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Post by chrisperoni on Feb 7, 2011 5:18:59 GMT
I see it all the time- a blade is sheathed when wet or bloody- is this factual? Sensible? Historically acurate? What of the practice I see sometimes in jsa where the tsuka is knocked to shake blood off before noto.?. I see folks on the yootoobz sheathing a wet blade after cutting bottles..
Any thoughts? edit/add: what about damage to the blade/ ie rust?
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Post by LittleJP on Feb 7, 2011 5:22:00 GMT
It probably did happen, though I'm guessing most people would have preferred to clean it off first.
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Post by chrisperoni on Feb 7, 2011 5:40:29 GMT
what about damage to the blade/ ie rust?
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Post by Vincent Dolan on Feb 7, 2011 5:57:13 GMT
This is just my opinion, and I can't stress that enough, but I think it could be that the blood would stain, perhaps leading to rust; however, I think it has more to do with the fact that a stain is essentially added material to an object. You add material to the edge of a sword and it dulls pretty quickly. Without proper solvents, it's difficult to get stains out of something, particularly if it's something as delicate as an edge, where you could easily slice off your fingers just by cleaning it. In most cases, if you didn't have time to properly clean the blade (though I can't imagine why you wouldn't, since the only time you'd sheath your blade is once all your enemies are dead, in which case you could easily give it a proper wipe down in place of a proper cleaning, since you wouldn't take those into combat with you), then you'd just flick the majority of the blood from the blade and sheath it until you could clean it. In addition, since only the exterior of a wood scabbard would likely be treated against the elements, shoving a bloody sword into it could cause it to swell and crack, so, on the whole, not sensible at all.
But again, this is purely conjecture, so take it as you will.
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SanMarc
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Post by SanMarc on Feb 7, 2011 7:43:40 GMT
Hollywood movie crap! A properly polished Katana will shed blood or watter, but the Euros will not, In the old days the sword would be carried out of the scabbard until it could be cleaned, it would not under any circumstance be sheathed bloody, the scabbard would be ruined!! And that was something that could not happen if ya didn't want to spend lots of money to have a new one made....SanMarc.
And some staining would happen, Adds patina... :roll:
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Post by Elheru Aran on Feb 7, 2011 15:08:50 GMT
Did it happen? Probably. Often? We don't know, but all signs point to "probably not so much". Why not? Back when swords were a practical weapon, most people had a general idea of how to take care of edged weapons-- keep them oiled, keep them clean, don't let the scabbard get wet, etc. For an example, in one of... Ed Fowler's, I think, knife books, he comments on how his grandmother had this old kitchen knife, carbon steel, that she'd had forever. Never washed it beyond rinsing it off and then a little fat on the blade; he still had the knife, I think. That's the kind of thing people would know how to do because they didn't have the money to afford buying new blades like we do now.
That's something that a lot of people, I think, don't really get-- just how rare it was back in the day to buy replacements. They'd use a kitchen knife until it was worn down to a sliver... and then use that sliver to peel potatoes or something after they got a new knife. Doesn't go just for weapons-- could go for, well, pretty much anything made by a craftsman as opposed to something that a person could knock out at home. This held true pretty much throughout history up until very recently with the Industrial Revolution, when mass production became a reality and different materials became widely available (stainless, for example). Taking care of their goods was far more of a priority than it is today. Kind of a shame it isn't still that way...
That said, I do agree that oftentimes there was probably not much time for more than a cursory wipe-down of the blade before sliding it into the scabbard. Just depended on the circumstances. A baron after a formal duel might have handed his sword to one of his retainers, who would've cleaned it up properly-- but the same baron, in the middle of, say, Crecy or Agincourt, probably would've kept his sword out and ready to use. In some circumstances you just don't put your sword away until the noise stops... and when the noise stops, either you don't need your sword anymore (dead/incapacitated/prisoner) or you've got all the time in the world to take proper care of the blade. Or to hunt up a living footman to take care of it for you, of course...
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Greg
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Post by Greg on Feb 7, 2011 16:44:03 GMT
[sarcasm] No, you see, blood is a natural barrier between carbon steel and oxygen. The iron in the blood will attract all the oxidation which will keep the steel clean and safe. [/sarcasm]
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Post by Curgan on Feb 7, 2011 19:36:18 GMT
My copliments Elheru for the excellent post. You captured my thoughts...
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Post by paulrward on Feb 8, 2011 3:42:00 GMT
Hello All; If you have a bloody sword, and it is time to sheath it, you simply wipe it off in the hairy scalp of your opponent ( who is in no position to object ) and then, after giving it a final polish on your silk handkerchief, return it to the scabbard. This way it will not rust, you will not contaminate the scabbard, and there is no way it wil get stuck or frozen in the scabbard, which, if a quick draw is necessary, could be embarrassing.
My goodness, I cannot believe that we are actually discussing the use of a sword as a weapon !
Respectfully;
Paul R. Ward
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Post by chrisperoni on Feb 8, 2011 4:12:08 GMT
LOL
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Post by Student of Sword on Feb 8, 2011 4:22:40 GMT
The motion in JSA is called "chiburi", different school does it differently. What you saw is unique to Katori Shinto Ryu. Most common one is a big circular motion with sudden stop. However, there are well respected iaidoka who have said that the motion does not work, rather it is a symbolic ritual reminding the practitioner that he is practicing a lethal art. Only wiping the blade with a cloth would remove all the blood.
If I was in a fight and it is over, I would take my time and wiped down my blade with a cloth before re-sheathing. Soldiers today clean their rifle at every chance, soldiers of yesteryear probably took good care of his equipments as well.
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avery
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Post by avery on Feb 8, 2011 4:24:09 GMT
Excellent point....though sometimes when I stick my sword in clean and it comes out bloody, I just stick it back in again.....I can't afford a new one and it really only happens about once a month.
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SanMarc
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Post by SanMarc on Feb 8, 2011 16:03:55 GMT
And some staining would happen, Adds patina... :roll:
Excellent point....though sometimes when I stick my sword in clean and it comes out bloody, I just stick it back in again.....I can't afford a new one and it really only happens about once a month.[/quote]
:roll:
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Post by MuerteBlack on Feb 10, 2011 3:15:16 GMT
*facepalm*
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