Taran
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Post by Taran on Aug 8, 2012 18:52:51 GMT
A coworker of mine here in Afghanistan wants to get the appropriate sword to wear with his dress uniform. He isn't planning on using it for anything but doesn't want your typical wall-hanger dress sword.
The biggest problem is that he can't be sure of finding the right sword. AAFES Clothing Sales uniform shops can't guarantee that what they occasionally have is the Army's sword and not the Navy/Marine sword.
Can't find the reg that governs wearing a sword with the dress uniform, either.
So, if anyone knows
1) What the Army Regulations is that covers US Soldiers wearing a sword with their dress uniform
2) Where to find one of decent quality
Please let me know.
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Post by Elheru Aran on Aug 8, 2012 21:06:21 GMT
Cold Steel does advertise that they make mil-spec dress swords, but I don't know if they're *actually* regulation USA issue... that said, I doubt anybody is going to get picky. As far as I know, the Army sword is officers' only; I have no idea what the noncom's sword, if any, would be. It's a fairly basic piece...  The Navy and Marines swords are a little more fancy, so it's easy enough to tell them apart. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2012 22:16:52 GMT
Thanks to the influence of Tom Cruise in The Last Samurai, the US Army dress sword now looks like this...   |
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Post by Dave Kelly on Aug 8, 2012 22:33:02 GMT
I just googled "US Army wear of saber and got scads of hits. THis site shows the NCO sword and all the dress accessories ( belt, frog, chain and bag ) www.navalbasehobbies.com/ncoarmy.htmlThe Cold Steel officer saber is acceptable and a real carbon steel sharpened blade, which Paul Ward pointed out is still called for in the reg ( but ignored ). You can buy the regulations stainless and gold plated NCO swords from Atlanta Cutlery ( Windlass ). These are government spec swords. Windlass and WKC are the major providers. You could sneak in the 1840 NCO sword from Windlass (its carbon steel ) g'luck shopping |
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Post by scout19d on Aug 9, 2012 16:42:20 GMT
To be honest the entire time I was in I never saw anyone where a sword at any ceremony I was at. I'd seen where they had been given as gifts to an outgoing officer, but I was in the Cavalry where we still wear spurs and Stetsons so that had more to do with Cavalry tradition than it did with anything Army wide.
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Taran
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Post by Taran on Aug 9, 2012 22:42:58 GMT
I must admit to having only seen swords at weddings and, once, a retirement ceremony. All were for officers.
Also, thank you, Dave Kelly. I think you may have just helped me out a great deal. The problem I was having with a search was too many hits. Info overload and insufficient time here in Afghanistan to go through them all. Now if I can just find the reg that governs the type and wear of the sword for NCOs.
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Taran
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Posts: 2,621
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Post by Taran on Aug 10, 2012 1:50:12 GMT
Interesting. Most interesting. It is not covered in any AR. The only reference to it would appear to be FM (now TC for Training Circular) 3-21.5 Appendix F. NCOs do not get a saber, and officers do not get a sword. The TC does specify the Model 1840 NCO sword and the Model 1902 Officer's Saber. I wonder what Warrants would get. Probably a saber, but an interesting dilemma. www.militarysabers.com/military- ... saber.html www.militarysabers.com/army-saber-manual-of-arms |
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Taran
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Post by Taran on Aug 10, 2012 2:13:29 GMT
So I did a search for reviews and found none for either of these swords. Anyone already own one they would recommend? At this price point, I might just get one for myself.
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Taran
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Post by Taran on Aug 17, 2012 19:31:37 GMT
And now that "I have found" this one and the Cold Steel Officer's Saber...
Anyone know of a comparable quality Model 1902 Saber for less $? I can't find one myself.
You are so far making me look good here to my chain of command.
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Post by Spathologist on Sept 4, 2012 2:06:11 GMT
Warrants wear sabers. Probably the best quality edged sidearms you'll find today, though it's not saying much when compared to the "old stuff", are the WKC offerings from Marlow White: www.militarysabers.com/WKC bought a lot of the old Wilkinson equipment, but I bought several of their 1902s to give as gifts back in 2009 and I wasn't much impressed. But they were far better than the Windlass offerings, which were in turn much better than the Spanish, Chinese, and Taiwanese offerings. The Cold Steel sabers are not regulation, as their blades are not nickeled. |
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Post by the_antposse on Oct 1, 2012 15:52:44 GMT
If its not too late young man, and "Thank You guy's for your service", I would suggest you google "USMC sword manual" and that will take you to a page that includes some utube videos by some marines in practice. You will get a few laughs out of it but you will get the general idea of procedure. Being an old marine I must admit even I got a few chuckles out of it. I had an NCO sword and wore it at certain times and places, usually formal presentations, Officers and senior NCO's retirement, and occsionally formal inspection by foreign dignataries. When its done properly, the cerimony is impressive. I've seen marines in reception formation do it perfectly without a hitch and that is a real trick. If you can find an embassy marine over there he could most likely show you firsthand how its done, those guy's spend hours upon hours practicing everything they do. Break a leg dog face.....Sempre-fi ! the antposse!
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Taran
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Posts: 2,621
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Post by Taran on Oct 2, 2012 12:04:47 GMT
Doesn't have to be nickeled to be regulation. That isn't standard with the model and the only document that references the swords does not mention nickeled blade or any of the other popular "enhancements."
Antposse: Thank you for your thoughts, but I have no idea what you are talking about past your first sentence.
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Post by Spathologist on Oct 4, 2012 2:00:18 GMT
Incorrect.
The "standard" is the pattern deposited with the Ordnance Department. This standard has been described in numerous pieces of Ordnance Department and Springfield Armory correspondence from the report of the Board convened by Special Orders 52 in 1902 to Specification RS-75-0 in 1918 to MIL-S-2990 in 1951.
The blade is nickeled.
Stainless and bare steel "sabers" didn't appear until the 70s. They aren't regulation, but no one really cares (if they even know).
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Post by Odingaard on Oct 4, 2012 2:58:42 GMT
In 22 years of military service (1987-2009), I rarely seen anyone wear a sword or sabre in uniform. I know they exist, I've just seldom seen them personally, except in 1st Calvary as part of a formal function, along with spurs and Stetsons, and then in the Marines. Other than that, I've not knowledge in the matter.
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Post by Dave Kelly on Oct 5, 2012 11:08:25 GMT
Chances of actually seeing a sword used is about nil unless you are a member of the Old Guard (3rd Regt?).
In my 20 I participated in two weddings where the groom thought it was "cool". :roll:
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Post by Jack Tar on Dec 26, 2012 5:59:55 GMT
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Post by Spathologist on Dec 30, 2012 7:12:15 GMT
Having spent most of my career in the Cavalry, sabers were and are more common than in other units.
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Taran
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Posts: 2,621
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Post by Taran on Jan 1, 2013 16:26:11 GMT
I am trying to popularize them again within the Army Reserves. Might stick a printout for the Officer's Sabre under the general's door...
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