I'd trust
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Post by RufusScorpius on Jul 23, 2021 11:31:41 GMT
Buying a sword isn't like buying something off of Amazon Prime with free shipping and no-hassle return policy. Sometimes it's a complicated and frustrating experience. Even the cheaper "real" swords are handmade and come from small manufacturers with a wide variation of quality and customer service. More often than not, every purchase is a unique experience even if is from the same seller.
I don't know what advice to give you except to trust the vendor and let them make the sword right for you. After all is said and done you can come back on the forum with the repaired/replaced blade and tell us of the experience.
And I agree with tera, local cutlery shops probably don't know the first thing about sword edges and if they do agree to sharpen it (which is unlikely), then they will put a secondary bevel on it. If that's what you want, then all is good. If not, then you really are going to either have to spend the money for a sharpening service or learn how to do it yourself.
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Post by Lancelot Chan on Jul 23, 2021 11:50:46 GMT
mind to take a photo at the edge and share here? I mean RIGHT at the edge apex, not from the side.
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Post by Sir Thorfinn on Jul 23, 2021 13:31:07 GMT
And if you wanna be really OCD about your edges, look at it with a cheap microscope. This does an adequate job, and is near throw-away cheap. smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B01JOO2EGK/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1But as to your real issue, you may be out of luck. I've had things disappear into the customs black hole, and they're just *gone*. You don't want that. I may have missed it, but have you suggested they send a replacement, and when you get it you'll ship the old one back to them? Then it's on them to fight with customs. Just a thought. |
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tera
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Posts: 1,800
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Post by tera on Jul 23, 2021 16:28:56 GMT
Disappearing because of Customs is something I fortunately have no experience with, but a question.
Suppose he shipped it with insurance, at a value to include the cost of shipping. If it disappeared, wouldn't the shipper (eventually, after some investigation) pay out the insurance? At that point, time would be lost but not money. The OP could then re-order the sword or go with a different vendor, if that was more comfortable.
My only caveat here is if it truly is illegal to ship swords into China and the carrier knows it's a sword, I'm pretty sure they'll not pay the insurance. There's also the chance of ending up on some strange "People's Republic Naughty Person" list with [unknown] side effects.
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Post by conaironvhs on Jul 23, 2021 22:06:11 GMT
My only caveat here is if it truly is illegal to ship swords into China and the carrier knows it's a sword, I'm pretty sure they'll not pay the insurance. There's also the chance of ending up on some strange "People's Republic Naughty Person" list with [unknown] side effects. This right here is the crux of the issue. While the seller indeed has assured me that in the event that it does get seized that he'll issue a refund, he is still asking me to break another country's laws for my sword to get sharpened by his smith. I am intensely uncomfortable with that for many reasons, but the guy at SoN is framing it like it isn't that big of a deal.
What I thought would be a more elegant method was for him to send me another blade (blade only, no scabbard, etc) and then I would put the sword back together with an actual sharpened blade. Again, he is insistent on shipping the sword to China. I thought it would save both parties money in the long run instead of him having to pay the shipping cost (which is on the low end of the hundred dollar range) as well as insurance for the sword and possibility of seizure by whatever authorities thought I was sending a sword for a rebellion or some other bit of madness they'll assume it's for.
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Post by pvsampson on Jul 23, 2021 22:15:47 GMT
SoN is a US based retailer as far as I am aware. Why would they require you to send to China and not return to them to handle the issue?
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Post by jyamada on Jul 23, 2021 22:57:53 GMT
My only caveat here is if it truly is illegal to ship swords into China and the carrier knows it's a sword, I'm pretty sure they'll not pay the insurance. There's also the chance of ending up on some strange "People's Republic Naughty Person" list with [unknown] side effects. This right here is the crux of the issue. While the seller indeed has assured me that in the event that it does get seized that he'll issue a refund, he is still asking me to break another country's laws for my sword to get sharpened by his smith. I am intensely uncomfortable with that for many reasons, but the guy at SoN is framing it like it isn't that big of a deal.
What I thought would be a more elegant method was for him to send me another blade (blade only, no scabbard, etc) and then I would put the sword back together with an actual sharpened blade. Again, he is insistent on shipping the sword to China. I thought it would save both parties money in the long run instead of him having to pay the shipping cost (which is on the low end of the hundred dollar range) as well as insurance for the sword and possibility of seizure by whatever authorities thought I was sending a sword for a rebellion or some other bit of madness they'll assume it's for.
A replacement blade would likely be sized different enough so nothing would fit together well (saya, tsuka core, hardware). These drop-down-menu sellers like SoN just mix and match a bunch of sayas, tsuka cores and hardware around for best fit and maybe do a little shim/filing. If SoN doesn't want to make it right, IMO best bet would be to find someone that can sharpen it, or learn to sharpen it yourself. |
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Post by conaironvhs on Jul 23, 2021 23:00:17 GMT
SoN is a US based retailer as far as I am aware. Why would they require you to send to China and not return to them to handle the issue? As I understand it, he mentioned nothing about returning the sword back to him so that he could take care of it. He gave me the return address to the forge in China which, as I understand it, is where I ship it to without his involvement. He mentioned that I would pay the shipping cost to China and then he would recompense me afterwards. |
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tera
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Posts: 1,800
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Post by tera on Jul 24, 2021 1:34:42 GMT
Katana do need some degree of hand-fitting so I don't think swapping the blade would produce satisfactory results. It does make sense for them to want to swap the entire sword.
Maybe reach out to them and let them know you appreciate the return process and support, but aren't comfortable shipping it to China as you believe you would be violating a law. If they are comfortable doing so, maybe come to an arrangement where you ship it to them, and they ship to China. That does beg the questions of who carries the burden of the additional shipping and what happens to your money in the interim, though.
I'm sorry you're in a rough spot. Do let us know how this gets resolved.
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Post by Cottontail Customs on Jul 24, 2021 6:58:50 GMT
SoN is a US based retailer as far as I am aware. Why would they require you to send to China and not return to them to handle the issue? As I understand it, he mentioned nothing about returning the sword back to him so that he could take care of it. He gave me the return address to the forge in China which, as I understand it, is where I ship it to without his involvement. He mentioned that I would pay the shipping cost to China and then he would recompense me afterwards. son is not a forge or factory, from what I know, so the sword came from China, possibly directly to you, so I would think it would need to go back to do something like sharpening. I imagine son could probably swap some fittings but they probably wouldn't be willing or able to polish Japanese style blades. you are right to be concerned about it disappearing, imho, I've had two sword related items(not a whole sword), vanish so far once it arrived at Chinese customs. will they guarantee it's value if it doesn't make it? I think that even though there are a lot of flaws one should be willing to accept for production swords in this price range, the blade of a Japanese style sword should at least be sharp. I mean, that's like the biggest part of the sword's function. a dull samurai sword is an iaito or a wall hanger, not a functional tool. anyway, I hope you're covered or that it goes without a hitch if you should decide to take the chance. good luck and let us know what happens. |
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Post by MichaelRS on Aug 1, 2021 2:49:10 GMT
Sorry if this was already sad, I didn't read through every comment. But my thought would be if they swear to you that it's okay to ship and something happens to it, they owe you a sword
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