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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2008 21:29:23 GMT
A branch off of the Kris Cutlery Medieval sword thread. I'm in the process of making a scabbard, and am having trouble carving out the inside. Tips? Oh, and Ramm is making a scabbard in woodworking class. Lucky!!! I wish I had taken woodworking. I'm regretting it now.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2008 21:33:26 GMT
There's plenty of threads on scabbard making, but this site has some good recommendations, and cross section images... plus, its a quick read ;D www.knives.com/saya.html
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2008 21:35:21 GMT
Yeah, my chisel doesn't want to work. Maybe it isn't sharp enough, though I did sharpen it. I'm just not good with it I guess.
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Post by themaster293 on Jan 29, 2008 21:35:36 GMT
Use a dremel.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2008 21:38:29 GMT
Alright. To paraphrase the statement in the other thread.
I have tried dremels, grinding bits in a drill, chisels, etc. I have thought about using a router, but I can't find any bits that are shallow enough. (The wood slats are slightly more then 1/8th of an inch)
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2008 22:19:17 GMT
So, to paraphrase all of the other stuff you are doing, you currently have two slabs of 1/4" wood, and are trying to make a scabbard out of them? I have a feeling it will end up being decently thick (aka. too thick) unless you are shaving lots of it from all sides.. Most of what I have seen involves 1/8" wood. From what I have read, and attempting to do, there are two ways to go about it. One is to take 4 slabs of wood, and slowly shave them until they line up with each other in the correct diamond profile. Can be difficult to do, definately leave some extra. The other option is to slowly take off material from the outside and inside, until the sword fits. If you are having trouble with dremels/grinding bits/etc, I suggest you move to something more basic. Try looking at hardware and specialty stores for wood chisels to carve out a U or V shaped valley in the wood. Practice on hardwood that you really dont care about. The outside of the wood can be shaped with a drawknife. Sandpaper is a really hardcore way to slowly remove the wood. Remember, multiple shallow passes are much better than one deep pass. Hold the chisel so it barely bites into the wood at all. What you remove should resemble whittling.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2008 23:08:35 GMT
I just checked, and I was mistaken about the thickness of the wood. It is indeed two slats of 1/8 " poplar.
I do agree that I should probably pick up a decent chisel. Mine either takes off next to nothing, or likes to gouge the wood.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2008 0:28:33 GMT
If you have a power drill -prefferably corded as you will run out of batteries, and a clamp or vice, you can get rotary rasp bits for your drill that will make short work of the wood. www.hobbytool.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=388I tried a dremel with sanding discs on my first and it took forever, and yeah, working on a scabbard with a chisel is a pain.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2008 0:35:50 GMT
Now that's a good idea! Pretty cheap too.
I guess the first type of rassp would work the best, since it would be difficult to get the flat of the rasp against the centre of the wood slat.
Thanks Maz!
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Post by Jeff K. ( Jak) on Jan 30, 2008 1:36:04 GMT
i would draw the out line of the blade on your wood, score along your line with a razor knife, and start at the end of your piece of wood(where the throat will be) with your chisel. Most routers have an adjustable guard, and you can set your bit deep in the chuck, but you've probably already tried that. Drill in vice method sound good to but for finicky work that has to be a perfect fit, i prefer hand tools to power tools 'cause you can "feel" what your doing better, sometimes power tools can get away from you (freehanding routers are bad for that without a guide).
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Post by Brendan Olszowy on Jan 30, 2008 5:48:13 GMT
I dunno anything about routers, but I've seen images of Christian Fletcher doing them with a belt sander, and thats what I use to shape my grips and a whole lot of other things.
I use a small fine chisel for chanelling my grip slots by hand (no hammer). It could be doen with a chisel. Just be sure to work the grain uphill. I'e. as you push the chisel and the chip lifts it comes off the top, rather than working in deeper.
I reckon a belt sander would make very short work of it.
Keep us posted on any projects.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2008 18:17:44 GMT
It would probably help if I mentioned the right thing. Was thinking of a wood gouge earlier, instead of a chisel. It allows you to take out more of a bowl shape than a flat line.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2008 23:34:29 GMT
I've done all my scabbard work with a chisel, and never had any trouble.
What side are you placing down? If you're taking off too much, I have a feeling your putting the flat side down. The bevel side down will allow you to take long, thin layers off.
In case you're having border troubles, I mark off the line with pencil, then chisel all around it straight down. This prevents any accidental destruction of the perimeter. Sounds obvious to me, but never know.
Also, 1/8" slats are a little thin to securely work with, or so I've found. I tend to use 1/4-1/2" thick poplar board, then rasp down the extra meat after the 2 halves are glued together. It's a lot of waste, but the thickness is needed since I have to place the board in a vise during chiseling.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 2, 2008 7:03:42 GMT
I would agree go with 1/4 in and work your way down. nothing is worse than spending a lot of time on something only to have it split when you're almost at the finish line.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 2, 2008 7:54:57 GMT
Remember, power tools can get away from you . Don't get me wrong, I use power tools everyday they're great for building houses with. Unless you really know how or are shown how to use them, you may end up doing more harm than good. When I learnt we had to start by doing all our jobs with hand tools, it teaches you more and you get a more personally satisfied end product I think. Especially if it is something as articulate as sword construction.
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Post by Dan Davis on Feb 3, 2008 12:26:27 GMT
I assume you are working on a medieval blade? - coat your blade in paste wax
- wrap your blade in two layers of saran wrap
- cut your wood slats to approximately the size of your blade
- soak your wood in the bathtub in HOT water until it is flexible
- warp the wood around the blade and clamp in place (large metal binder clips work spiffy well for this)
- leave the whole thing alone until it dries out
- unclamp the wood, glue with carpenter's glue (NOT GORILLA GLUE!!!!) and reclamp
- leave the whole thing alone until it dries out
- remove your blade, unwrap, clean and oil
- clean and oil again in two hours
- trim and sand the scabbard to it's final shape
- finish it as you will
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Post by Deleted on Feb 4, 2008 0:56:44 GMT
Speaking of glue...
USE ELMER'S WOOD-GLUE.
Gorilla glue is crap, and Titebond causes serious rust even after it's completely dry.
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Post by Brendan Olszowy on Feb 4, 2008 6:47:01 GMT
That sounds too easy Dan, is that the trick? I might try that, a few Qu's: *What types of wood do you recommend? *What thickness of slat do you recommend? *Drying - is this best done in the sun or under shelter over days? Its 35 C here everyday and I could dry it in about 20 minutes lol. *Would you want to flatten off the corners so they meet when bent, so there is some surface area to glue together. *Speaking of glue, is epoxy suitable? *Chapes: How the hell do you make one, or do you use leather?
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Post by Dan Davis on Feb 4, 2008 11:04:33 GMT
I was asked if my technique for wood scabbards would work on a tang. Here is my answer FYI:
Warping will not work well with a tang because of the shape. A blade is long and thin, so it's width in regard to thickness is very low.
The tang has a very thick and boxy cross-section, so warping will not work as well and would result in a loose, ill-fitting grip (which is why you are replacing the current one). I recommend using a square file (or several in different sizes) and slowly file a channel into the wood.
If at all possible get a thicker piece of wood and file the entire recess into one side of the core, then simply glue the other piece on as a cover.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 4, 2008 11:17:22 GMT
Dan that sounds like fantastic advice! When I finally decide on what type of western sword I want (if it's without a scabbard) I'll definitely put it to good use.
Do you find that the swelling of the wood and subsequent shrinkage makes the fit a bit loose or does it dry nice and snugly?
Cheers
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