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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2012 9:18:22 GMT
Hi. I am new to Chinese swords but not so much to Katanas, I am also a 'knife nut' of many years standing so sharp pointy things are not too much od a mystery to me. I have messed around in various martial arts since the '70s and recently I started to teach myself Escrima, a sword based martial art. Having made myself some sticks in various lengths and weights and then developed enough skill not to keep knocking myself flat it suddenly occurred to me that I should really be able to use swords as well to do justice to the art and in order to perfect orientation of the hands as without sharp edges you don't have to worry so much about precise technique. I live in Ibiza Spain and despise most of the swords they produce here now, so I thought I would have a look at what was available in the martial arts world. I was initially looking for Twin Short Jian as I had a pair of originals in the UK some years ago and similar would have been perfect for what I had in mind. Most of what is sold by MA suppliers is overpriced rubbish, I had a look at the Tai Chi Swords at a local very good Tai Chi class and the swords they were selling for a little under 200 euros weren't fit to hang on a Christmas tree. After 5 weeks of searching the internet with a budget in mind I came up with two Short Daos in high carbon 1095, not what I had originally intended but safer with a single edge and affordable at $65 each! in euros that is cheap . The company: Gokni www.goknives.com/Ware_Detail.asp?Id=2241 and the knives are at the link, they have been excellent so far to deal with replying overnight to every question. The Dao are en route as I speak so when they arrive I will update as to quality and usefulness, if these work out I will possible get a pair of slightly longer Jian this company has on it' catalogue but I want to see if the value for money and function is good enough first. Please excuse a long first post! Here is part two; As the Dao were cheaper than I expected I thought I would have a look for a full sized Jian to practice Tai Chi with so I found this www.japanese-sword.co.uk/index.p ... cts_id=309, it is sold as razor sharp which remains to be seen as what I call razor sharp and manufacturers call razor sharp is often nowhere near the same but as I am intending to use it for Tai Chi very sharp is not such a good thing. I like the appearance as far as personal taste goes plus I am told and from the position of the peg in the pic's the sword has a substantial tang. Also the site insists that they only sell genuine sword and post a video off cutting tests on the site. If the sword is this good then it will be a bargain, if it isn't well, I hadn't planned on going into battle with it anyway. The service from this company has also been excellent so far and as soon as the sword arrives I will post pics and give a review of my purchases. Thank you for an excellent informative forum which has helped to guide my purchases. Attachments:
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Post by aussie-rabbit on Oct 19, 2012 12:08:00 GMT
Welcome to the forum. I do think describing Escrima, as a sword based martial art is selling the people of the Philippines a bit short. There is some good info on the Wiki here. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EskrimaThe only way to really understand your purchase is to disassemble and inspect, if you use a photobucket account you can post pictures directly like this.  The Jian page you link to shows one sword while describing another along with the specs of a third. The top of the page states: "Folded Steel 20" Blade Chinese Sword YUE Dynasty JIAN" while the photo shows something different and the specs state. Overall Length: 104 cm / 40.9 inch - Blade Length: 73 cm / 28.7 inch I have no knowledge of shopping in the UK but I am always wary of statements such as "Dragon Spring Swords are praised as "The Best Swords Under The Sun", - Looking forward to your reviews! |
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Post by aussie-rabbit on Oct 19, 2012 12:25:49 GMT
Their cutting video on youtube includes some stirring Chinese music, I wonder if our Chinese speaking members can give us a translation.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2012 14:28:22 GMT
Thanks for your replies. Aussie rabbit; I realise that this is a case of 'suck it and see' ! I fully intend to look into every last nook and cranny of my purchases as that is what I do. I thought the prices were low enough that I could test the water at the same time as having something to get me going. I will go back and have a look at the links, that was probably my fault. My reasons for posting was that I have not seen these companies mentioned here and if they turn out to be good value for money or not I can at least post that info' too as I notice a lot of people here are on a budget and everyone likes good value for money if it is there to be found. I really only know what I have found out in the last 5 or 6 weeks about Chinese swords as opposed to Japanese which I have owned a few genuine examples of in the past. When I taught Shotokan karate in the '70s my mate and I used to entertain our students by throwing potatoes at each other and cutting them out of the air, I bet I can't do that any more! The link for the jian is ; www.japanese-sword.co.uk/index.p ... cts_id=309 I have to say it was a bit of a worry to see them describe a full length sword as 20" but it looks not too bad, we'll see how wrong I am when it arrives . |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2012 14:42:28 GMT
Ah! Excuse me I forgot to mention Escrima. The word is borrowed from the Spanish word Esgrima;fencing.
Tagalog is a mix of Filipino,English and Spanish word with a few others thrown in.
The Spanish when they were masters of The Phillipines ban the Natives from sword ownership so they adapted their art to sticks. Strictly speaking Escrima is only one facet of the total of Filipino Martial Arts know as Arnis there and Kali in the west.
There are various forms using the different edged weapons of the Phillipines including the Bolo and Kampong, the Bolo is usually fairly short and the Kampong can be a long heavy very scary cutting weapon.
The techniques, to my eyes at least seem to share a great deal with some of the Silat styles of Indonesia and Malaysia.
One of my greatest friends is a Filipina and if I got it wrong I would be in serious trouble with her!
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2012 20:20:17 GMT
Here is an update I have received and used the two short Dao from Samy Knives also known as Goknives ;http://www.goknives.com/Ware_Detail.asp?Id=2241 Some of the stuff on their site is a little suspect but the two swords I bought shown in the link looked as though they would do the job I wanted. They arrived in good time about 8 days. They were each in a silk lined box and when I opened the boxes I was happy to see they looked exactly like the pics on the web site, the quality was what I expected for the price of $65 which, at the time I paid for them translated to a little over 50 euros, compared to anything comparable here in Ibiza a good price even with the shipping (DHL). The blades are high carbon steel ( not sure which one and in this instance not too bothered) have no distal taper something I would not normally like but in this case puts the weight further down the blade and suits the way I intend to use them and I like the style and finish for the money. The two people I spoke to Samy and Kevin at Goknives always replied within 24 hours , often within 12 and answered any questions asked. Based on this purchase I would recommend them. I also ordered a long Jian from Japanese Sword.co.uk it should have been this; www.japanese-sword.co.uk/index.p ... cts_id=309 what came was this; mytaofocus.com/item.php?id=12572788003 a replica of an ancient Vietnamese sword but with a pattern steel blade instead of the stainless one mentioned in the link. The handle was loose too I am waiting for a response as the sword has only just arrived from China when and if I get one I will update. If they have a satisfactory explanation for sending me what appears to be a reasonable blade in the fittings of a sword that sells on another site for less than $50 dollars and can then send me the correct sword I will be happy. Where the heading for the Yue Jian says 20" is a mistake on the site the sword should have a 77cm blade, something they got right on the one I received. |
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Post by MakChingYuen on Nov 9, 2012 20:47:32 GMT
That samurai sword site is a scam, I went and ordered 3 blades before and they are like about $700 and what happen is I don't even know if they shipped or not, and after a long time they did not arrive and I try to contact them, no respond... after a month of non-stop sempriniing at them, they finally come back and tell me to check the custom ourselves with a tracking number given.. I called and the custom said the sender need to call, not me, I can't do anything. So I told them to call and these China guys refused to do semprini for me and so there goes my hundred dollars to the toilet. DANG! Hate that scam site, now you said you got a friggin wrong blade, I have no idea why you even GOt something and I did not. What the heck? Everyone, if you try to purchase, AVOID that damn friggin company, it's VERY bad and their store or location is located in a very bad place, not even in a city or anything, it's like far away from the city too, where they have low teck and so on, it's like in a village. VERY BAD CUSTOMER SERVICE and a MUST AVOID place to go.
I suggest you buy from some US site with better brand or at least some guarantee service... this site? no way, they piss me off SO BAD and I am NEVER going there again, bad scam!
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2012 22:15:07 GMT
I am really sorry to hear that you have had such a bad experience with them.
They show up quite high on a Google search for Chinese swords.
I will give them a chance to reply to my emails, if I hear nothing in a couple of days I will post warnings on every sword and knife forum I can find and anywhere else I can think of.
At least I have a blade to play with, maybe I can remount it myself with something better looking than the crap that is on the sword grip and scabbard, the tang is quite thin so I could shorten the whole thing to produce a full tang and make a new grip.
Luckily I am a reasonable metalworker!
If I get lucky and get a response I will mention you to them, you never know.
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Post by MakChingYuen on Nov 9, 2012 23:27:50 GMT
haha.. well hope you got some respond then. Basically I have ZERO language barrier with them because I was typing my e-mail in CHINESE and they reply me back in Chinese saying that they did ship it out etc,. but after one month of sempriniing at them, they finally gave me a tracking # which I don't even know if it was really the swords I ordered or not. Then at the end, I end up with nothing but madness. Dang! This shop is really a no no. After this experience, all I can say is if you want to buy from China, you better buy it from a local shop which you can see the product you buy first, or you have to buy it from a reseller who already checked it for you in advance. NEVER order from China directly because China people is VERY sempriniesque in business, they scam, fraud, cheat, and do all kinds of dirty work you can't even imagine if you are like a dumbass to them. I had dealt with China businessman q few times and they are really tricky, beware.
One thing that you can see is that China is really famous for one thing nowadays - knockoffs, fakes, and pirate versions of softwares and even hardwares. Crazy eh? Thanks for the gov there. It really did reflect...!
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2012 7:57:00 GMT
Well it looks as though I have way less chance of getting anywhere with them than you did.My Chinese is zero at least you share a language with them.
It looks as though I will be doing some modifying to what I have, the balance is pretty nasty so redoing the tang would be a good start as the blade is a little end heavy, once I have a decent tang on what is a nice looking sharp pattern steel blade I can think about finding some fittings I like or maybe try making some of my own.
I have been looking at the info about sword grip wrapping so that would be an interesting project too!
Sorry they screwed you dude!
I have had no reply yet and normally there has been one each morning so it looks as though my business is finished with them.
好运 (Hǎo yùn)
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Post by MakChingYuen on Nov 10, 2012 8:10:57 GMT
Well you are lucky to be a handy man yourself who can work on metal... I have no skills in that and so even if I am the client and they send me that crap I am like... 100% doomed already. I think your are just one optimistic and happy man who can forgive like that but if it is in my case, I am already mad at them already, fraud and scammy crappy business. Sigh! That's why I don't even go for these China crap nowadays, anything made-in-china is bad if you can't see the product you get first and handle it out a store yourself. They can change it in the middle before it is shipped, they can ship you anything, even a crappy wallhanger!
Good luck with your blade project man, share your results in the future with great photos then.
Feel free to share my sorrow and yours to any forums you like. There got to be somebody to warn the world about this scammy company, it's a total disaster.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2012 9:42:01 GMT
Forgiveness is not on my mind at the moment I wil moan and groan at them but also I will contact this site:- en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_P ... Commission The Chinese Consumer protection Commission, they are set up to supposedly stop Chinese internet scams amongst other things. I will contact them but I won't be holding my breath waiting for a good result. If I have no joy there I will see about messing with their website! |
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Post by aussie-rabbit on Nov 10, 2012 11:45:16 GMT
Good luck, I hope you get some answers.
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Post by MakChingYuen on Nov 10, 2012 12:56:21 GMT
Good to know. That's right, forgiveness just make them harm more people and more victims will be harmed. We need to beef up our knowledge on how to F them up bad if they are that kind of a scam con thing.. go go go! Do what you have to do and spread the words!
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2012 13:49:22 GMT
Anyone who has a problem with a Chinese (PRC) company you can go here :-China Consumers' Association Operational language: English Telephone: +86 10 63253100 Fax: +86 10 63253199 Main contact: Ms Li Chuhua Position: Officer for International Relations cca1984@vip.sohu.net! www.cca.org.cn |
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Post by MakChingYuen on Nov 10, 2012 20:25:45 GMT
I just visited the website, I would say that it's useless to contact these people because they seems more useless than "promoting" that crappy company on all the blades and swords forums yourself. If you really want to bring them to justice, I suggest you really promote their name and website out to warn people instead. I thought I was the unlucky one, but now you proved that it is not only me.. sigh.. That China's site.. forget it.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2012 23:22:31 GMT
Well I sent a message to the Chinese consumer site, quoting their own consumer laws at them.
I am also in the process of getting on to every blade related site I can post on.
There are a couple of anti scam forums out there too that I will post on.
It also occurs to me that one of my email accounts allows me unlimited dead letter addresses, I may just start ordering swords a few times a day for the next month or so, it will probably only be an irritation to them but if it gets under their skin why not?
On another subject, I saw your video with the whips, you look pretty strong and those things still looked a semprini to swing around!
I wouldn't mind a smaller pair that don't give me a hernia every time I swing them.
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Post by MakChingYuen on Nov 11, 2012 1:18:48 GMT
Hahahaha!! Dang you are revenging! Wish you luck man, it surely isn't a good idea to mess with you man. I am proud of you with all these ABILITIES! hahahaha! Glad I am not the company that screw around you, hahahah!
Thanks about the whips too. Yeah they are super heavy and weighted 15.6lb "EACH" which is quite something. I used to practice a set of chi kung in my lineage called "Six Roads Iron Arm Chi Kung" and it require me to use a pair of dumbbells to practice the set. So from the beginning you use bare hands, then move up to 5lb pair, 12lb, 15lb, 20lb.. and so on. With that thing, it is how I gain my power to swing this pair of whips with ease now. haha.. It's scary because I was more afraid of the whip not about to withstand it's own weight and break on my toes one day, haha!!!
Showcase of the chi kung set with 15lb, enjoy!
Btw, I got my whip from a collector vendor, so I have no idea where you can get a pair. But then I saw the modern one for sale in kungfudirect.com or wle.com and I got a pair of those as well, they are nowhere near the antique stuff, the weight and the vibe, nowhere near it. I got the modern whip and it's so no durable, the edge can chip and nicks when you bang them together already, very crappy HRC level.
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Post by aussie-rabbit on Nov 11, 2012 12:28:01 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2012 13:05:51 GMT
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