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Post by vermithrax on Dec 23, 2017 1:31:30 GMT
That's my biggest fear about nihonto. Flaws. I know given the age of nihonto that is inevitable. But it comes with the territory. I'm not educated enough to know if a $5000+ nihonto pictured on a website is actually worth $5000+ after its purchased. Kinda risky but folks on here are more educated than me on the subject and are a big help. The Tiger Elite just might be the one. I just need to find a suitable wakizashi to go with it. I've got about a month to make up my mind. I'm in no rush. Getting the Guardian just pushed my standards up a lot I think. I could definitely see a Guardian raising the bar. ☺️. If you DO decide to look for a Nihonto, I am happy to help you find one that sings to you. I can help too ![:)](//storage.forums.net/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png)
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Post by johnwalter on Dec 23, 2017 16:01:02 GMT
4 grand for a Kaneie is rediculous imo. For any production blade,imo. The Kotetsu is cutter,you want to use it or collect it?Great quality blade and fittings,mount is usually poorly done and many will need work out of the box.From what I've seen. Several ways to go,but if I could consider a blade for 4grand,it wouldn't be a production run. Just my opinion
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Post by johnwalter on Dec 23, 2017 16:09:12 GMT
I just got rid of Kaneie Yama No Kumo.
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Post by johnbu on Dec 23, 2017 18:42:35 GMT
With a $4000 budget, why not commission an American smith to build you one with modern wonder steel to your exact specifications?
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Post by Jussi Ekholm on Dec 23, 2017 20:14:43 GMT
That's my biggest fear about nihonto. Flaws. I know given the age of nihonto that is inevitable. But it comes with the territory. I'm not educated enough to know if a $5000+ nihonto pictured on a website is actually worth $5000+ after its purchased. Kinda risky but folks on here are more educated than me on the subject and are a big help. Most likely you are not going to be able to get dealer prices from your items if you decide to sell them by yourself. Putting a value is a tricky thing and things are worth as much someone is willing to pay for it. There are some guidelines but it will mostly be case by case basis. Of course sometimes you might get lucky and make a good deal. However the good dealers know their market very well, so you most likely wont make any super finds.
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Post by jrock on Dec 23, 2017 21:35:33 GMT
All great info guys. I appreciate it.
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Post by jnikoley on Dec 27, 2017 15:45:11 GMT
I wouldn’t consider spending 3-4k on a production (Chinese) katana. If you want a nihonto, you can find them in that price range pretty regularly. Here’s an example I found after a five minute search: www.aoijapan.com/katana-bishu-osafune-sukesadaeiroku-4-nen-8-gatsu-hi-august-1561A couple years ago, I purchased my first nihonto. I took my time, and found a traditionally made katana with shirasaya and koshirae that shipped from Japan for around 2700.00. I would recommend taking your time and purchase from a dealer in Japan. I spent several months browsing until I found one I liked and was affordable. Be patient.
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Post by Verity on Dec 27, 2017 17:14:07 GMT
I wouldn’t consider spending 3-4k on a production (Chinese) katana. If you want a nihonto, you can find them in that price range pretty regularly. Here’s an example I found after a five minute search: www.aoijapan.com/katana-bishu-osafune-sukesadaeiroku-4-nen-8-gatsu-hi-august-1561A couple years ago, I purchased my first nihonto. I took my time, and found a traditionally made katana with shirasaya and koshirae that shipped from Japan for around 2700.00. I would recommend taking your time and purchase from a dealer in Japan. I spent several months browsing until I found one I liked and was affordable. Be patient. pretty decent price. Osafune was a good school. (I MIGHT be a bit biased though 😂)
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Post by Cottontail Customs on Dec 27, 2017 17:51:00 GMT
are you wanting to spend a small fortune on something that will sit in storage? why spend $4k on a bare blade nihonto that will cost at least another couple of grand to mount and still won't be useful for anything but looking at? or would you cut mats with a blade from the 16th century? if you want a sword to use, this kind of thing isn't it. if you want a really nice usable sword, spend far less than $4K and go with a high end production sword for like $800-$1,200 or less and spend the rest to customize it
Edit: unless you were looking for a display only sword. if that's the case, you still might want it mounted instead of a bare blade but a nice blade without major flaws, in nice koshirae, will probably cost a bit more than $4K
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Post by jnikoley on Dec 28, 2017 16:09:22 GMT
are you wanting to spend a small fortune on something that will sit in storage? why spend $4k on a bare blade nihonto that will cost at least another couple of grand to mount and still won't be useful for anything but looking at? or would you cut mats with a blade from the 16th century? if you want a sword to use, this kind of thing isn't it. if you want a really nice usable sword, spend far less than $4K and go with a high end production sword for like $800-$1,200 or less and spend the rest to customize it Edit: unless you were looking for a display only sword. if that's the case, you still might want it mounted instead of a bare blade but a nice blade without major flaws, in nice koshirae, will probably cost a bit more than $4K Since the OP stated his dream would be to own a Nihonto, I think he’d probably be happier with a traditionally made Japanese sword. I assume he’s considering spending 3k on a Chinese “Tamahagane” blade because he feels a Nihonto is out of reach for his budget. I can’t imagine he’s planning spending 3-4k on a sword used for cutting. I think he’d be happier and closer to the realization of his dream purchasing a low end Nihonto. Perhaps he doesn’t know, or is not aware he could find one in his budget. The link to the sword I posted was just an example of a Nihonto in his budget. I’m sure he could find a Gendaito with koshirae in his budget, perhaps something like this: www.samuraishokai.jp/sword/15126.htmlI picked that up for under $2500 USD. Although no art sword, it’s Nihonto with all the characteristics I look for: traditionally made Tamahagane with hada, niku, and an active hamon that Chinese “Tamahagane” blades so poorly (try to) mimic. I’ve seen many Gendaito like the one I purchased come up for sale for less than 3k. Occasionally, I’ve seen higher quality papered Nihonto available for only a little more.
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Post by zabazagobo on Dec 28, 2017 18:19:16 GMT
Since the OP stated his dream would be to own a Nihonto, I think he’d probably be happier with a traditionally made Japanese sword. I assume he’s considering spending 3k on a Chinese “Tamahagane” blade because he feels a Nihonto is out of reach for his budget. I can’t imagine he’s planning spending 3-4k on a sword used for cutting. I think he’d be happier and closer to the realization of his dream purchasing a low end Nihonto. Perhaps he doesn’t know, or is not aware he could find one in his budget. The link to the sword I posted was just an example of a Nihonto in his budget. I’m sure he could find a Gendaito with koshirae in his budget, perhaps something like this: www.samuraishokai.jp/sword/15126.htmlI picked that up for under $2500 USD. Although no art sword, it’s Nihonto with all the characteristics I look for: traditionally made Tamahagane with hada, niku, and an active hamon that Chinese “Tamahagane” blades so poorly (try to) mimic. I’ve seen many Gendaito like the one I purchased come up for sale for less than 3k. Occasionally, I’ve seen higher quality papered Nihonto available for only a little more. A little off topic, but wow is that a nice find, looks very similar to my 'ideal' archetype of a katana for one-handed use; nice length around 25 inches, healthy profile, nice tapering, really well done fittings, etc., etc.
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Post by jnikoley on Dec 28, 2017 19:19:13 GMT
Since the OP stated his dream would be to own a Nihonto, I think he’d probably be happier with a traditionally made Japanese sword. I assume he’s considering spending 3k on a Chinese “Tamahagane” blade because he feels a Nihonto is out of reach for his budget. I can’t imagine he’s planning spending 3-4k on a sword used for cutting. I think he’d be happier and closer to the realization of his dream purchasing a low end Nihonto. Perhaps he doesn’t know, or is not aware he could find one in his budget. The link to the sword I posted was just an example of a Nihonto in his budget. I’m sure he could find a Gendaito with koshirae in his budget, perhaps something like this: www.samuraishokai.jp/sword/15126.htmlI picked that up for under $2500 USD. Although no art sword, it’s Nihonto with all the characteristics I look for: traditionally made Tamahagane with hada, niku, and an active hamon that Chinese “Tamahagane” blades so poorly (try to) mimic. I’ve seen many Gendaito like the one I purchased come up for sale for less than 3k. Occasionally, I’ve seen higher quality papered Nihonto available for only a little more. A little off topic, but wow is that a nice find, looks very similar to my 'ideal' archetype of a katana for one-handed use; nice length around 25 inches, healthy profile, nice tapering, really well done fittings, etc., etc. Thanks. Like the OP, I had always wanted a Nihonto. I had assumed they were out of reach (price wise), and, like the OP, considered a Chinese “Tamahagane” katana. I’m glad I didn’t go that route, as my desire for a Nihonto would not have been satisfied with a non-japanese sword. Hopefully, the OP can see his desire for a Nihonto is more achievable than he might think. Unfortunately, it seems he is restricting himself by avoiding overseas sellers. I would say to him that the advantage of purchasing from a Japanese sword shop is he would have the peace of mind in knowing that it’s illegal in Japan to sell or possess a non traditionally made sword. I could have been duped into purchasing a fake Nihonto, but seing it shipped from Japan, gives me some piece of mind.
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Post by treeslicer on Dec 28, 2017 20:37:25 GMT
A little off topic, but wow is that a nice find, looks very similar to my 'ideal' archetype of a katana for one-handed use; nice length around 25 inches, healthy profile, nice tapering, really well done fittings, etc., etc. Thanks. Like the OP, I had always wanted a Nihonto. I had assumed they were out of reach (price wise), and, like the OP, considered a Chinese “Tamahagane” katana. I’m glad I didn’t go that route, as my desire for a Nihonto would not have been satisfied with a non-japanese sword. Hopefully, the OP can see his desire for a Nihonto is more achievable than he might think. Unfortunately, it seems he is restricting himself by avoiding overseas sellers. I would say to him that the advantage of purchasing from a Japanese sword shop is he would have the peace of mind in knowing that it’s illegal in Japan to sell or possess a non traditionally made sword. I could have been duped into purchasing a fake Nihonto, but seing it shipped from Japan, gives me some piece of mind. You definitely got a beauty, congratulations. I agree that buying direct from Japan produces many bargains (because their pricing criteria aren't those of Western sellers) and fewer worries about authenticity. I would point out, however, that one must be alert for Meiji-era tourist swords (garishly mounted crap), and fire damaged swords which have lost their hamon, as well as a very few rare WW II nontraditional blades that were legally registered under a loophole for items with familial sentimental value. OTOH, that last category may bag you a nice gunto for a fraction of what they bring over here. It all comes down to examining seller's photos with extreme care, and knowing what you are looking at.
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Post by seriouslee on Dec 28, 2017 21:03:26 GMT
Wife is E5?
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Post by seriouslee on Dec 28, 2017 21:04:14 GMT
For that much money I'd get a ticket to Tokyo and look around.
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Post by jnikoley on Dec 28, 2017 21:07:07 GMT
Thanks. Like the OP, I had always wanted a Nihonto. I had assumed they were out of reach (price wise), and, like the OP, considered a Chinese “Tamahagane” katana. I’m glad I didn’t go that route, as my desire for a Nihonto would not have been satisfied with a non-japanese sword. Hopefully, the OP can see his desire for a Nihonto is more achievable than he might think. Unfortunately, it seems he is restricting himself by avoiding overseas sellers. I would say to him that the advantage of purchasing from a Japanese sword shop is he would have the peace of mind in knowing that it’s illegal in Japan to sell or possess a non traditionally made sword. I could have been duped into purchasing a fake Nihonto, but seing it shipped from Japan, gives me some piece of mind. You definitely got a beauty, congratulations. I agree that buying direct from Japan produces many bargains (because their pricing criteria aren't those of Western sellers) and fewer worries about authenticity. I would point out, however, that one must be alert for Meiji-era tourist swords (garishly mounted crap), and fire damaged swords which have lost their hamon, as well as a very few rare WW II nontraditional blades that were legally registered under a loophole for items with familial sentimental value. OTOH, that last category may bag you a nice gunto for a fraction of what they bring over here. It all comes down to examining seller's photos with extreme care, and knowing what you are looking at. Thanks. I would definitely recommend doing your homework before purchasing what you believe to be a Nihonto. You should look for hada and be able to differentiate between hada types seen in real Nihonto vs the garrish damascus-eske hada seen on many non-Japanese swords. If you do only that, you could rule out almost all the bad ones. That said, there will always be a risk in anything worthwhile. Speaking for myself, I’d rather risk my money on a Nihonto than a copy of one, and I just don’t see the value in a copy priced at a point you could get the real thing.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2017 4:56:13 GMT
This is a good thread read. Blade Runner need Nihonto too. Must have at least one in lifetime.
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Post by treeslicer on Dec 30, 2017 8:31:31 GMT
Just for fun, and to maybe show what some of the big fuss about nihonto is about, take a look at the photo gallery (contains 93 pics) for this sword: www.nihonto.ca/soshu-yukimitsu/Don't just admire the hamon, look at the steel. That's the sort of texture that goes deeper than any fancy polish, though the polish brings it out. This sword is rated Tokubetsu Juyo, and would be worth well in excess of $100,000. This is as good as it gets.
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Post by Verity on Dec 30, 2017 16:37:30 GMT
Just for fun, and to maybe show what some of the big fuss about nihonto is about, take a look at the photo gallery (contains 93 pics) for this sword: www.nihonto.ca/soshu-yukimitsu/Don't just admire the hamon, look at the steel. That's the sort of texture that goes deeper than any fancy polish, though the polish brings it out. This sword is rated Tokubetsu Juyo, and would be worth well in excess of $100,000. This is as good as it gets. not sure if that was more than $100k. But maybe... Darcy may remember, I could ask him. But yes... I am well aware of what a GOOD blade looks like (*cough* Osafune Masamitsu *cough*) 😂
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Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2017 16:52:07 GMT
For that much money I'd get a ticket to Tokyo and look around. I just checked on round trip airline tickets from U.S. to Japan. Cheaper than I thought (approx $500 to $700). What an adventure that would be. Meet up with a sword expert and go to the shops and see and feel before buying. Tour sword sites/forges. Mega sake....this is going on my bucket list!!!!
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