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Post by Sammy on Aug 17, 2020 14:27:19 GMT
Hello, I am planning a trip to Kyoto when the world re-opens and I am in the market for an authentic shinken nihonto katana. In my research, it looks like there is a decent sized seller there called "Tozando" tozandoshop.com/. Has anyone purchased anything from them? Are they a good buyer to look into for katanas that have good quality steel, are full tang, and have real hamon? Or, can anyone recommend a seller in the Kyoto area thats better? Thanks much, Sam
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Post by vidar on Aug 17, 2020 15:53:24 GMT
In Japan, they only sell the real stuff (folded tamagahane, real hamon, full tang). In case you’re new in this business: just make sure you don’t buy an iaito if you anticipate a real sword. I’m not sure if Tozando has a lot of shinken. This shop is also excellent: www.aoijapan.com/
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Post by Verity on Aug 17, 2020 17:17:32 GMT
In Japan, they only sell the real stuff (folded tamagahane, real hamon, full tang). In case you’re new in this business: just make sure you don’t buy an iaito if you anticipate a real sword. I’m not sure if Tozando has a lot of shinken. This shop is also excellent: www.aoijapan.com/Not entirely true. They also sell tourist junk that classifies as SLOs. I've seen many in Asakusa market personally. In terms of an actual sword, Tozando is a decent seller. You also can acquire nihonto stateside as well and avoid the exportation paperwork. Many dealers out there for this. If you DO want the in-japan buying experience I would just ensure you set aside plenty of time for the exportation process. If your trip is short your newly acquired shinken may not be traveling with you but rather shipped after.
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Post by samm on Aug 17, 2020 17:39:08 GMT
Thanks for the replies. Yeah, I've looked on the Tozando website again and it looks like their inventory is mostly iaito. I will ask if they have some shinken and then I will have to deal with the complexity of exporting or even carrying a shinken in Japan. Do you guys know if purchasing it there and then having it ship after without me would remove some of those hurdles?
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Post by Verity on Aug 17, 2020 17:44:28 GMT
Thanks for the replies. Yeah, I've looked on the Tozando website again and it looks like their inventory is mostly iaito. I will ask if they have some shinken and then I will have to deal with the complexity of exporting or even carrying a shinken in Japan. Do you guys know if purchasing it there and then having it ship after without me would remove some of those hurdles? Generally a shinken Dealer in Japan will handle export and shipment to the US. Just expect it to take some time after the in-person transaction. Similar paperwork occurs when you ship a nihonto to Japan for shinsa. The inbound and outbound paperwork is exhausting :(
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Post by Verity on Aug 17, 2020 17:49:57 GMT
Also if Tozando is not to your liking you could visit Izawa-san: www.mononofuya.jpThey don't have offerings on the website however they have a shop in Kyoto and probably have stuff to look at and/or can help you place an order. I also recommend seeing the golden temple while in Kyoto. It is amazing.
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Post by samm on Aug 17, 2020 18:13:21 GMT
The site that vidar mentioned, aoijapan, it looks like many of those are authentic swords made in the feudal era so their prices are as much as a small car :/ Will it be possible to buy a shinken in Japan that's made more recently and so not quite as expensive? My price range is $500-$1200.
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Post by vidar on Aug 17, 2020 18:16:43 GMT
Tozando used to offer a few Shinken, but they recently renewed their website and I don’t see them anymore. Maybe in their shop...
The other shop I mentioned, Aoi, is really great. I once bought a tsuba from them. They’re used to export swords so you can rely on them to arrange all the paperwork properly.
I don’t know what your budget and intention is, but some general advice: If you want a sword as an investment, take an antique (eg Shinto) WITH NBTHK papers. If you consider to use it for martial arts and your budget is limited, look for a sword that made was in the 70-ies or for a Gimei (“non guaranteed”) but with modern fittings.
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Post by vidar on Aug 17, 2020 18:19:43 GMT
The site that vidar mentioned, aoijapan, it looks like many of those are authentic swords made in the feudal era so their prices are as much as a small car :/ Will it be possible to buy a shinken in Japan that's made more recently and so not quite as expensive? My price range is $500-$1200. Sorry, you posted while I was typing No, you won’t find a Nihonto for that budget. You’ll need at least 2000$ for something decent. For this budget, you can get: 1/ a Japanese iaito 2/ a decent Chinese production sword 3/ a Japanese WW2 sword (Shin Gunto), but you’ll have to buy that in the US.
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Post by samm on Aug 17, 2020 18:32:09 GMT
Well...maybe I can up it to 2000
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Post by vidar on Aug 17, 2020 18:42:57 GMT
For 2000, you can find a Mumei sword in Shirasaya, or a mounted sword with issues. For example this one: www.aoijapan.com/katana-mumei-has-hagire/It has a hagire, which is a crack in the hardened part. For decoration or Iai practice, that is no big deal but this sword should not be used for cutting.
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Post by samm on Aug 17, 2020 19:45:20 GMT
Are non-antique shinken not a thing? Do people make them much anymore?
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Post by vidar on Aug 17, 2020 20:16:32 GMT
They don’t make a lot of modern swords (Shinsakuto). The main reasons are political (smiths can only make 2 swords per month) and they need to do it the traditional way (so no 1095 steel and machine polishing). So it’s very labour intensive and they don’t get minimum wages like in China... Therefore, commissioning a new swords easily costs 8000$.
A cheaper alternative is an older sword, from the 70ies or 80ies. You can often find such swords for 3000-4000$.
Further down the price ladder are WW2 swords (Showato or Gendaito). Gendaito were still traditionally made and therefore can be traded in Japan. These swords are less popular but still worth a few thousand dollar. Showato were mass produced with industrial techniques and are therefore not considered true Japanse swords and are illegal in Japan. But you can find them in the US for several hundred dollar, usually mounted in the typical Shin Gunto style. I recently saw such a sword, remounted in modern fittings, for around 1200$. But IMO you could then also consider a high quality Chinese production sword. I hope that answers your question?
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Post by Verity on Aug 17, 2020 21:10:39 GMT
Yeah a shinsakuto from Japan in NO universe will be $500-1200.
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Post by ScottG on May 5, 2022 16:49:34 GMT
Tozando usually order made their Shinken so it would take a year and starting price would be around 8,000 US at least. The smith was well-renowned and it is full tamahagane steel hand-folded... the full traditional very well cared but pricy option. I got mine from there and they did all the paperwork for the Registration of the sword so it was a lot easier but not cheap. Under 2000 you would have better luck wining the lottery for a Shinken here. If you are interested let me know I am going to be selling my Shinken but it is not cheap and would take time.
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