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Post by AlvaroWang on Nov 11, 2015 2:23:53 GMT
I am sorry to bring to this lovely/lively forum some deep sadness that I am feeling right now. But this forum provides me with just the right amount of anonymity and closeness (?) where I may feel comfortable sharing this... Haters and trolls are welcome to chime in at will...
Fitting in is hard for me and never really craved to fit in anywhere... And it is fine by me... I never really wished to amount to anything, never thought I would... So I have glimpses of energy, when I wish to accomplish something alternated with deep inertia. And it is fine by me. I am a mama's boy, my parents have enough that I cannot die from starvation or any simple disease that might kill the less fortunate. And so I keep living hoping that the glimpses of light bring me somewhere. And it is fine by me... Lately I've been so weird that I am avoiding every one of my relatives and friends, the rare times they actually catch me at home and start a conversation I do not avoid it, but I feel a tremendous lack of connection to most human beings. I cannot feel empathy anymore to their problems nor anybody else's. Some people call laziness, some people call it first world problems... And it is fine by me...
But I got this friend... Man... this guy understands me, he feels the same way... He acts the same way, last time I saw him I even joked because it felt like looking at a mirror. But there is a catch... He got some mad serious depression that no medication in the world can fix, but from time to time he would surface from his torpor when the meds kick in. But he is not being able to resurface again... Me and some friends desperately try getting him off his bed, to talk, to do some stuff he loves... But he keeps shutting us off, saying stuff like he is waiting to die because he is much of a coward to do it himself.
Just... just... so many questions... so many doubts... What the hell is going on? Why the hell can't he stand up? What the hell can I do to help? Why can't he just deal with it and be fine that he gets depressed and powerless from time to time? Am I ever going to go downhill like him? Will I lose my best friend? I've had suicidal thoughts in the past... but c'mon... this is something else... Feels like if he does die I am going to be really alone in this land...
I know we are not supposed to bring religion into here, and I hope you can forgive me... But.... If there is a god he is a sadistic #*&% From the bottom of my heart, with all the energy that is in me I hope someday I can look at this thread and be so embarrassed that I ever felt the need to do it...
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Post by Adrian Jordan on Nov 11, 2015 2:52:31 GMT
I can relate to this feeling, and I think that there are probably a lot of others who can as well. Depression can hit for a lot of reasons, and we don't often have any control of them. You or your friend could have a chemical imbalance. Nothing you can do to predict that short of constant tests of your hormone and chemical balances. Low testosterone can bring on depression that has led to suicide, and is rarely tested in patients getting seen for depression, can happen for many reasons, and anti depressants don't touch it. Everybody is wired differently, so there is no way to say for certain without tests if it is an emotional or physical disturbance. However, it really needs to be known which it is or if it is a combination of both that is bringing the depression on to effectively treat it. If it is an emotional issue, then the problem needs to be rooted out and addressed, which is something that needs professional assistance for the majority of people. People are amazingly good at hiding things from themselves, and you wouldn't necessarily be able to spot the issue if your mind is actively trying to keep it buried. Add to that our aversion to admitting these kinds of things to friends and/or relatives out of a sense of hopelessness or embarrassment or both. Not seeking treatment is as sure a way as any to ensure you are and stay miserable. I'd recommend getting a blood test to screen your chemical/hormonal levels, and perhaps speak to a mental health professional. I would extend that to your friend. Best of luck to you both.
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Post by gerrye on Nov 11, 2015 3:38:30 GMT
Adrian just expressed what I've been trying to formulate far better than I could have done.
I have to take strong anti-depressants for this particular drug's side-effect which mitigates neuropathic pain. My brain basically has a firmware issue and my nerves are constantly firing pain signals. Brains are complicated bits of kit and there is so much that can go wrong without any outwardly obvious cause and with effects so subtle that they are easily attributed to girl/work/family troubles. When you really can't find any issue to put those effects down to it can be too easy to try and ignore altogether, when sometimes the issue is something that can be remedied.
Social stigma, worries about presription happy medicoes or even employment considerations have all stopped people getting the high quality help that is out there. What Adrian said about testosterone made me suddenly remember a recently announced study that has shown that men have monthly hormone cycles the same as women do, and the problems disrupted cycles can cause women is well known. There are loads of women having HRT (hormone replacement therapy) which may mean that there are also loads of guys out there who need the same help.
I really do recommend you to see someone, on your terms, but a useful first step would be to keep a diary of how you feel for a few weeks, just to see if a pattern emerges but your notes will be useful to whichever person you do seek help from.
I wish you all the best. Even the fact that you're asking a bunch of swordy enthusiasts is a positive step as you're asking for help. There are docs out there who can help you work out who you really need to ask for help. If your friend sees you getting helped it may even encourage him to reach out too. Good luck mate.
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Post by Adrian Jordan on Nov 11, 2015 4:06:10 GMT
Two great points I missed, gerrye. Sorry for the lapse.
The diary/journal is a great idea. It has a negative stigma attached to it for guys, and can be difficult to institute on yourself normally, let alone as a place to write down things you'd rather not even think about. Consider it a diagnostic tool, the first step in applying a measured, clinical approach to an issue that is extremely chaotic and massively difficult to force a frame on.
Second was the side effects of medication. The right medication can cure your ills, the wrong can plunge you deeper that you thought you'd possibly be able to go. You wouldn't think that a medication for depression could bring it on or worsen it, but it can. That's why I feel that you should consider both a physical and mental evaluation.
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Post by Croccifixio on Nov 11, 2015 6:18:43 GMT
Don't feel embarassed asking for help here. I mean, yeah we're already a "weird" community to begin with, so we take what we can get from each other. Honestly, the sword community is much more heartfelt and has more wisdom than, say, the academic community, or the legal community even, or the video game community.
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Post by MOK on Nov 11, 2015 7:09:48 GMT
Chronic depression is a hell of a thing. It's like cancer of the soul.
There were times in my teens where I'd hold a knife to my throat or stare at a bottle of pills, imagining what it would feel like and the nothing that'd follow, just because always feeling miserable and apathetic for no reason was so exhausting and impossible to explain in a way that wouldn't make me sound like a whiny layabout, and I was seriously beginning to believe that's what I was and that life was like this for everyone but only I was weak and ungrateful enough to mind... And the only reason I didn't go through with it - I'll reach out through the phone lines and slap the first one who laughs, I swear! - was that there'd be no more Metal. Ronnie James Dio literally saved my life and I never even got to meet the guy.
I'm not going to say it's gotten better with age, that'd be a lie, but I am learning to live with it. Getting diagnosed and knowing what's going on with my brain, that there's actually something wrong and it's not just me being a shiftless wuss, helped a whole lot.
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Post by AlvaroWang on Nov 11, 2015 9:22:58 GMT
Tks for reaching out, guys. I really appreciate it.
Some years ago I was consulting a shrink and he sent me to a psychiatrist, started taking antidepressants and other stuff. I kinda got bothered when the only measure he took when I actually attempted suicide was to take me off of the med I uswd to do it and nothing else. I understand him, but since I was already feeling better enough to try and live I quit seeing the shrink and psychiatrist altogether. I hope to search other people next year (in a month or two anyway).
I've never heard about the testosterone test, I will look into it (even though I made a fertility test and I am ok, but I guess they are not the same).
The thing is that except for my distrust of the people around me, I am being able to go on with life.
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Post by AlvaroWang on Nov 11, 2015 9:24:30 GMT
[quote author=" MOK" source="/post/639882/thread" timestamp="1447225788" I'm not going to say it's gotten better with age, that'd be a lie, but I am learning to live with it. Getting diagnosed and knowing what's going on with my brain, that there's actually something wrong and it's not just me being a shiftless wuss, helped a whole lot.[/quote] It sucks to hear that... I hoped that it would go away eventually
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Post by MOK on Nov 11, 2015 10:47:04 GMT
It might! You're not me. And while my issues will never go away, I do keep getting better at handling them. I'm a much happier person than I used to be! And ultimately, to cite one cool dude, I've got rock 'n' roll It satisfies my soul And if that's all there is It ain't so bad ROCK 'N' ROLL!
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Post by demonskull on Nov 11, 2015 11:04:44 GMT
Regarding depression getting better or going away completely, it does in most people. I battled depression 25 years ago for about 6 months. Eventually , before doing anything stupid, I saw the light at the end of the tunnel and just kept heading toward it. There were good days and bad days and it took a concerted effort, but eventually I got out of it.
Talking to someone about it is the best thing. Whether it's a professional or a group of others suffering from depression or just someone you have no personal relationship to who is receptive to the conversation. Trying to talk to close family and friends is extremely hard to do, someone objective is much easier on you.
Take care and reach out to someone.
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Scott
Member
Posts: 1,680
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Post by Scott on Nov 11, 2015 12:56:29 GMT
You might want to look into the possibility that you're bipolar. Your friend too. Bipolar is often misdiagnosed as depression, and when medication is given as if it's depression it tends to make it worse. That you can talk about it, and are aware that something is wrong, is a good start.
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Post by LG Martial Arts on Nov 11, 2015 18:32:49 GMT
Depression is a disease that strikes many people across the globe... some have mild depression, others severe depression, but because of social stigmas, men are seen as being a "wuss" for being depressed, having to "man up". Women are seen as frail creatures who are giving into their femininity. Bull. Like others have mentioned, depression can be short lived, or can last a lifetime... you can't just walk it off. Check out the comic below, and then the vid linked to afterwards
AsapSCIENCE have a great video on the science of depression, check it out here: bit.ly/1uiI3wK
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Post by LG Martial Arts on Nov 11, 2015 18:36:22 GMT
You might want to look into the possibility that you're bipolar. Your friend too. Bipolar is often misdiagnosed as depression, and when medication is given as if it's depression it tends to make it worse. That you can talk about it, and are aware that something is wrong, is a good start. Very true... my wife was diagnosed at a young age with depression, but it wasn't until her late 30's that she was diagnosed as having type 2 bipolar disorder (the toughest one to have/treat). Like Scott said, I would definitely ask the dr about checking for bipolar disorder since the meds for "regular" depression (if you can even call it that) can have a detrimental impacts on people with bipolar disorder.
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Post by gerrye on Nov 11, 2015 19:35:50 GMT
A friend of mine found this video helpful. It's demonstrative that Fry wasn't diagnosed with bipolar disorder until well into his forties.
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Post by Adrian Jordan on Nov 11, 2015 21:54:33 GMT
I've never heard about the testosterone test, I will look into it (even though I made a fertility test and I am ok, but I guess they are not the same). It can also be something else that you don't have enough of or too much of. There's a slew of hormones and chemicals in the brain and body, and it's easy to knock one off or jack up production. Estrogen, epitestosterone, cortisol, there's a whole bunch, and it all needs to be in balance. A head trauma can cause testosterone to bottom out, even if it was relatively slight and happened years ago. Like others said too, it can come and hit like a ton of bricks, and then go so fast it's like it never happened. Sometimes it comes back, sometimes it never does. Here's an episode of Joe Rogan's podcast with Dr. Mark Gordon and a retired Navy SEAL. The SEAL got depressed, drove his wife away and then attempted suicide, all while on a bunch of medications for it. It's long, but has a lot of good information as far as the testosterone angle is concerned.
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Post by AlvaroWang on Nov 11, 2015 22:07:59 GMT
Wow guys, thank you so much for caring. About the possible diagnosis, I'll have to wait and talk to the specialists, but the heads up will be useful to discuss it with them.
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Post by Adrian Jordan on Nov 11, 2015 22:18:22 GMT
It's our pleasure, my man. It's always best to have a little knowledge going in. Worst thing that happens is that you find out a few things it's not on the way to finding out what it is.
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Post by MOK on Nov 11, 2015 23:39:21 GMT
Like others have mentioned, depression can be short lived, or can last a lifetime... you can't just walk it off. Indeed, that'd be very much - hell, EXACTLY like trying to walk off a broken leg. Depression is a disease. It's a real thing. It can be completely debilitating, every bit as much as physically crippled limbs. It is in your head, technically, but not just in your imagination. IT'S REAL. Feel free to smack anyone who claims otherwise with a salmon.
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Post by AlvaroWang on Nov 12, 2015 3:04:04 GMT
Yeah, thanks again, friends
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Post by bigpete on Nov 12, 2015 8:07:29 GMT
I lost my best mate to depression/suicide and I nearly followed him ,only thing that stopped me was my infant son. I'm now on antidepressants after having a breakdown at work. They have helped me immensely to cope with the sense of guilt,loss and helplessness that my friends death has left me with. Just know that you can talk to people and that its not your fault no matter what happens,and try to be there for your friend as best you can
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