Cheness kissaki moroha tanto - hate to say it...
Aug 2, 2012 23:34:58 GMT
Post by Deleted on Aug 2, 2012 23:34:58 GMT
This is actually more of a warning than a review, so I’m gonna forego most of the usual review format.
Just before joining SBG, I bought a Cheness Tenchi ko katana. I was, and am, quite happy with it, (my only real complaint being a loose kashira) and it wasn’t too long before I had thoughts of a companion piece. I decided the Cheness kissaki moroha tanto would make a neat downsized daisho. Sadly, the tanto turned out to be little more than a knife-shaped paperweight.
It should be fairly obvious at this point, but I have no affiliation with Cheness Inc.
I won’t even try to get into the finer points of this blade style. I know next to nothing, and there are several other threads on the subject.
I bought the tanto directly from Cheness for about $150. Shipping was quick and the knife was securely packed, with the usual bag and orange-lined box. The overall design grinds and hi were all acceptable, no cause for complaint at this price point. It has the typical Cheness fake hamon and a very shoe-lacey sageo. The hamon I don’t like, but expected, the sageo surprised me because it is so different from the cord used on the ko katana. These were the first things I noticed, but to me they were fairly minor details. More significant flaws were evident as well; the habaki sticks out from the mune and catches on the saya sometimes when re-sheathing/performing noto. Crappy seppa, crappy ito, but this was still not completely unexpected. I was hoping I'd gotten a durable, solid blade for my money at the very least.
The tanto came somewhat sharp, capable of cutting cardboard, and maybe scraping a few hairs off my arm. The secondary edge is not sharp, although it’s close. “40% sharp” is a description I saw somewhere and that’s pretty accurate. I sharpened the primary edge and sanded off the fake hamon. I failed to notice that this process didn’t take as long as it should have.
I went into the backyard and started cutting bottles. The blade has enough weight to give it some authority in the swing. After the first cut, the blade shifted and everything got loose. In reality, the fuchi had never been properly seated to the tsuka. Even worse, the gap that remained once the fuchi was seated was not even. There is almost room for two more seppa, if the gap were even. I made a crude seppa from some copper sheet, which helped, but did not solve the problem. While I had the tanto disassembled, noticed that both edges of the nakago were dented in a weird way, as if someone had placed the tang edge-up on a table and beaten it with a round iron bar! I have no idea WTF that is, but I know it's probably not a good sign! :lol: There were no cracks in the tsuka. There is one mekugi, and it's their brass one. Lame. I put it back together and felt it was at least a bit more solid. I was able to kill a few plastic bottles. As I said before, the balance is such that you can put some power into the cuts. Thrusts, which I thought might be the kissaki morohas strong suit, actually felt a bit awkward due to the blade curvature. It was not long before my bad attemp at repair proved to be insufficient, and I knew the furniture needed significant work.
After this brief cutting session of less than a dozen bottles, I also noticed that about 1 mm of the tip had rolled over. I found that odd because I was sure I had not hit my wooden target stand or any other object harder than a Powerade bottle. However, the tip is thin due to the secondary edge, and I tried to tell myself that this might not be unusual. :? But as I sharpened off the hook I had a bad feeling creeping around in the back of my mind. Why did the tip roll and not chip? Bad sign. I checked how it had held its edge. I knew it should still be arm-shaving because my ko katana is made of the same stuff, and it will easily cut 6 or 10 bottles and still shave. The edge was rolled at the monouchi (CoP). Now I had that pit-of-the-stomach feeling that says “You just flushed $150 down the f@#*ing toilet”.
I went out to my woodpile and picked a particularly soft looking spot on some Buckeye. I pushed the tip in about 1/8” and tried to pry up a splinter of wood about the diameter of a matchstick. The thing bent like a friggin butterknife. This test may sound abusive, but for purposes of explaining it here, I was able to pry similar bit out, over and over again, first with a CS AUS8 ti lite, and then with a super thin bladed knife I made myself out of O-1. I heat treated that in my front yard with 2 propane torches and used motor oil. I just mic’ed thickness at the tip… < 0.030”. No deformation after 10 repetitions. I’m not bragging here, I never liked or even finished that knife, I just want to illustrate that any knife with anything even close to a decent heat treat should pass this test easily. Honestly, this wood is more like dense foam. The Cheness bent badly on the first try. Nothing short of a horribly botched or completely absent heat treat would act this way, IMO. :evil:
So maybe you can understand if I apologize for the lack of pictures. Even looking at this thing makes me first sad, then angry, then just disgusted. :x I don’t expect a refund at this point. I don’t want an exchange. I think I’m done with Cheness at this point. I plan to send this knife back, at my own expense, with a copy of this review. They can keep it and I will chalk it up to experience. I’ll post this so others don’t have to learn the hard way.
edit for title and pics
Just before joining SBG, I bought a Cheness Tenchi ko katana. I was, and am, quite happy with it, (my only real complaint being a loose kashira) and it wasn’t too long before I had thoughts of a companion piece. I decided the Cheness kissaki moroha tanto would make a neat downsized daisho. Sadly, the tanto turned out to be little more than a knife-shaped paperweight.
It should be fairly obvious at this point, but I have no affiliation with Cheness Inc.
I won’t even try to get into the finer points of this blade style. I know next to nothing, and there are several other threads on the subject.
I bought the tanto directly from Cheness for about $150. Shipping was quick and the knife was securely packed, with the usual bag and orange-lined box. The overall design grinds and hi were all acceptable, no cause for complaint at this price point. It has the typical Cheness fake hamon and a very shoe-lacey sageo. The hamon I don’t like, but expected, the sageo surprised me because it is so different from the cord used on the ko katana. These were the first things I noticed, but to me they were fairly minor details. More significant flaws were evident as well; the habaki sticks out from the mune and catches on the saya sometimes when re-sheathing/performing noto. Crappy seppa, crappy ito, but this was still not completely unexpected. I was hoping I'd gotten a durable, solid blade for my money at the very least.
The tanto came somewhat sharp, capable of cutting cardboard, and maybe scraping a few hairs off my arm. The secondary edge is not sharp, although it’s close. “40% sharp” is a description I saw somewhere and that’s pretty accurate. I sharpened the primary edge and sanded off the fake hamon. I failed to notice that this process didn’t take as long as it should have.
I went into the backyard and started cutting bottles. The blade has enough weight to give it some authority in the swing. After the first cut, the blade shifted and everything got loose. In reality, the fuchi had never been properly seated to the tsuka. Even worse, the gap that remained once the fuchi was seated was not even. There is almost room for two more seppa, if the gap were even. I made a crude seppa from some copper sheet, which helped, but did not solve the problem. While I had the tanto disassembled, noticed that both edges of the nakago were dented in a weird way, as if someone had placed the tang edge-up on a table and beaten it with a round iron bar! I have no idea WTF that is, but I know it's probably not a good sign! :lol: There were no cracks in the tsuka. There is one mekugi, and it's their brass one. Lame. I put it back together and felt it was at least a bit more solid. I was able to kill a few plastic bottles. As I said before, the balance is such that you can put some power into the cuts. Thrusts, which I thought might be the kissaki morohas strong suit, actually felt a bit awkward due to the blade curvature. It was not long before my bad attemp at repair proved to be insufficient, and I knew the furniture needed significant work.
After this brief cutting session of less than a dozen bottles, I also noticed that about 1 mm of the tip had rolled over. I found that odd because I was sure I had not hit my wooden target stand or any other object harder than a Powerade bottle. However, the tip is thin due to the secondary edge, and I tried to tell myself that this might not be unusual. :? But as I sharpened off the hook I had a bad feeling creeping around in the back of my mind. Why did the tip roll and not chip? Bad sign. I checked how it had held its edge. I knew it should still be arm-shaving because my ko katana is made of the same stuff, and it will easily cut 6 or 10 bottles and still shave. The edge was rolled at the monouchi (CoP). Now I had that pit-of-the-stomach feeling that says “You just flushed $150 down the f@#*ing toilet”.
I went out to my woodpile and picked a particularly soft looking spot on some Buckeye. I pushed the tip in about 1/8” and tried to pry up a splinter of wood about the diameter of a matchstick. The thing bent like a friggin butterknife. This test may sound abusive, but for purposes of explaining it here, I was able to pry similar bit out, over and over again, first with a CS AUS8 ti lite, and then with a super thin bladed knife I made myself out of O-1. I heat treated that in my front yard with 2 propane torches and used motor oil. I just mic’ed thickness at the tip… < 0.030”. No deformation after 10 repetitions. I’m not bragging here, I never liked or even finished that knife, I just want to illustrate that any knife with anything even close to a decent heat treat should pass this test easily. Honestly, this wood is more like dense foam. The Cheness bent badly on the first try. Nothing short of a horribly botched or completely absent heat treat would act this way, IMO. :evil:
So maybe you can understand if I apologize for the lack of pictures. Even looking at this thing makes me first sad, then angry, then just disgusted. :x I don’t expect a refund at this point. I don’t want an exchange. I think I’m done with Cheness at this point. I plan to send this knife back, at my own expense, with a copy of this review. They can keep it and I will chalk it up to experience. I’ll post this so others don’t have to learn the hard way.
edit for title and pics