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Post by randomnobody on Mar 11, 2019 9:16:38 GMT
Oh right, that.
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Zen_Hydra
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Born with a heart full of neutrality
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Post by Zen_Hydra on Mar 11, 2019 16:31:58 GMT
You don't want to make sheaths and scabbards 100% watertight, though! Especially in moist climates with a lot of temperature variation, that's just asking for condensation to get trapped in there with no way out. That's why plastic sheaths should and usually do have a couple of holes in 'em. I don't know if this is true, but someone once told me that there cousin's university roommate drilled holes in wood. Crazy, right?
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Post by MOK on Mar 11, 2019 18:24:20 GMT
Hell, I've drilled lots of holes in wood.
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Zen_Hydra
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Born with a heart full of neutrality
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Post by Zen_Hydra on Mar 11, 2019 18:39:11 GMT
Hell, I've drilled lots of holes in wood. Then it stands to reason that one could moisture seal the inside of a wooden scabbard, and allow for any accumulated moisture to drain/escape. This achieves the goals of having a scabbard which doesn't warp when transported between humid and arid climates, and being constructed in a manner which minimizes increased resource investment in production.
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Post by Cottontail Customs on Mar 12, 2019 17:12:46 GMT
the quality of wood used for many Chinese made saya and tsuka is low for the most part, while the wood used for most "shirasaya" is actually decent to good. why use the better material when it's just going to be covered in lacquer or wrapping, right? often, this wood won't be dried properly or will have many flaws like knots, cracks, splits, warps or even rot. I've smelled some BAD wood too many times to count and when it smells that bad, you know there are other more serious issues waiting to pop up. I've also stripped many saya down to bare wood and have seen these flaws first hand.
having said that, saya fit and maintenance is the owners responsibility and one should learn to care for them if they're going to own and care for a sword. as much as it is their responsibility to oil and care for the blade. it's very easy to maintain a good saya fit, even accounting for climate change making it swell or contract. shimming or filing the koiguchi is super simple and requires very little time and expense and anyone that can use glue, scissors or a file can do it. there are also safe and easy ways to prevent saya rattle. sometimes the issues go beyond this and in those cases, something more extreme might have to be done to achieve a proper fit. I think the customer should be educated as to how to do these simple things and if they can't or won't, it's then on them.
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Zen_Hydra
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Born with a heart full of neutrality
Posts: 2,629
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Post by Zen_Hydra on Mar 12, 2019 17:40:49 GMT
the quality of wood used for many Chinese made saya and tsuka is low for the most part, while the wood used for most "shirasaya" is actually decent to good. why use the better material when it's just going to be covered in lacquer or wrapping, right? often, this wood won't be dried properly or will have many flaws like knots, cracks, splits, warps or even rot. I've smelled some BAD wood too many times to count and when it smells that bad, you know there are other more serious issues waiting to pop up. I've also stripped many saya down to bare wood and have seen these flaws first hand. having said that, saya fit and maintenance is the owners responsibility and one should learn to care for them if they're going to own and care for a sword. as much as it is their responsibility to oil and care for the blade. it's very easy to maintain a good saya fit, even accounting for climate change making it swell or contract. shimming or filing the koiguchi is super simple and requires very little time and expense and anyone that can use glue, scissors or a file can do it. there are also safe and easy ways to prevent saya rattle. sometimes the issues go beyond this and in those cases, something more extreme might have to be done to achieve a proper fit. I think the customer should be educated as to how to do these simple things and if they can't or won't, it's then on them. I agree that care and maintenance is the responsibility of the owner, but the OP was looking for solutions to wooden scabbards warping in transit do to relative humidity differences between the manufacturer's location (where the scabbard fits correctly) and the buyer's location (where the scabbard arrives warped).
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Post by randomnobody on Mar 12, 2019 18:36:06 GMT
A bent scabbard is one thing, but I think the majority complaint is simply a tight or loose scabbard. Can't say I've heard of any bent, twisted, or otherwise warped scabbards, myself, but I've seen a great number of tight/loose, even cracked. Likewise for tsuka, and that solution goes the same way.
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Zen_Hydra
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Born with a heart full of neutrality
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Post by Zen_Hydra on Mar 12, 2019 21:00:26 GMT
A bent scabbard is one thing, but I think the majority complaint is simply a tight or loose scabbard. Can't say I've heard of any bent, twisted, or otherwise warped scabbards, myself, but I've seen a great number of tight/loose, even cracked. Likewise for tsuka, and that solution goes the same way. Scabbard tightening/loosening do to atmospheric humidity changes would certainly fall under the umbrella of warpage. Such deformations aren't by definition required to be extreme.
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Post by randomnobody on Mar 12, 2019 21:22:23 GMT
Eh, maybe. Expansion and contraction may or may not be distortion, I dunno. Semantics? Pedantic? When I hear "warp" I think of something that is visibly "bent out of shape," rather than merely swelling or shrinking.
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Post by Cottontail Customs on Mar 12, 2019 23:01:50 GMT
A bent scabbard is one thing, but I think the majority complaint is simply a tight or loose scabbard. Can't say I've heard of any bent, twisted, or otherwise warped scabbards, myself, but I've seen a great number of tight/loose, even cracked. Likewise for tsuka, and that solution goes the same way. I've seen a couple that were warped to the point where the blade wouldn't fit back in again without cutting up the inside. I think there was one case where a warped saya was fixed by soaking it in water and bending it back straight. more often it's the koiguchi fit that's the problem. too loose is annoying and too tight could wind up cracking the horn but both situations are super easy to fix. there are some climates and conditions that require both filing and shimming, depending on time of year or humidity level. just standard user maintenance. complete splits or cracks are obviously harder to fix and in the case of the lacquer cracking, you'd almost need to bring it all the way down and re-lacquer to fix it without it looking ugly.
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Post by zabazagobo on Mar 13, 2019 1:42:26 GMT
I've also had a few warped saya; one is barely noticeable, another was clearly warped and caused the koiguchi to eventually explode during iai (how's that for safety concerns?), and the third one was so hilariously awful it had to be replaced immediately since the sword couldn't even rest in the saya. This particularly bad saya had almost as much curve to the side as the sori did- I'm amazed the sword wasn't completely bent. I'd post pictures, but I just trashed that saya when I moved a few years ago since it was junk anyway.
I think the real problem is that inexpensive swords use inexpensive parts and...well, I think we all know the rest.
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Post by randomnobody on Mar 13, 2019 2:08:16 GMT
I think the real problem is that inexpensive swords use inexpensive parts and...well, I think we all know the rest. I do think that's about the sum of it, unfortunately.
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Post by csills2313 on Mar 13, 2019 21:39:45 GMT
However people love cheap stuff. As long as it is shiny and cheap people will always buy it.
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Post by randomnobody on Mar 13, 2019 21:50:31 GMT
You had me at shiny.
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Ifrit
Member
More edgy than a double edge sword
Posts: 3,284
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Post by Ifrit on Mar 14, 2019 21:06:58 GMT
You had me at shiny. Cheap is where I took note
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