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Post by A capella on Nov 5, 2013 0:58:51 GMT
I have recently come across a cavalry saber of which I have really no clue as to what it is about; all I am told is that it is a reproduction cavalry saber, which anybody could really figure out, but I liked it, so I got it. Unfortunately, it had several problems. I believe it is genuine carbon steel; it more or less survived me walloping it on wooden blocks, and could bend about five inches(which was as far as I was willing to bend it), although it is completely blunt, and the problems are numerous: 1. The blade is somewhat pitted; a great deal right at the tip, and here and there along the blade. Brasso, applied liberally, cleared away some of it, but I lack the skills to restore it. 2. The handle is just in a terrible state. Wire had been wrapped along the handle but has almost entirely come off; parts which I don't even know the name to are falling off; the handle is tarnishing; most importantly, the tang has come loose. It does not feel as though the blade will fly out at the slightest swing, and it indeed has not, but it is in terrible shape, and I would like to see it restored. I am coming to this forum to ask where I might be able to send it to where I could get it fixed, and if at all possible, some information on what it might be a replica of, if anything. Thanks; pix are attached. For reference, I live in central Pennsylvania.
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Post by A capella on Nov 5, 2013 1:23:52 GMT
Oops. I guess this should go under the sword repair section.
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Post by Dave Kelly on Nov 5, 2013 2:44:48 GMT
This is a type 32 Japanese Sabre from the thrun of the 19/20th Century. Were cavalry swords in the Russo-Japanese War then recycled as noncom swords in WWII.
I'm not an expert on these by any means and can't tell you if this is antique or replica. I suspect a replica. There are several available on the market. If it is a replica you can buy a new one for what it will cost you to repair this one.
Luck with the search. SOmeone more versed in oriental swords can comment on authenticity.
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Uhlan
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Posts: 3,121
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Post by Uhlan on Nov 5, 2013 6:06:01 GMT
Looks like a Kyo Gunto to me and a good one, looking at the silver Mon on the backstrap and the detailing. Stop wacking this one please, untill you sorted out some things first. Go to this site: www.k3.dion.ne.jp/~j-gunto/gunto_135.htmand find out which type it is supposed to be. They had Dress, Police, Colonial, Cavalry variants. Long blade, so not Dress. Cavalry is a good guess. Do not see a locking pin and to get the hilt of is tricky, because the flowery bit on the backstrap ears could be the pin, so looking at tang marks could cost you. What is the grip material? Does not have to be natural like bone, could be bakelite ( early cellulose chemical compound, very hard, not plastic.) Also go to Google Images and type: Kyu Gunto, Cavalry, Japanese. Look at the detailing on the hilt. Chinese copies are allways off with that. This looks like the real deal, or it is the best copy I ever saw. The above mentioned site is the best, not easy to navigate, but the best info. Good luck!
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Post by A capella on Nov 5, 2013 11:49:02 GMT
Well, well! I had assumed what I had was some cheap-o reproduction of a US Civil War saber, I never even thought it could possibly be a Japanese saber. Now I feel dumb for whacking it about(I suppose I should). Here are some more pictures of the hilt and the scabbard:
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Uhlan
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Posts: 3,121
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Post by Uhlan on Nov 5, 2013 13:37:00 GMT
How's the condition of the scabbard? Any signs of use? Look at the lower portion for spur damage, like dents. The carrying ring, is the plating 100% or is the iron coming through in spots? On the side were the scabbard should have been in contact with clothing, day in, day out, any wear? Look for a part under the ring where the scabbard must have been grabbed when drawing the sword, is there any wear to the plating? Please go looking at the site I posted and do research before counting yourself rich. Thus far the sword looks okay to me, but that scabbard looks plenty shiny. Could have been fixed and replated though. Or replaced with a new replica Western one. No use looking for tang marks, the blade is peened. Any marks on the ricasso? Or the scabbard? I dunno about that peen. Go look for it at the site or at pictures from dealers of these swords. Suspence! :mrgreen: Edit: That little flowery bit on the backstrap and the backstrap ears has 10 leaves, so definitly Army, not Police, who had only 5. Poor sods. Edit 2: Found it. Go here: home.earthlink.net/~steinrl/civilian.htmSecond picture from the top. Army parade sabre. Chrome plated blade, machine made. So, scabbard would not have seen much field use. Maybe stainless blade too. Is it magnetic? The bronze hilt would have been gilded. Look for gilding in the deep spots. For value you have to shop around at the antiques dealers on the net. looks a lot like a Western cavalry sabre, hence confusion. :mrgreen: Trow ,, Japanese Army parade sabre'' in Google Images. Please keep us posted will you? Good luck, Ulahn.
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Post by A capella on Nov 5, 2013 21:29:10 GMT
I don't pretend to know what I should be looking for, so here are some more pictures of the scabbard. The blade, by the way, is magnetic. The metal scabbard is in mostly good quality - a few spots here and there are pitted, and there are a few stains from stuff dropped on it(I presume) that I have not gotten around to wiping off. There appear to be no marks of regular usage - I think it is safe to assume that this was hung up on a wall(or left in the attic) and promptly forgotten for a good long time. The back of the hilt looks as though it might have been rubbing against someone's palm, however. And no, there is nothing on the ricasso.
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Uhlan
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Posts: 3,121
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Post by Uhlan on Nov 5, 2013 22:54:44 GMT
Hi. Well it being an Army parade sabre, it would not have seen heavy use. Thanks for the pictures. Marks from the left hand resting on the backstrap are normal. Did you Google around a bit yet? I thought I'd seen some rusting going on at the drag? If so, make a pointy bit out of crumpled aluminium foil and put a small drop of oil on those spots and start rubbing with the compressed alu. Red rust will come off without damage to the plating. Also good for the blade. Clean it with acetone or alcohol and oil it with mineral oil, sewing machine oil will do nicely. Stand the scabbard with the mouth down in a dry environment to have the inside dryed out and slap it with your hand to see whether there is any loose debris in there. Maybe go in with a long pointy something. So the blade is steel. Good for you. Hope you will find enough info from the sites I posted and from Google Images. Repairing the loose wiring will be difficult since the hilt is peened. Be carefull not to damage it any further. If you have a magnifier you could look for pores in the grip. If it has little pores it is bone, Cheers, Ulahn.
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