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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2007 17:55:19 GMT
Hi to everyone , can anyone tell me ( if someone owns them ) the quality of the Messer and the GreatSword of Cold Steel ,, I know that in their tests videos they're awesomes and amazings, but I want to know if they really are the cutting tools that shows.
And one more... in Kultofathena website says that the great sword comes unsharpened , when in all the websites sells it as sharpened ... so anyone can tell me what's happend?
Well guys ,,your replies will help me a lot ,
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Post by rammstein on May 12, 2007 17:59:55 GMT
Well, the messer has gotten good reviews and bad reviews. Some say that it handles well and cuts like a dream. But there have not been a shortage of instances where the pommel has completely broken off leaving the weiler holding a useless sword.
The great sword is great but honestly, anything that size, regardless of whther it's a historical antique or not, is bound to be clumsy. These were not made for wonderful handling, they were made to literally beat aside pike formations. As such, they will have a huge amount of heft and will almost certainly feel like lead in your hands.
editted for butchering the english language
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2007 18:08:55 GMT
OK . thanks for your reply Rammstein ! , I know the same things about the messer , but it's nice hear a second opinion !!
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Post by Deleted on May 15, 2007 5:33:45 GMT
yes rammstein's right (listen to me, history semprini, verifying rammstein sheesh! ;D ) the greatswords were used to smash and break thick and sturdy pike dowels, so they would appear to have the heft of a sledgehammer. However, I've handled the cold steel greatsword and its not all that cumbersome as one would expect, I must say.
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Post by rammstein on May 16, 2007 2:21:15 GMT
Well, it still is a sword and still has the dinamics of one, however it is far from a standard longsword in that it is slower and meant for a different purpose. It needs the heft behind it in order to be effective. So while it's not a crowbar, it's not a rapier either, so don't expect speed to come in the package of the zweihander
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Post by randomnobody on May 16, 2007 3:50:07 GMT
I've thought about each of these swords, myself. I'm not particularly fond of Cold Steel overall, though I'll admit they have a few fine bits. I can't find myself fitting their prices, though. Luckily True Swords has some awesome deals on Cold Steel stuff, so I'm finding myself back in the market.
I really do wish I could grasp the aesthetics of Cold Steel's (and most others in this class) Great Sword. I'd love a blade that purely massive, but hesitate at the less-than-attractive blade Cold Steel exhibits. It...bores me, frankly. Also, though I understand their function, and appreciate their purpose, I just can't get into the...secondary guard...thing. I have completely forgotten the term.
Ditto on most points to the Grosse Messer. To me, when it comes to swords, big IS beautiful. Heavy is okay~ I'll learn to make it do what I want with enough practice. BUT, with regard to the Grosse Messer, the mixed reviews and overall construction of the hilt keep me at bay. I'm sure it's a fine blade, and I do like the bluing, but that handle's got to do something else.
Of course, with the low pricing found at True Swords, I might not be too upset with them. Worst case scenario, at least I won't have paid out the @$$. Note the $$, added not only as silly censorship (which I don't typically do, but being new here and all...), but thrown in as a subtle hint to my key point. I just don't have that kind of $$.
Though if the only "complaint" most of you seem to have is "big and heavy," I don't see why I couldn't justify purchasing (at reduced cost) the Great Sword. I DO rather like everything below the silly-looking crescents
Realizing now that my rant is rather off-topic in this particular thread, I'm going to note that "sharp" truly is a relative term, open to interpretation. As far as swords this size are concerned, they won't have what some would consider a "sharp" edge. Force alone should be sufficient to drive that thing through. I've, of course, no personal experience with either, this is merely offered as speculation. Perhaps Kult of Athena (which I've bought from before) has simply decided to call the sword "unsharpened" to avoid people receiving what is, in fact, a perfectly suitable edge from complaining, "hey, this thing isn't sharp at all!"
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Post by rammstein on May 16, 2007 23:55:30 GMT
Randomnobody, I'd like to point out that these "lugs" as they are called (the secondary guard) are not only historically accurate, but are a HUGE aid to the user in many ways other than absurd aesthetics. As you're probably aware, the ricasso is grippable allowing two different points of leverage that are farther apart than normal giving substantially more control to the sword. However, this isn't very safe without lugs, although it can still be done. The lugs act as a sort of extra gaurd to prevent the user who is utilizating the ricasso from losing a hand. As to wether or not the look cool, that would not be a high priority in my mind when buying a sword, although it is certainly present when making a decision. I value functionality and practicality over mere looks, so if it works, looks mildly cool/interesting, I'm down for it . But "zweihanders" aren't really anything I'm interested in owning. Something else: Take a look at some of vladimir cervenka's grea swords. I seem to remember one a bit like this without the crossgaurds and substantially more elegant looking.
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Post by randomnobody on May 17, 2007 0:32:19 GMT
I believe I did note and affirm their function. I agree this type of sword benefits greatly from them. I just wish they could find a happier medium between the gaudy crescents exhibited in this model. I'll be looking into Vladimir Cervenka, as I do hold a level of interest for great swords, and would love to find one that happens to fit my own aesthetics, without sacrificing the all-important functionality of the sword.
Primarily, I can't see a need for them myself, as I would prefer to simply heft the thing by the hilt, without worrying about the complicated (for a person as uncoordinated as myself) techniques that would come with shifting grip to this level. I've attempted similar things with my hanwei marshall, which is dull for the first 8-10 inches of blade, and I'll likely be keeping it this way for just this purpose, but really it's tough to gauge what a much larger, heavier sword would handle like in this awkard position. Guess it's time to read up a bit.
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Post by rammstein on May 17, 2007 0:39:26 GMT
My mistake, I noticed you said this, but I had no way of knowing if you knew that tidbit or not, in my own self defense Vladimir cervenka is an excellent maker, but I think his peices are a bit outside of our price range. He has gooten great reviews from the folks are myarmoury, which says quite a lot about the quality of his craftsmanship.
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Post by rammstein on May 17, 2007 0:44:26 GMT
www.sword.cz/swords.htmbottom of this page. The two handed sword has those lugs, but they appear to be much more withdrawn than the cold steel version and not as overly gaudy. Plus, the entire blade looks very professional with a flair of elegence to it. If not, take a look at 3rd and 4th from the bottom, both of which seem similar to the two handed sword without the ricasso or the lugs.
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Post by randomnobody on May 17, 2007 0:55:58 GMT
Certianly some very fine, and attractive swords, there. Somehow, those two fit me a lot better than Cold Steel's. Well, except the flamberge. Even in that case, it's merely a preference for a good ol' fashioned straight blade.
If I could swap the hilts, I'd be a happy man. Prefering simple to extravagant as I do, I'm afraid the simpler of those two is just a pinch TOO simple. It needs a bit more...more. Unless it's just a perspective thing, it looks so thin, almost frail to me. Then again, most swords in this category appear about the same, so 1) obviously frail is no concern 2) maybe I'm just misjudging something.
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2007 2:38:45 GMT
Hi to everyone , thanks for your replies , I was looking in the web for sites with landsknecht's swords , I found a spanish site and check the guard of the two handed sword it's in "S " shape , I mean in the renaissance period the two handed sword can be in "S " shape??? check the pic in the link .. And by the way ..I don't know the manufacturer but it says that it's czech .. www.outfit4events.com/montante-gotico-p-1875.html?currency=USD&language=en&number_of_uploads=0what do you think??
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Post by rammstein on May 23, 2007 2:47:50 GMT
Mordrent I'd be a little wary about it if only because of the price...that's quite a lot to infest without having any information about the people selling it or the quality of the sword. That said, there are several amazing czech sellers. In fact, next to America, I think the Czechs have it the best in terms of sword manufacturing. Check out vladimir cervenka (the link above) or even lutel www.lutel.cz/. Both are amazingly fine companies. I'm not sure about the price conversion, but I think it's a bit out of our $300 range. Still, they are cheaper than the $600 zweihander you posted, and I can garuntee excellent prodcuts from these two companies. Your choice thouggh. The only thing that would stop me from ordering from these guys is the wait it takes to make and the overseas shipping. But since you're over in Europe you should have it good
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2007 15:56:19 GMT
Hold your horses from Lutel for time being; I ordered a katzbalger from them end-Mar.. & once I take delivery of that, I'll come up with a review of the sword & my ordering exeperience; so if you're not too in a hurry to purchase, perhaps you'll like to read abt my review first before you make your decision. Incidentally, I'm also attracted by several of the pieces in www.sword.cz, but so far did not hear any first-hand sharing abt them so do not dare try them.... yet; besides, I'm also kinda 'drained' after putting up the order to Lutel... sigh
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2007 17:34:27 GMT
OK Rammstein , I know that this sword I posted it's expensive , just am wonder about the guard and yeah I don't know anything about those guys hehehe ..and well as you said , it's just that I've never seen a zweihander with a guard like that , by the way thanks for the links ... there's a few interesting swords here .. If I got the chance of buy it , I'll post my review or spects...
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Post by rammstein on May 23, 2007 19:28:28 GMT
I don't think I've seen a zweihander with an s shaped hilt, but I wouldn't be suprised if it existed nonetheless. When I think of hilts like these I think of german and northern italian designs, so it's quite possible that several did exist.
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2007 19:50:51 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2007 23:36:04 GMT
I went to a ren fair last weekend and a guy their had that flamberg style of greatsword and man was it huge! It looked like it could chop a door in half. I also stopped at a stand selling a wooden greatsword from a company called new stirling arms and man it was wonderful it had all the features of a real greatsword and the whole thing was actually balanced
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Post by rammstein on May 23, 2007 23:51:54 GMT
According to Adam, new stirling arms is the way to go in training swords. I've only handled purpleheart's waster's and I thought they were fantastic, but adam says that NSA beets them so they must be good
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