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Post by dobralov on Aug 27, 2019 14:11:43 GMT
Thank you for the recommendations, everyone! I ordered the 9260 steel sword with bo-hi directly from Huaweiswords with a few customizations regarding the tsuba, ito, and saya. I'll post pics when it arrives in a few weeks! Jacky was responsive to my questions and I can hardly wait for it to arrive
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admin
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Post by admin on Sept 18, 2019 7:39:56 GMT
I think we need to buy one of these so called 9260 blades from Huawei and have it tested. Only ONE forge in Longquan make 9260 blades, and they are exclusive to Cheness. We tried and can't get it from any other forge. Hanwei (not Huwawei) in Longquan have some 9260 blades in the A.P.O.C. series, but these are easier to make than a Katana.
Price is the giveaway hear, they sell so called 9260 blades below what it costs to make them - so its either an outright lie or they are getting scraps from Cheness.
Oh, and just because a company has been around for 10 years doesn't mean its 'old'. Prices are the same as they were 10 years ago, they have made them so many times over so many years all the bugs are as ironed out as they can possibly be and the fact that they have been around that long means they must be doing something right. I always recommend tried and tested rather than the newest, greatest thing that turns out to be a lemon..
Proper Hisigami adds about $40-60 to a swords cost. They also claim you can send in your own fittings, last I heard someome trying that they disappeared and Jacky stopped responding to the customer.
Have a read of this months issue of the sword buyers digest if you want my opinion on this company. So much hype, but the facts don't back it up. Address is a Candy store, Jacky a lady on an e-bike picking up scraps, sometimes good communication, sometimes just stops, 9260 swords with broken tangs. Just can't support that company, and the sword is impossible to sell for that price with the options it has unless something is seriously wrong with the blade or its a different steel (almost EVERY sword in Longquan is made from 1045, 1060, 1095 or T10 - no 'imported Japanese steel' or genuine Tamahagane..
Huawei and the like actually do massive damage to the industry, its been gutted by these sellers and once they have sucked it dry, they will move on to selling something else..
Oh, and read all the Huwawei reviews on the site. So many complaints and errors but they seem to be forgiven for everything. Very fishy..
/rant over
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admin
Site Admin
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Post by admin on Sept 18, 2019 8:03:54 GMT
A good option,10+ years ago. Non alternating tsukamaki,those ugly cheap cut seppa,etc.They havent kept up with the market and havent really been a value for a very long time.And the fact that they added a disclaimer to their site due to so many swords being sent out dull,now they dont replace them when a customer complains about the edge. Okay, I have to step in here Maewyn because you have presented a lot of incorrect information.
First off, seppa - see Marc reviews from several years ago where he states: "The habaki are filed and grooved brass, a huge improvement over the old standard habaki. The seppa are also brass, and key-fret, not cheap stamped bits."
Ito is alternating, look at the picture:
They have held their prices for over 10 years, and the forge has 10 years experience making them and refining them.
Oh, and customers complain about edges on EVERY sword company because so many people expect trick cutting razor sharp Katana like in anime and movies. As small businesses, you can't refund everytime someone complains about what is really a personal preference thing and so easy to adjust (hardness, geometry, balance and speed count for cutting much more than sharpness unless its just a trick shot blade).
Dynasty Forge have not changed in 10 years. Neither have many Hanwei swords. I did business with Dynasty but they provided very poor customer service follow up when there was an issue and did not stand behind their products so I dropped them and will not recommend them either.
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Post by El Chingon on Sept 18, 2019 15:42:30 GMT
A good option,10+ years ago. Non alternating tsukamaki,those ugly cheap cut seppa,etc.They havent kept up with the market and havent really been a value for a very long time.And the fact that they added a disclaimer to their site due to so many swords being sent out dull,now they dont replace them when a customer complains about the edge. Okay, I have to step in here Maewyn because you have presented a lot of incorrect information.
First off, seppa - see Marc reviews from several years ago where he states: "The habaki are filed and grooved brass, a huge improvement over the old standard habaki. The seppa are also brass, and key-fret, not cheap stamped bits."
Ito is alternating, look at the picture:
They have held their prices for over 10 years, and the forge has 10 years experience making them and refining them.
Oh, and customers complain about edges on EVERY sword company because so many people expect trick cutting razor sharp Katana like in anime and movies. As small businesses, you can't refund everytime someone complains about what is really a personal preference thing and so easy to adjust (hardness, geometry, balance and speed count for cutting much more than sharpness unless its just a trick shot blade).
Dynasty Forge have not changed in 10 years. Neither have many Hanwei swords. I did business with Dynasty but they provided very poor customer service follow up when there was an issue and did not stand behind their products so I dropped them and will not recommend them either.
There's a miscommunication here. Maewyn isn't wrong. They are referring to Cheness, not Ronin.
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admin
Site Admin
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Post by admin on Sept 19, 2019 3:32:59 GMT
Sorry, I get so busy I lost track of the thread there..
But much of what I said about the swords of DF, Ronin, etc having not changed in 10 years but have largely held the same price and by now margins are so thin its only a question of time before ALL sword companies will be putting up their prices.
Apologies for the confusion, its true that Cheness do lack some of the niceties of other brands - ito is indeed not alternating and they do use the stamped out cheapo seppa. But like I have stated clearly in the detailed article on the main site how swords are made (which covers Chinese, South East Asia, India and the West) swords are made to a target price point, and the total cost can be broken down into components such as the cost of the blade, each type of fitting, etc. Ronin are very balanced, blade is about 48% of the total cost. In the case of Cheness, the blade is closer to 68% of the total value with cheaper but still functional fittings added to meet the target price point.
And as was glossed over, apart from A.P.O.C. in Dailan and Cheness' forge in Longquan, no other company in China can or does make 9260 blades. If the blade alone represents 70% of the value, no way you can pick one up for $199 with free shipping and great fittings. It's literally impossible to do without losing money or lying about the type of steel used. And as noted, in hammertown, there was NO 9260 steel there at all, just 1045, 1060, 1095 and T10.
9260 deforms horribly when heat treated and is very hard to get it straightened out again (all swords deform during heat treat, but 9260 can end up like a pretzel).
So at the end of the day they are the only validated choice for 9260 Katana that I know (and we have looked for it, believe me).
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Post by aeri on Oct 14, 2019 7:59:58 GMT
Interesting read about the limited number of forges working with 9260 steel. That explains why I saw significantly fewer choices in 9260 compared to something like 1060 or 5160.
Apparently Dragon King makes the A.P.O.C. line of swords. I recently saw some Dragon King "Sea Wave Katana" and "Sea Wave Wakizashi" items listed for sale online and they are described as being made from folded 9260 and T10 steel. Could not find any reviews though so maybe they were just released.
Hopefully more types of 9260 swords will be offered in the future. I would really like to see a 9260 through-hardened katana with the Dragon King style of fittings like silver habaki and seppa.
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Post by dobralov on Oct 30, 2019 14:16:23 GMT
Update: After 60 days, Jacky of Huawei swords claimed "health issues" and granted a refund. Jacky was mostly communicative throughout the delay and I was content to wait longer, if necessary, but it looks like I may have to go elsewhere. I asked Jacky if they are putting a hold on production because I was looking forward to seeing their custom work(Red saya with horn fittings, red ito, white rayskin). Have yet to hear back but after re-reading some of the above criticism of Huawei, I'm moving on. Musha 1060 Shobu Katana has me, just gonna pass on the bo-hi but I l dig the lines and I can always buy more later!
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Post by dobralov on Oct 30, 2019 23:36:25 GMT
And anyone else that cares to chime in... I settled on the Shobu design. I like both the above, and this: kultofathena.com/product.asp?item=DF063I know that 1095 steel is harder, but also slightly more prone to breaking if you cut sloppily? How much is this true for DF, and is it cause enough for me to avoid dropping the extra coin on it at this point?
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Post by Cottontail Customs on Oct 31, 2019 8:17:38 GMT
I've owned/purchased/worked on over a dozen Huawei over the years and never had a big problem. ordering a custom these days takes forever but they are always worth it if you have the patience. in my experience, stock swords arrive within 2 weeks. I feel their stock swords, including their $199 models are excellent quality for the price and have many features more expensive swords don't. a LOT of bang for your buck.
I like the DF Musha line because they're simple, tough and priced fairly and while the shobu is an excellent choice for a workhorse cutter, it is considered a bit heavy or tip heavy by many. this does add to the power of a swing though and can be a benefit for heavy targets. if you like a slightly bigger and heavier sword, it's a very good entry level and beyond katana. I'd also recommend their shinogi-zukuri models, bo hi and non.
another basic but tough cutter is the Hanwei Renshu. the Raptors are also a tried and true option but some can be a little robust proportionally imho.
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Post by dobralov on Oct 31, 2019 12:29:17 GMT
I've owned/purchased/worked on over a dozen Huawei over the years and never had a big problem. ordering a custom these days takes forever but they are always worth it if you have the patience. in my experience, stock swords arrive within 2 weeks. I feel their stock swords, including their $199 models are excellent quality for the price and have many features more expensive swords don't. a LOT of bang for your buck. I like the DF Musha line because they're simple, tough and priced fairly and while the shobu is an excellent choice for a workhorse cutter, it is considered a bit heavy or tip heavy by many. this does add to the power of a swing though and can be a benefit for heavy targets. if you like a slightly bigger and heavier sword, it's a very good entry level and beyond katana. I'd also recommend their shinogi-zukuri models, bo hi and non. another basic but tough cutter is the Hanwei Renshu. the Raptors are also a tried and true option but some can be a little robust proportionally imho. Thank you for the options! I'll definitely take a look and appreciate the heads-up on the Shobu. Likely the first of several, so it's OK if it's heavy. My original intent was something with a bo-hi, but that can come later, perhaps? As for Huawei, I was certainly content to wait and I never demanded a refund. Their original quote was 2–3 weeks for a custom, which seemed short to me but whatever. When we hit 30 days, I politely asked for an update. Silence for nearly 2 weeks, then an apology because they were on "vacation." They said they would refund my purchase. Mind you, I didn't ask for a refund, I just was just looking for a small update. I politely declined a refund with the stated reason of "better to be done right, than done quickly." They asked for 10–15 more days. Sure, no problem. Day 17 arrived and I sent another "hey, hope you're well, how's it going" etc message. Jacky immediately refunded my purchase due to "health reasons." I get that things happen and custom-work takes time. I really do. The red flags for me were the pattern of mismanaged expectations, initial slow-response time, unnecessary excuses, and two hair-trigger offers of a refund. Like they were never vested, and either unable or unwilling to exhibit fundamentals of fair customer service. If it is indeed health-related and transitional, then I wish Jacky a speedy recovery even if I'm looking elsewhere
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Post by dobralov on Oct 31, 2019 16:43:45 GMT
Digging through the KoA site, they have a description of sharpening (http://kultofathena.com/sharp.html). How much does this matter, really? They state "Sharp" is the standard for most European swords and that "Very Sharp" is the standard for katanas, but many of katanas on the site are listed as "Sharp." Just seems weird to present Very Sharp as the standard and then deviate? What am I missing?
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Post by Cottontail Customs on Oct 31, 2019 21:47:41 GMT
Digging through the KoA site, they have a description of sharpening (http://kultofathena.com/sharp.html). How much does this matter, really? They state "Sharp" is the standard for most European swords and that "Very Sharp" is the standard for katanas, but many of katanas on the site are listed as "Sharp." Just seems weird to present Very Sharp as the standard and then deviate? What am I missing? this is where experience comes in handy and hanging around sword forums and fb groups and reading tons of reviews can help shed some light. KOA is obviously not the manufacturer of their wares but they try to help provide enough info so you're not buying totally blind but even so, you shouldn't really rely on their basic info alone. knowing the manufacturer can clear up a lot of the confusion as each brand kind of has their traits, benefits and flaws. one important thing to realize about production swords is there is no such thing as perfect. ever. and even within the same brand and even particular model of sword, things won't be 100% consistent, such as edge sharpness and fit & finish, etc. definitely expect variances here. generally, production Euro/western style swords will have some form of secondary bevel on the edge while most katana will have what's called a zero bevel or clam shell or apple seed edge. katana also tend to have a more honed edge but plenty still come less than razor sharp. think about where and how and by whom they're made and you should understand that there needs to be an acceptable level of "exception to the rule" for them to produce the number of swords they do and sell them at the price they do. when dealing with most production swords under 1K, you basically hope to get a good one with as few major flaws as possible. even at the top of that price point (and above), mistakes should be expected. buying from a good dealer is essential in this case and solid return policies make a difference. lemons do get through as these larger vendors can't possibly open and thoroughly inspect each and every sword before shipping. at around $300, you hope for the sword to be without any major flaws and fitment issues but to expect perfection is completely unreasonable. while perfect doesn't exist regarding prod swords, perfect for the job at hand can. as for Jacky and custom work, yes, it can be very frustrating with the lack of communication and endless excuses, most if not all being total bs, but the payoff for extreme patience is almost always an excellent sword worth far beyond what you pay. you have to have epic patience though and if you have anything less, I would highly recommend going with something else. in fact, having more people that can't handle it is better for me since the end result will be less of a wait time for my own projects imho, there are no other ebay or direct from China dealers that can even come close to the level of quality Huawei reaches. not sino or ryan or northshire or wang or any other alias or "build your own sword" provider out there. for under $500 production katana, Huawei can't be beat for base quality. most of their fittings are very generic but investing in one to eventually customize makes for an amazing sword worth more than you paid. also, don't forget to look through the classifieds here and on fb to find a used sword selling for much less than new. some of the best deals to be found come through the second hand market.
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Post by dobralov on Nov 2, 2019 17:29:53 GMT
Thanks again, everyone, for the great advice and suggestions.
Just ordered the DF Musha with bo-hi as this is my first sword and it feels like it'll work well for backyard cutting and kata. Shobu was tempting but want a more agile sword for my first!
(http://www.kultofathena.com/product.asp?item=DF001&name=Dynasty+Forge+Musha+1060+Musashi+Double+Ring+Theme+Katana+with+Bo%2DHi+#)
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