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Post by Deleted on Mar 3, 2012 20:32:32 GMT
Haha, I haven't thought of that! I don't wanna cause trouble But it's funny, since I'm german the word has a different tone for me, well yes, it sounds cute, but I never think of it as a word like darling (Schatz in german). Funny, languages are funny sometimes. I'm struggling to learn japanes but it is simply impossible to do it without very much staying power. If you don't study every day and if it's just a bit, it'll never work out. And to get back to the topic: Here's another question I came up with: (I'm so sorry, I'm always asking and asking and you guys are so helpful - I hope I can give it back to some others who come and ask and ask!) Some people say that an Aluminium blade has a different feeling than a steel one. The steel blade "feels" like a real katana... is it really like that? Is the drive so different? And in the case of your brother's blade, isn't it reason to send it back?
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Post by LastGodslayer on Mar 4, 2012 1:11:39 GMT
Hey, its no trouble at all Honey. I just thought it was funny too! My brother's iaito blade was bought to be remounted. I never got around to do it, but if I had to use it at the dojo, I probably would ask about an exchange. The bubbles are quite small anyway, so only while inspecting the blade does one notice them. Despite what most people might think, shinken and aluminum iaito are nothing alike. They handle differently, period. If you had two copies of a blade, one in steel and one in aluminum, they would feel different because of the different density, and so, not only does the aluminum iaito feels lighter as the balance is closer to the hand because all the koshirae is identical to that of a shinken. The difference can be quite dramatic in longer or more robust blades. To approximate this, most iaito makers have extra thick blades to compensate for the reduced density of aluminum. Of course, there are cases in which the difference is almost imperceptible. A iaito IS a great intermediate step between a bokuto and a shinken. It is the perfect tool to learn about sword safety and etiquette while not taking too many risks. Of course there will still be some learning when moving onto a shinken, but by that time, most people already have the appropriate control to use the sword the way it was meant to be used. Of course, there are exceptions...
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Post by Deleted on Mar 7, 2012 21:01:38 GMT
I may proudly announce that I have passed my exam and am now officially a "Schwert-Träger", meaning I'm allowed from now on to use a Katana (Iaito of course) The worst part of it: I haven't ordered my Iaito yet and so the waiting time hasn't even begun :cry: This week it's gonna happen !!! (I hope)
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Post by Krelian on Mar 7, 2012 21:14:41 GMT
Congratulations! It'll feel like forever but you'll have your iaito before you know it!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 7, 2012 22:10:43 GMT
Thanks! I should add perhaps, that my "proudly announcement" has a tiny bit irony in it, because of course I'm still just a bloody beginner! But I want to go the way...
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Post by Krelian on Mar 7, 2012 23:56:12 GMT
Almost all of us are just beginners, some of us are just lucky enough to have been doing it longer than others... I believe that always keeping that open "beginners mind" is important in any artistic pursuit be it martial arts or graphic arts. My belief is once you begin to consider yourself too much of an expert it can become harder to learn and harder to continue to improve.
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Post by LastGodslayer on Mar 8, 2012 0:17:47 GMT
Congratulations Honey!
I hope you get the perfect iaito, and it looks just the way you want to and is exceptionally well built too so you can enjoy your new title.
Funny enough, I got a blade from Kaiyo recently, in a unokubi zukuri sugata with bo-hi and soe-hi which is exceptionally light and makes a loud tachikaze. The first thing that went through my mind when I got the blade (well, the second thing since the first thing that went through my mind was WOW!), was this might be the kind of thing you were looking for. You might want to look around to see if you can find a shinken in unokubi shape since it is a bit lighter than the more common shinogi zukuri (well some shinogi zukuri have such high shinogi that the weigh might be the same). The only problem with this sugata is that it is a bit more fragile than the shinogi or shobu zukuri, so it might bend in a bad cut. So, not really ideal for heavy tameshigiri.
Let us know what iaito you end up buying. I for one, love to window shop!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 9, 2012 9:52:07 GMT
Thanks for congratulating Of course I'm happy, but the real work begins now! I'm looking forward to it so much! I have to add sth. to the discussion Iaito or Shinken for iaido practice: At the exam there wre of course several others and they did exams too, one did his nidan, several did their itchikyu, nikyu, sankyu, so all quite experienced - aaand one of them made a tiny little mistake during nuketo (unsheathing the sword), sth. which can happen to anyone anytime, and he cut himself between thumb and forefinger. Lucckily, it wasn't really serious but had to be sewn (do you say that as a medical term?). I've made up my mind well before that but it showed me again that I as a musician should stick with a Iaito for a loooong time!! The blade you describe sounds great, are you going to post pictures? In another forum topic perhaps? As a woman I sure LOVE window shopping As I said above I'm not looking for a Shinken now but it's good to know the possiblities. But what are the bladeshapes? I stumbled upon that recently but found no explanation or pictures. What does a unokubi look like? soe-hi is the second hi? Wouldn't matter to me if it's not so fit for tameshigiri, that's not my first interest... By the way I've made contact with nosyudo and it looks da.... good
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Post by Neil G. on Mar 9, 2012 13:39:08 GMT
Usually people say "stitched" in the US these days, but I think everyone got your meaning. For blade shapes and styles you could look at this page, I've found it very informative (even though I'm not really into Japanese swords it was still a good read)... www.ksky.ne.jp/~sumie99/styles.htmlViel Glueck!
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Post by LastGodslayer on Mar 10, 2012 0:29:30 GMT
I'll try to post some pictures of the blade here tomorrow. I still have a lot of work I want to do on it before I post it on the customization board. Here's a video of the blade from when it belonged to Kaiyo. I'll be making the kanagu for it and the tsuka as well. The hamon is actually more vivid in person than one might think from the video. Unokubi zukuri sugata is a valid shape for a katana, it would be suitable for tamashigiri, but like in all sword shapes, there are trade offs. You're right though, if you are a musician then your hands are to be kept safe. A iaito is a better choice indeed.
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Post by Jussi Ekholm on Mar 10, 2012 3:37:57 GMT
Congratulations on passing the exam Honey.
Getting a first iaito is a big buy and it's good to hear that you've researched well instead of jumping off to buy one. I used to practice iaido when I was younger and remember how hard it was to decide which company to choose. Pretty much every japanese-made iaito that I've held have been good. As I were just a kid back in my iaido days I can still say that even the 5-7 year old models from Tozando, Nosyudo, Token Mino were good quality and I would think their quality is still at least the same. I still have my old custom Nishijin (Tozando) iaito, and although I would order a different iaito today I still think it's of pretty good quality.
Some companies offer different bladeshapes for iaito. And some offer different types of blades. Shinogi-zukuri is the most common bladeshape found in authentic katana length blades. As most iaito are shinogi-zukuri I'd say that might be the best bladeshape to choose for an iaito. There are options in types like extra-wide, lightweight etc.
Difference in hi (grooves) in iai give a sword a different tachikaze (the sound that comes when you swing the sword) and of course affect in weight since metal is removed from the blade. Here are some different hi types. Bo-hi is just one groove in the shinogiji, this groove can continue onto nakago or stop before habaki. There are two different ending types, maru-dome (round) and kaku-dome (square) although I believe most iaito have maru-dome done in bad fashion (just pulling the chisel off instead of true propely made round-shape). The bo-hi can be Ryo-chiri (leaving room between under edge of hi and shinogi) or Kata-chiri (hi being all to shinogi). Koshi-hi is a short groove. It will not continue very far onto the blade. Soe-hi is small hi (groove) under the bo-hi. Futasuji-hi is double groove. Naginata-hi but it's just with Kanmuri-otoshi-zukuri or Unokubi-zukuri. There are other hi-types too but I believe these are the ones encountered in iaito.
I suppose you have tried handling iaito of experinced iaidoka in you club and therefore you thought of that weight? I believe most of the iaito with regular blade at length of 2 shaku 3 sun 5 bu will weight under 800g. This is no fact though and it's good to talk with the manufacturer if the weight is concerning factor.
As you seem to want lots of customization options Nishijin offers custom iaito from Tozando and Arashiyama. Just note that some custom options will up the price a bit.
Windowshopping for swords is great fun.
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Post by LastGodslayer on Mar 10, 2012 18:19:19 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2012 21:19:44 GMT
Hey LastGodslayer,
(by the way, your nickname is quite long you know, don't you have some short version? :lol: )
Great pictures, that's a beautiful blade! What means "I've got the blade from Kaiyo"? Did he make it? And do you mount your own Katana? This lenght would be exactly what I'm going for!
Ah and I'd like your opinion on sth. - and of the others perhaps too: I'm on the verge of ordering my Iaito, I have all the details I 've got to know but I'm just not yet fully decided whether to order at tozando or nosyudo. I think nosyudo has perhaps the higher quality (only a bit perhaps) but they are more expensive, I can't get all the details I want (leather tsuka and katate maki) and also the bank charges and so on are really high... With tozando I can get all the details, the quality should be alike I think and there are no bank charges and additional shipping costs.
What do you think? Should I never the less go for nosyudo with Igarashito or with tozando? The latter one is still a real japanese iaito isn't it? Everything made and mounted in Japan?
Have a nice evening all, Honey
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Post by Jussi Ekholm on Mar 14, 2012 21:40:49 GMT
They are both good options in my book, to my understanding both are japanese-made iaito. As you mentioned bank charges have you taken VAT into calculations? Here in Finland we have 23% but I guess it's 19% in Germany. That is always a pain when doing big purchases outside EU. Just wanting to point this out in case you hadn't included that into your calculations, if you have then that is nothing to worry about.
It's hard to say which one you should go with, guess it depends how important those little factors that you can get from another but not from the other are for you (leather-ito etc.)
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Post by LastGodslayer on Mar 15, 2012 0:38:37 GMT
Hmm... I guess my nickname is a bit on the long side. You can call me Ten (first half of my real name in japanese), if you prefer. Kaiyo was the lucky owner of this blade before I acquired it from him (at a shamefully low price might I add ). He ordered it from a Chinese forge that operates through the eBay names Tckruan88 and Tommy_Lee85. There have been a few, generally positive reviews of their blades. I have just got comfortable with mounting my own blades. I'm also learning how to polish modern, monosteel blades (no antiques for me). This kind of blade might be good if you were looking for a shinken since it is very light, but a iaito is probably more appropriate for you at this point, especially since you are a musician. I believe Jussi is correct. Both are Japan made iaito, so the quality should be there. As for which company to choose from, I have my own opinion on this: Get what you want. If you are going to invest a lot of money into a tool and the quality is expected to be at the level you are paying for, and if there is nothing wrong with getting your wishes met, like the tsukagawa in katatemaki, (some ryuha are picky with inappropriate color schemes for the iaito, or with the lack of functionality in some kinds of fittings), then go with Tozando. Jussi made a good point though: there will be taxes to pay. Try PM'ing Kaiyo to ask him what are the expected costs for shipping blades into Germany from outside the EU. I don't know if there may be any other legal requirements into getting a iaito, but I don't think so. I find it odd that Nosyudo won't provide tsukagawa in katatemaki... It is not that odd of a request. I've seen it here before, and this is a chinese forge. A good one though...
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Post by JContini on Mar 15, 2012 3:36:14 GMT
Good luck Honey with your pic...taking Ten's reply a little more...here is a good site that may even benefit you even more..there swords are super...and the guy who runs the place is a member here on SBG..here is the link...I hope you enjoy... www.thesamuraiworkshop.com/shop/ ... gory_id=10
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2012 9:51:36 GMT
Hi JContini, thanks for the site, it is really interesting! But I'm going for a custom made Iaito because I need a 2.3 shaku blade and the weight should be around 700g. They have shorter blades but they're much heavier, over 800g. But their Iaito sure look beautiful! And Ten, nosyudo makes katate maki and they have leather tsukaito, but it's very expensive. I think I have to add that I don't want brown or black leather so it's my fault, they'll sure give me what I want but I have to pay quite a price for it. With tozando I get it with the standards... So that's the problem I know about the custom charges, unfortunately t's not only the 19% but also some extra fee. But with nosyudo there will also be two bank charges for me to pay. So I have to cut back on the things I'd like to have to make up for all the extra charges... and if the quality difference isn't as big as the whole charges, then I'm considering tozando again of course... Hey, Krelian, if you read this, what do you think about it?
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Post by Krelian on Mar 15, 2012 17:04:13 GMT
I know Tozando makes quality iaito as well. If your choices are to get exactly the customizations what you want from Tozando or to have to scale back with the Nosyudo I would choose the Tozando. The iaito itself will still be a high-end piece in terms of quality and, more importantly, it will be exactly the iaito you want. Like Nosyudo a Tozando is Japanese-made by specially skilled craftsmen.
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Post by LastGodslayer on Mar 16, 2012 0:06:02 GMT
I can't imagine Nosyudo's wares to be of that much higher quality than Tozando's, nor have I found any evidence of this. I believe the price difference comes from a business model unsuited for todays customers and not for an exceptional advantage in quality. Perhaps you could tell us how much is the cost difference for your ideal iaito from both companies?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2012 17:36:44 GMT
Hey Ten so let me sum it up: I'm still waiting for the confirmation of the katate maki tsuka wrapping and the possible higher costs, so I have to leave that out. With nosyudo that would be 5250 Yen and that's more or less reasonable, I saw higher than that. I pay about 10000 Yen more for the leather tsuka nin the colour I want otherwise (with change of colour) it would be more or less the same. But I pay 8800 Yen for shipping and about 9000 Yen for bank charges (both is free with tozando). So for the same Iaito - not the same but lookkalike - I'd have to pay 27800 Yen more, that's about 333 $ more. Thanks for that question, to write it down helped to clear up my mind too! Of course I summed it up but not on paper... now it really is quite obvious. Unless I would change some details or did without some, such as leather tsuka (going back to cotton would compensate the bank charges) - but I'd only do that for an amazingly better quality. And that's doubtable, I think. So, Monday will be the big day of placing the order. Have to decide today and tomorrow about the fittings
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