pgandy
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Post by pgandy on Sept 15, 2017 22:06:20 GMT
My previous post stirred things up a bit. Let’s see what happens here as this is a new one on me and was wondering how many have heard of these. I am starting a new section in “Swordsmen of the British Empire” entitled “British India: The Sepoy Mutiny War” and have moved forward to the mid 19th century. The subject was given to Brig. Gen. John Nicholson by the Sikh nation. The brigadier was a renowned swordsman and this sword was said to be the best in India. He was given the choice of one of three swords presented and chose the straight bladed sword later stated to be a broad sword. Quoting from the book, “The best sword in India, an exaggeration, because many broadswords contained quicksilver or mercury an old device intended to make a sword cut tell heavily; i.e. when the sword descended, the heavy subtle fluid coursed swiftly downward and materially increased the momentum of the stroke.” It continues “The back of the blade is made hollow; and mercury, placed in the hilt, is carried towards the point in cutting, ...adding force to the cut.” There is a description by British historian R. Bosworth of the brigadier completely halving a man “with a blow slantwise on his shoulder”.
Has anyone knowledge of this type of sword?
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AndiTheBarvarian
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Post by AndiTheBarvarian on Sept 15, 2017 22:10:13 GMT
I've read of such a thing as an executioner's sword. Heavy and broad til the "tip", nothing to fight with. Perhaps from 16th Cent. Cold Steel?  |
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Post by Timo Nieminen on Sept 15, 2017 23:40:55 GMT
There are plenty of tales of mercury-filled swords. I know of no actual examples. The same claim of "increasing the force of the blow" is made for swords with moveable balls ("tears of the wounded" or "rolling pearls"), which are, however, too small to have any significant effect.
Another quote regarding the Nicholson sword:
"It may be mentioned here that Nicholson had the reputation of being one of the best swordsmen in India, and his sword had the credit of being the best sword in India. It was presented to him by the Sikh nation. Nicholson was invited to take his choice of three, and chose a straight one. Native swords are very seldom straight--they are generally curved. It was generally supposed that this sword was grooved inside and contained quicksilver, so as to increase the force of a direct blow."
Note that there doesn't appear to be any actual evidence that the sword contains mercury. Just a probably-wrong rumour about the sword.
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AndiTheBarvarian
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Post by AndiTheBarvarian on Sept 15, 2017 23:53:38 GMT
The idea of alterable/adjustable mass distribution is nice.
But the described way seems to be BS.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2017 0:01:57 GMT
If I recall correctly, the sword wielded by the protagonist of Gene Wolfe's Book of the New Sun series was weighted with mercury. Fictional, of course. That may be what Andi is thinking of.
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AndiTheBarvarian
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Post by AndiTheBarvarian on Sept 16, 2017 0:38:59 GMT
No, I think I've read about a real historical executioner's sword and I remember a picture, but I might be wrong.
Edit: I don't know those Gene Wolfe's novels, but it is possible that I've read about a myth which also was used by him.
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Post by Jordan Williams on Sept 16, 2017 0:52:33 GMT
Matt Easton had a video where he shows off an Indian short sword with tiny ball bearings in it. Didn't look too practical though.
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Post by legacyofthesword on Sept 16, 2017 0:56:25 GMT
I posted this on an older thread:
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Post by Jordan Williams on Sept 16, 2017 1:00:58 GMT
I posted this on an older thread: There we go! I remembered it as a Tulwar for some reason, though I think I may have seen that one online somewhere else. |
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Post by legacyofthesword on Sept 16, 2017 1:09:24 GMT
It's certainly a unique weapon! The ball bearing idea seems like it could have actually had an effect if done right (it obviously wasn't with this weapon).
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2017 2:45:13 GMT
That's quite the little beast. I could see ball bearings being a bit easier to implement into a sword blade than mercury... at least ball bearings wouldn't leak out if an opposing cut nicked through the containment tube.
I wonder what the best metal would be for the bearings. Iron and steel are the same density as the blade, so the effect might not be very large. Lead or gold could give a bigger change in the balance. (Bling points for using gold.)
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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2017 14:49:43 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2017 15:04:53 GMT
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AndiTheBarvarian
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Post by AndiTheBarvarian on Sept 17, 2017 16:29:33 GMT
I googled a bit and found several german sites mentioning executioner's swords with a hollow blade filled with quicksilver.
But there's no such historical sword existing, so it may be a myth.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2017 16:34:10 GMT
I googled a bit and found several german sites mentioning executioner's swords with a hollow blade filled with quicksilver. But there's no such historical sword existing, so it may be a myth. Post the links |
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AndiTheBarvarian
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Post by AndiTheBarvarian on Sept 17, 2017 16:53:07 GMT
It may sound stupid but that's very problematic with my phone browser, I can't copy and paste. I googled "richtschwert quecksilber" and found a book on google books "Handbuch der Waffenkunde", a text in de.wikisource.org "Aus den Rechtshallen des Mittelalters" and others. Here: de.academic.ru/dic.nsf/dewiki/1183349 |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2017 18:36:39 GMT
Thanks
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Post by 14thforsaken on Jul 28, 2024 5:37:12 GMT
Apology for the thread necromancy, but these blades are quite common in the Warhammer 40K book series. Several of their books I have read over the last year so have them. One example is the Catachan Devil Knife from the book Deathworlders. However these are all obviously fictional blades.
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Post by mrstabby on Jul 28, 2024 12:43:14 GMT
This reminds me of a "deadblow hammer", although the filling in these is to reduce bounce not impact energy.
I am not sure stuff like this would work though as advertized (probably why you can't find a lot of mentions, if it had worked only a little people would have gone crazy with it because people loved Mercury). You would need a relatively big pipe since Mercury has high surface tension it does not flow easily in millimeter sized pipes and would just stick at the tip end after a swing until you coax it back (think Mercury thermometer, whomever of you is old enough) and with a thick enough hollow (3mm or more), I imagine this would in fact be a pretty big weak spot especially in a bigger blade. And you would need a lot of moving Mercury as well to be able to feel it I think.
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Post by mrstabby on Jul 31, 2024 10:44:54 GMT
Me smat, me remember - 3 days later...
Not sure it does work better than a plain sword, his tests are not that conclusive... Does sound pretty cool, a war rattle?
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Herron's Flight by Brendan of Fable Blades
