Armour Class Franken-Rapiers Completed
May 7, 2017 15:56:49 GMT
Post by Afoo on May 7, 2017 15:56:49 GMT
OVERVIEW
While I am mainly a sabre guy, I do have an interest in complex hilt swords - rapiers, cut n thrusters etc. I like their elegant lines and suave sophistication. To that end I picked up a Windlass Munich and half-basket rapier from the forums.
While these swords are adequate, they lacked the spice and flair which I wanted - too....mainstream as it were. I also had some issues with the guards - the Windlass one bring a bit too small and confined, and the half-basket being, well, kinda ugly (no offence to Jenit). What I really wanted was a bespoke rapier from someone like Arms and Armour or Lutel, something which would stand out from the crowd. As many of us know however, there is a difference between wanting something and actually being willing to pay for it. Fortunately for me, there was a third option.
While the guard from the Windlass rapiers/munich were sub-optimal, their blades were actually very good. The Half Basket hilt rapier blade is narrow, but made of decently thick stock (6-7 mm) and has good stiffness throughout. The Munich is much thinner, but its sheer mass gives it a reasonable level of stiffness - it doesn't flop around like some of their other offerings and would be a perfectly suitable cutter had I chose to employ it as such. With this in mind, I commissioned a set of custom rapier guards from Armour Class.
Armour class (AC) has a good reputation for their basket hilt swords, and from the pictures on their website it seems well justified. In terms of rapiers I would rate them as being in the mid-range category - a step up from Hanwei and Windlass, but not to the level of Lutel. Putting them on par with Wulflund would not be an unfair to either party*. Unlike Wulflund however, Iain from Armour Class was more than happy to sell me the guards individually. Moreover, they were willing to customize the dimensions to fit the blades I had on hand. I picked up their Swepthilt rapier guard (17C2) and their English Rapier guard (17CE5) for 100 and 120 pounds respectively. They also threw in a set of grips and pommels for gratis, both of which were also built and machined to my specifications.
I placed the order back in February, and received them last week - a bit of a long wait, but within their specified wait time. I mounted them yesterday after some bodging and have the results to share today.
TOP: AC swept hilt guard + Windlass Munich blade, grips and pommel
MIDDLE: Original Munich Windlass guard + Hanwei practical rapier blade. Wood grip provided by AC. Pommel is standard fencing pommel
BOTTOM: AC English Rapier guard + Windlass half-basket rapier blade, grips and pommels
* Only with regards to rapiers. I do not have first hand experience with their basket hilts but they seem to be top notch in that field
Getting custom guards is like getting furniture from Ikea - they look great online, but there is always a bit of uncertainty - will they match the furniture I already have at home? Will the cat approve of them? In my case, the anxiety was not warranted, as the end result for both projects turned out very well. I was even able to use the leftover Munich guard to make a practice rapier so a nice bonus there.
SWEPT HILT GUARD
Of the two projects, this is by far my favorite. The larger guard and extra rings gives the Munich a much beefier, "brawler" appearance more in line with its historical usage as a law enforcement or cavalry weapon. The guard is also much wider (5.5 inches vs 4.75 on the munich) which gives you more room to play with while enhancing protection for the back of the hand.
Extra hand protection - AC (top) and Munich (bottom)
One of the complains I have heard from Uhlan and others is that the front facing rings are a bit too small, making it difficult to get your fingers in their in a hurry. The extra space available in the AC guard addresses this problem, and contributes to overall comfort. The quillon block is also thinner, which further enhances comfort and maneuverability.
Extra room for fingering the ricasso - AC (left) vs Munich (right).
One of the problem I had with this guard was that it seemed a bit squashed - the inside branches bulge out a bit to give it an ovoid appearance. I did have to make a last minute change in specifications due to a miscommunication so that could have been the cause. Its not horrible, but may irk those who are on the more OCD side of the spectrum. The top branch also bumps into my thumb, though that again could have been due to Iain having to accommodate the last minute change in specifications.
The flattened ovoid shape of the AC vs the Munich
Guard branches of the AC interfering with the thumb
English Rapier
The English Rapier Guard has a much more gentlemanly/womanly feel to it - its more refined and versatile, and would be at home on either a military or a civilian weapon. It does look a bit more spherical than the images on the AC website suggest, which mirrors some of the criticism of their Pappenheimer rapier (see last post in this thread). I think it looks find on the English Rapier hilt. I hope to eventually throw the Hanwei blade on this guard and use it for sparing so extra hand protection is always welcome. The inside of the guard is spacious both behind and infront of the quillons. The guard does come a bit close to the outside of my hand, so individuals with larger hand sizes may want to be careful.
Overall Comments/Practical Considerations
The build quality for both these pieces is exceptional - everything is cleanly welded and well finished (images below showing details of welds and assembly technique). The English Rapier in particular has some nice accents which give it a quality feel. One critique about the AC line of rapiers is that their manufacturing techniques are too "modern", and lacks the feel of a true period antique. This might be a valid criticism for a $600 or $750 piece, but at this price point I am happy with some spot welding - especially for a semi-custom piece. The construction is precise and shows a lot of love and care, and is certainly ahead of what you get from Windlass. As I mentioned before, the price point is a comfortable intermediate between Windlass and higher end manufacturers such as Lutel or Arms and Armour. 100 pounds for a guard alone is a bit steep for some, but if you have extra blades around its not bad. In my case the old Munich guard went to my Hanwei sparing rapier so I got some residual value from that
Keen eyed observers may note some scratches on the surface - I assure you that those are not reflective of the state these guards arrived in, but rather of my skills with a Dremel, which brings me to the largest and most important caveat...bodging
When I ordered these guards, I provided Iain with the tang dimensions and blade measurements, ad he kindly made the guards to fit as best he can. Problem is that any custom piece will be limited by the accuracy of my measurements, compounded by the accuracy of his instruments. Without the actual blades in hand. Iain can try his best, but there will always be some mismatch. As such, I had no expectations that the guards would fit my blades without some final filing and grinding, and I was right. It took about 3 hours with a Dremel to get everything to fit, though in fairness it would have taken much shorter had I provided better measurements (the threaded portion of the Munich tang is much thicker than at the blade - I totally forgot to take that into account. Ended up having to essentially re-bore the entire middle of the guard to accommodate this anomaly).
I would not call this a criticism, since I expected this from the start. I do want to bring it up as a caveat though for those who want to try this themselves.
Overall, I would recommend armour class for anyone wishing to undertake such a project. The staff have been very accommodating, and their price point compares very favorably with those of Darkwood Armory, and the quality and aesthetics outmatch the custom rapier offerings from BKS IMO. Just be aware that some filing and grinding will be required on your part to get everything to fit.
Close up views of construction. Full res images available here
While I am mainly a sabre guy, I do have an interest in complex hilt swords - rapiers, cut n thrusters etc. I like their elegant lines and suave sophistication. To that end I picked up a Windlass Munich and half-basket rapier from the forums.
While these swords are adequate, they lacked the spice and flair which I wanted - too....mainstream as it were. I also had some issues with the guards - the Windlass one bring a bit too small and confined, and the half-basket being, well, kinda ugly (no offence to Jenit). What I really wanted was a bespoke rapier from someone like Arms and Armour or Lutel, something which would stand out from the crowd. As many of us know however, there is a difference between wanting something and actually being willing to pay for it. Fortunately for me, there was a third option.
While the guard from the Windlass rapiers/munich were sub-optimal, their blades were actually very good. The Half Basket hilt rapier blade is narrow, but made of decently thick stock (6-7 mm) and has good stiffness throughout. The Munich is much thinner, but its sheer mass gives it a reasonable level of stiffness - it doesn't flop around like some of their other offerings and would be a perfectly suitable cutter had I chose to employ it as such. With this in mind, I commissioned a set of custom rapier guards from Armour Class.
Armour class (AC) has a good reputation for their basket hilt swords, and from the pictures on their website it seems well justified. In terms of rapiers I would rate them as being in the mid-range category - a step up from Hanwei and Windlass, but not to the level of Lutel. Putting them on par with Wulflund would not be an unfair to either party*. Unlike Wulflund however, Iain from Armour Class was more than happy to sell me the guards individually. Moreover, they were willing to customize the dimensions to fit the blades I had on hand. I picked up their Swepthilt rapier guard (17C2) and their English Rapier guard (17CE5) for 100 and 120 pounds respectively. They also threw in a set of grips and pommels for gratis, both of which were also built and machined to my specifications.
I placed the order back in February, and received them last week - a bit of a long wait, but within their specified wait time. I mounted them yesterday after some bodging and have the results to share today.
TOP: AC swept hilt guard + Windlass Munich blade, grips and pommel
MIDDLE: Original Munich Windlass guard + Hanwei practical rapier blade. Wood grip provided by AC. Pommel is standard fencing pommel
BOTTOM: AC English Rapier guard + Windlass half-basket rapier blade, grips and pommels
* Only with regards to rapiers. I do not have first hand experience with their basket hilts but they seem to be top notch in that field
Getting custom guards is like getting furniture from Ikea - they look great online, but there is always a bit of uncertainty - will they match the furniture I already have at home? Will the cat approve of them? In my case, the anxiety was not warranted, as the end result for both projects turned out very well. I was even able to use the leftover Munich guard to make a practice rapier so a nice bonus there.
SWEPT HILT GUARD
Of the two projects, this is by far my favorite. The larger guard and extra rings gives the Munich a much beefier, "brawler" appearance more in line with its historical usage as a law enforcement or cavalry weapon. The guard is also much wider (5.5 inches vs 4.75 on the munich) which gives you more room to play with while enhancing protection for the back of the hand.
Extra hand protection - AC (top) and Munich (bottom)
One of the complains I have heard from Uhlan and others is that the front facing rings are a bit too small, making it difficult to get your fingers in their in a hurry. The extra space available in the AC guard addresses this problem, and contributes to overall comfort. The quillon block is also thinner, which further enhances comfort and maneuverability.
Extra room for fingering the ricasso - AC (left) vs Munich (right).
One of the problem I had with this guard was that it seemed a bit squashed - the inside branches bulge out a bit to give it an ovoid appearance. I did have to make a last minute change in specifications due to a miscommunication so that could have been the cause. Its not horrible, but may irk those who are on the more OCD side of the spectrum. The top branch also bumps into my thumb, though that again could have been due to Iain having to accommodate the last minute change in specifications.
The flattened ovoid shape of the AC vs the Munich
Guard branches of the AC interfering with the thumb
English Rapier
The English Rapier Guard has a much more gentlemanly/womanly feel to it - its more refined and versatile, and would be at home on either a military or a civilian weapon. It does look a bit more spherical than the images on the AC website suggest, which mirrors some of the criticism of their Pappenheimer rapier (see last post in this thread). I think it looks find on the English Rapier hilt. I hope to eventually throw the Hanwei blade on this guard and use it for sparing so extra hand protection is always welcome. The inside of the guard is spacious both behind and infront of the quillons. The guard does come a bit close to the outside of my hand, so individuals with larger hand sizes may want to be careful.
Overall Comments/Practical Considerations
The build quality for both these pieces is exceptional - everything is cleanly welded and well finished (images below showing details of welds and assembly technique). The English Rapier in particular has some nice accents which give it a quality feel. One critique about the AC line of rapiers is that their manufacturing techniques are too "modern", and lacks the feel of a true period antique. This might be a valid criticism for a $600 or $750 piece, but at this price point I am happy with some spot welding - especially for a semi-custom piece. The construction is precise and shows a lot of love and care, and is certainly ahead of what you get from Windlass. As I mentioned before, the price point is a comfortable intermediate between Windlass and higher end manufacturers such as Lutel or Arms and Armour. 100 pounds for a guard alone is a bit steep for some, but if you have extra blades around its not bad. In my case the old Munich guard went to my Hanwei sparing rapier so I got some residual value from that
Keen eyed observers may note some scratches on the surface - I assure you that those are not reflective of the state these guards arrived in, but rather of my skills with a Dremel, which brings me to the largest and most important caveat...bodging
When I ordered these guards, I provided Iain with the tang dimensions and blade measurements, ad he kindly made the guards to fit as best he can. Problem is that any custom piece will be limited by the accuracy of my measurements, compounded by the accuracy of his instruments. Without the actual blades in hand. Iain can try his best, but there will always be some mismatch. As such, I had no expectations that the guards would fit my blades without some final filing and grinding, and I was right. It took about 3 hours with a Dremel to get everything to fit, though in fairness it would have taken much shorter had I provided better measurements (the threaded portion of the Munich tang is much thicker than at the blade - I totally forgot to take that into account. Ended up having to essentially re-bore the entire middle of the guard to accommodate this anomaly).
I would not call this a criticism, since I expected this from the start. I do want to bring it up as a caveat though for those who want to try this themselves.
Overall, I would recommend armour class for anyone wishing to undertake such a project. The staff have been very accommodating, and their price point compares very favorably with those of Darkwood Armory, and the quality and aesthetics outmatch the custom rapier offerings from BKS IMO. Just be aware that some filing and grinding will be required on your part to get everything to fit.
Close up views of construction. Full res images available here