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Post by Polarclaw on Jan 28, 2012 21:28:51 GMT
Wow I'm learning a great deal from this thread. Thanks guys!
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Post by qwerty53 on May 21, 2013 14:10:41 GMT
Now its 375 on Amazon brand new. If it worth it?
Also how about soviet original? What is it made of? The blade? Is it really stronger than cold steel? I mean look at Katanas. L6 steel is stronger than the original Japanese one....
So I am wondering whether the original Shashka is not less functional (weaker)....
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Post by Kilted Cossack on May 21, 2013 14:21:09 GMT
Tough call, Qwerty, as to worth. It looks to be a slightly revised version of the Windlass. (The pommel/grip cap very, very strongly resembled the Windlass version.) Good sword, bad shashka, is what I would say. CS uses almost exclusively 1050, if I'm not mistaken, for their swords. At two pounds it's not too out of line for a saber, but that's heavy for a shashka. I'd call it typical CS, probably: overbuilt, with ahistorically heavy hilt components to compensate for the overbuilt blade, probably well assembled. KOA has it a little cheaper. kultofathena.com/product.asp?ite ... an+Shasqua |
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Post by SPQR on May 21, 2013 21:17:04 GMT
I was fortunate enough to broker the sale of a genuine Shaska for a co-worker, whose great uncle brought it back from Iran in the 1950's (he traveled extensively while working for the US State Dept). It was probably pretty old when he got it, and it had extensive inlay in silver and brass. The blade was incredibly light and superbly balanced, and despite being stored in the scabbard for many years was both bright and frighteningly sharp.
But the handling...oh my God. Perfectly balanced, effortless slashing, insanely fast recoveries. It feels like an extension of your arm. This is a blade designed to kill with the first stroke, not guard, parry, or disarm your opponent.
Now I'm spoiled. I couldn't afford the minimum price my co-worker wanted, which the auction passed two days in and kept on going, eventually closing at around $900. I can't afford the ones on ebay either.
Do I want one of the cold steel ones? Hardly. They are box wine compared to fine champagne, my friends.
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Post by Kilted Cossack on May 21, 2013 21:23:42 GMT
well said.
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Post by randomnobody on May 22, 2013 4:54:21 GMT
Only $900? Well, shoot, why didn't they just sell it to me?  I wish more makers would adopt proper shasqua. It's a shame those made in Russia are so tightly regulated. Worse even than Japanese swords, really. All the "cold weapon" laws and permits and such...all I've ever managed to find online are highly-decorated presentation pieces that are not rated as functional weapons and encrusted with so much gold and jewels that I wouldn't want to even touch one for fear of hurting myself, nevermind the shasqua. Oh and that'll be $8,000+. Antiques seem a bit inflated, too. eBay's average looks about a grand to 1300 and up, for rusty military patterns or stripped civilian models. Want one intact and clean? Look to spend no less than $2-3k. Sheesh. I have Hanwei's prototype, and it's no different at all from the Windlass or Cold Steel offerings, but I do wonder if Lutel's is any good, or how Raven Armoury's rates vs price (and if they have less-expensive options for the same blade). Shasqua are just such a tight niche that nobody can seem to be bothered to do one properly because they don't think it'll sell. Pity. |
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Post by qwerty53 on May 23, 2013 4:17:34 GMT
SO
the cold steel for twice the price or the windlass steelcrafts?
Anyone handled both?
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Post by Kilted Cossack on May 23, 2013 4:44:29 GMT
I've got the Windlass. It's a good, solid blade. It's NOT a shashka, it's overweight by 1/3 to 1/2. If you're willing to play with sandpaper, it's a good value, and you can "put it on a diet." The ferrule and pommel cap are hideously overweight for a shashka.
Now I look at Windlass as good, quality, kit swords. They need work, particularly the sabers. (Actually, almost all of my Windlass experience is with sabers or saberish blades.)
There's a video floating around (I linked to it, back in the day), where a Circassian swordsmith says that a shashka blade should weigh 300, 350 grams. Figure, with fittings, maybe a pound five ounces, maybe a little heavier.
I'd honestly look for the lightest Windlass saber I could find, i.e., the thinnest. As a project blade, I'd look at the Windlass 1860, strip the furniture, and start from there. Out after the fuller terminates, the blade should be thinned (KOA says it's 3.6mm, I'd look for more like 2.5mm, maybe 2mm), and mock up a grip from wood, maybe cover the pommel with sheet metal.
Ben Potter of Privateer Armoury might be able to do up a custom, if he'd essay a 28-30" blade on his 1/16" stock.
It's a niche fetish, and you're going to pay for your pleasure, if you want it done right.
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Post by micromike123 on Jul 13, 2014 16:10:47 GMT
Dear Forum Members and fellow shashka aficionados, I am new on this respected Forum - please, don't slap me too hard for clumsiness and mistakes  I should probably start with a confession: I am totally in love with shashka sword (which I will be bragging more about in a different branch of the Forum); however, I am very dissatisfied with Cold Steel's position in marketing of what they call "Russian Shasqua". Their significantly price-reduced specimen is hanging on Amazon, where I express what I think is an objective opinion. Was I wrong when saying what I said?... I will deeply appreciate your expert opinion on my evaluation of what Cold Steel calls "Russian Shasqua". |
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Post by Kilted Cossack on Jul 13, 2014 16:19:04 GMT
Got a link? My guess is it's a slightly modified Windlass shashka . . . which isn't true, in any way whatsoever, to the original Circassian shashka. I've got the Windlass. The looks are sort of all right, but it's a cleaver, not a slicer, you cannot work it from the wrist unless you're hella stronger than I am, and probably not even then.
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Post by micromike123 on Jul 13, 2014 16:29:54 GMT
I compared CS VS Windlass. The CS is slightly lighter and modified with deeper fuller and re-designed grip, inscription and Russian Crest. Other than that it is almost identical to the one from Windlass. In fact, CS Shamshir is also made by Windlass (they are selling it as Scimitar) - I have both and took all the possible measurements to prove it. As for the links - here they are: CS web site: www.coldsteel.com/Product/88RS/R ... ASQUA.aspx CS ad on YouTube (they banned me because they didn't like my questions): Amazon discussion: www.amazon.com/Cold-Steel-88RS-R ... ewpoints=0 |
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Post by Kilted Cossack on Jul 13, 2014 16:41:54 GMT
My experience with Windlass is hit and miss. When they're good, they're very good, when they're bad, they're . . . well made crowbars.
Every time I read any Cold Steel ad copy, I get sick to my stomach. Your Amazon review seems spot-on, to the extent that my limited knowledge can judge. I'm a little surprised at the 828 gram weight you list for the military version, but I've suspected that, after adoption by the Imperial Army, the essential nature of the shashka might have been somewhat altered.
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Post by micromike123 on Jul 13, 2014 16:48:20 GMT
I cannot tell you how much I was surprised with the weight of my standard issue (so it looks) 1927 shashka. I took it to an expert and he told me that there were two modifications existed for a rather short time: an officer model 9thinner and lighter blade) and the regular one (heavier, close to 1 kg). I guess I was lucky to get one without even knowing it. Since this is a working sword for me, I am changing the grip to my own specs. Also, I am consulting one company on making a Circassian Shashka. So far, they cannot go lighter than 850 g, but I am working on it  |
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Post by Timo Nieminen on Jul 13, 2014 21:21:33 GMT
Kizlyar's Caucasian shashka is a nice 700g. It can be done. The Kizlyar blade has excellent weight-saving geometry, so it gets to that weight while having a strong blade for the weight. But simple geometries can get you to that kind of weight, too, at the cost of a more delicate blade.
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Post by micromike123 on Jul 13, 2014 21:40:18 GMT
Thank you for pointing me (all of us) to products from Kizlyar - in fact, I was communicating with one of this most interesting factory's designer for some time, until he left the manufacturer (sadly enough). A few things to mention about Kizlyar's shashkas: 1. While the original manufacturer's site says nothing about their shashkas weight, the international web pages claim some (not all) of their shashkas as being "about 800 grams". I have no idea if these are in reality above or below 800 g, and how much either of the possible ways. 2. Most of Kizlyar's shashkas are made of 50Х14МФ steel which is similar to the German X50CrMoV15; also Kizlyar is using 65x13 steel, which is similar to 440A and already mentioned X50CrMoV15 - I am sure you see my point. Also, considering stainless steel blade, I would say that Kizlyar's shashkas are somewhat over-priced - but this is just my personal opinion. In fact, I have a knife made by Kizlyar, and I truly like it |
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Post by Timo Nieminen on Jul 14, 2014 2:47:11 GMT
Their models change; whether or not they still make mine, I don't know. Mine is 65x13 which is, as you say, similar to 440A. I would prefer a low alloy carbon steel, or a spring steel alloy, but 65x13/440A is tolerable.
I think they're overpriced, too. Mine was heavily discounted since the suspension rings were squashed, which made it not so overpriced.
Which Kizlyar knife do you have? I managed to get a cheap Egersky before they disappeared. 'Tis a nice elegant knife. The wooden handled version would have been nice, but the polymer handle one is good.
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Post by micromike123 on Jul 14, 2014 3:18:03 GMT
I have a Kizlyar's ethnic knife with wooden sheath, similar to the one depicted below, with one difference: mine has a light brown leather wrapping: www.kizlyar.ru/blog/kak-my-delae ... -rukoyatej |
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Post by micromike123 on Jul 15, 2014 19:05:26 GMT
Cold Steel gave face-lift to their YouTube advertisement by removing all comments and introducing strict censorship to control any negative and other comments which may put a spot on their mediocrely-attractive specimen: I have a list of at least Ten Comments on what they call "shasqua" but would rather present them in a shape of allegory: A sword-making company "Best Modern Replicas" is marketing a new sword which they position as a "Japanese Katana." Using their YouTube space, they are telling us what they think is the only true story of this sword, mentioning their design as a "modern replica". On their web site they are telling us that the Japanese Katana originated from an ancient Australian boomerang. A close look at the sword reveals: a flamboyant blade with a cord-wrapped grip, the Japanese Crest, which one cannot use without the Supreme Court of Japan's permission, and the inscription in Swahili: "Be Happy!". The "Best Modern Replicas" ad says nothing about the place of manufacturing but some of their sellers mention Uganda. The YouTube video advertisement of this new and incredibly picturesque device shows how good it is at chopping and pocking numerous objects of various solidity. I hope this (above) made some of us smile |
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Nov 1, 2024 0:13:58 GMT
Nov 1, 2024 0:13:58 GMT
